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Old 12-05-2011, 09:23 PM   #76
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Originally Posted by MLU View Post
I don't have the numbers, that season Penn State was a very senior-heavy team. The following season the team looked and played a lot differently. Two years later and it's a different team altogether.
You're probably right.

Still, if some are going to say Penn State doesn't count this year presumably because of their easy schedule to get to 9-3, I think you'd have to say the same thing about OSU's win over KSU, who's record was a complete mirage as well.
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Old 12-05-2011, 09:24 PM   #77
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Originally Posted by BoNcHiE View Post
Why does Penn State not "count" this year yet they are a program that beat LSU less then a year ago? Obviously, a lot of those players are still there.
they beat LSU two years ago on an absolutely pathetic excuse for a football field. the speed advantage was negated due to the conditions. besides.. that penn state team is not the same as the one this year and the LSU team that year was nowhere close to the LSU team this year. so again.. what does penn state two years ago have to do with right now? and why does a certain game against LSU carry any relevance in a case talking about alabama?
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Old 12-05-2011, 09:25 PM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Optimus Walken View Post
they beat LSU two years ago on an absolutely pathetic excuse for a football field. the speed advantage was negated due to the conditions. besides.. that penn state team is not the same as the one this year and the LSU team that year was nowhere close to the LSU team this year. so again.. what does penn state two years ago have to do with right now? and why does a certain game against LSU carry any relevance in a case talking about alabama?
Did you completely miss the post I was responding to?

Maybe you should of paid attention to that.
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Old 12-05-2011, 09:33 PM   #79
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Originally Posted by BoNcHiE View Post
Did you completely miss the post I was responding to?

Maybe you should of paid attention to that.
you tried to boost the merit of alabama's win over penn state this year by bringing up a game that happened two years ago and implying that it's still a very similar team. that's horrible logic and that's what i was replying to. is there anything else i need to make clear for you?
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Old 12-05-2011, 09:56 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Optimus Walken View Post
you tried to boost the merit of alabama's win over penn state this year by bringing up a game that happened two years ago and implying that it's still a very similar team. that's horrible logic and that's what i was replying to. is there anything else i need to make clear for you?
Well, that team that beat LSU was what? 9-3? 10-2? Something like that. This year's is 9-3. What's the huge difference that makes them not count this year as a good win? I realize the excuses about the field apply here but PSU still plays in the Big 10 just like they did that year.

Regardless, that was an afterthought one liner after the main point of my post that had nothing to do with LSU nor mentioned them.

PSU isn't a garbage program and is no less of a win then OSU's win over KSU.

The entire discussion was started by the fact that someone basically said the PSU win wasn't a good win. Of course it was a good win.
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Old 12-05-2011, 09:56 PM   #81
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I'm surprised UGA isn't complaining a lot, they got told in 07 they couldn't be considered because they didn't win their conference even though many had them as the 2nd best team in the country.
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Old 12-05-2011, 10:03 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by Firecross View Post
I'm surprised UGA isn't complaining a lot, they got told in 07 they couldn't be considered because they didn't win their conference even though many had them as the 2nd best team in the country.
Eh, they were competing for a spot against a team with the same record that DID win the conference, played an extra more than them and eventually won the national championship.

Alabama is also the only 1-loss team in the country where their loss came in OT to the #1 team in the country. LSU has blown out EVERY single other team they've played this year and they've pretty much waxed as much of the top 25 this year as possible.

What's to complain about?
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Old 12-05-2011, 10:06 PM   #83
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Originally Posted by VDK View Post



This how it's been done in college football since, uh, forever.






oh, the 'that's the way it's always been done' argument.. Ok, then that makes it totally fine.


if college football isn't careful, the purists and traditionalists who have to be dragged kicking and screaming into the future will ruin it, like with baseball.
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Old 12-05-2011, 10:35 PM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BoNcHiE View Post
Well, that team that beat LSU was what? 9-3? 10-2? Something like that. This year's is 9-3. What's the huge difference that makes them not count this year as a good win? I realize the excuses about the field apply here but PSU still plays in the Big 10 just like they did that year.

Regardless, that was an afterthought one liner after the main point of my post that had nothing to do with LSU nor mentioned them.

PSU isn't a garbage program and is no less of a win then OSU's win over KSU.

The entire discussion was started by the fact that someone basically said the PSU win wasn't a good win. Of course it was a good win.
They are 9-3 this year with no wins over a ranked opponent. Kansas State is 10-2 having beat 2 ranked opponents. They are absolutely not a quality win this year. If you would like to discuss the historical significance of them beating a mediocre LSU team 2 years ago then feel free, but it is completely irrelevant to this year.

And for the record, I didn't basically say anything. I flat out stated it. Very clearly. I will do it again.

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Arkansas is a good win for Bama that I overlooked. Penn State is not a good win. You might as well claim Auburn and Texas A&M as good wins for the respective schools if you want to count Penn State.
Penn State is not a good win this year. I don't give two ***** if they have been great in the past. This year they are a middling team that does not count as a quality win.
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Old 12-05-2011, 10:54 PM   #85
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Wow! Unbelievably classless Ala fan:

Alabama Fan Post Controversial Photos Using Oklahoma Tragedies - News9.com - Oklahoma City, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports |

To me this is no better than those idiot Chicago fans or for that matter anyone making Katrina jokes.
That's disgusting and I can't believe any Bama fan would do that after April 27th.
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Old 12-05-2011, 10:56 PM   #86
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Quote:
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They are 9-3 this year with no wins over a ranked opponent. Kansas State is 10-2 having beat 2 ranked opponents. They are absolutely not a quality win this year. If you would like to discuss the historical significance of them beating a mediocre LSU team 2 years ago then feel free, but it is completely irrelevant to this year.

And for the record, I didn't basically say anything. I flat out stated it. Very clearly. I will do it again.
Well aren't you a ******?

KSU beat Baylor by one point early in the year. That's their signature win. What a powerhouse. KSU is not a great win either.

Quote:
Penn State is not a good win this year. I don't give two ***** if they have been great in the past. This year they are a middling team that does not count as a quality win.
A team that goes 9-3 in a major conference is a good win no matter how much you want to diminish it.

And even if it's not, it still doesn't matter. The voters took the team with the "best" loss over trying to parse regular season wins.

Bama dominated every game this year except the LSU loss. Give Bama OSU's schedule and any objective observer would say they'd walk right through it as well. Actually, they'd be undefeated right now. The idea that Bama isn't proven compared to OSU because OSU beat one more ranked team is laughable.

It came down to the loss and OSU's was worse.

OSU's schedule wasn't some gauntlet either. Their one good win was against OU, a team that had gotten shredded by every high power spread team they played this year. Hell, give them KSU. That's two. I'm not giving them 7-5 Texas as a good win.
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Old 12-05-2011, 11:11 PM   #87
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You're probably right.

Still, if some are going to say Penn State doesn't count this year presumably because of their easy schedule to get to 9-3, I think you'd have to say the same thing about OSU's win over KSU, who's record was a complete mirage as well.
KSU actually has some solid wins over UT, A&M, Baylor, Mizzou and TTU. None of those are world-beaters, but Penn State failed to win a single game as worthy as any of those. Their signature win is a draw between 6-6 tOSU and 6-6 Illinois and they were lucky to pull those out.

KSU had a pretty solid season in the toughest rated conference this year.
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Old 12-06-2011, 10:36 AM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Blue Sky View Post
good post, and it brings to mind a question i've asked several times in the past and have yet to receive a thoughtful answer to: Why does anyone gives two ****s about the SEC?? I am an LSU fan, actually attended the school unlike a lot of fans, and have never been able to figure out the whole Conference love thing.. Maybe it's because i've been a Saints fan longer than i've been an LSU fan, but i can't imagine pulling for the Falcons or Bucs simply because they are in the NFC South.. The only response i ever get to that question is that "it's just different"-- i'm sorry, but that's not a good enough answer.
Here is my stab at why we should care about the way the SEC is perceived.

First the comparison to the NFL is not applicable here. They have a tournament to decide a champion. Relative strength of your division carries no weight.

The reason it matters is this: To win a championship in Div-1 college football, you basically have to be voted by humans to get the chance to win it all, if you've had a good enough season. Therefore, your school's chances of being voted into the game, over a comparative team in another conference, are greatly enhanced by the perception of your conference's relative strength versus that of the other conferences in the voters minds'.

In other words, when in doubt, the voters will, by and large, go with the team in the perceived "tougher conference". So when your team has that great year and wants to play for the MNC, it helps if your conference is greatly respected. Even more so if its respected as "the best".

And frankly, the SEC has earned that respect on the field. I'll take it.

That's my take on it anyway.
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Old 12-06-2011, 10:45 AM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MLU View Post
KSU actually has some solid wins over UT, A&M, Baylor, Mizzou and TTU. None of those are world-beaters, but Penn State failed to win a single game as worthy as any of those. Their signature win is a draw between 6-6 tOSU and 6-6 Illinois and they were lucky to pull those out.

KSU had a pretty solid season in the toughest rated conference this year.
Given that, then you'd have to say MSU and Vanderbilt are good wins (6-6 SEC teams). I'm not sure they are and I'm an MSU fan (curse you Dan Mullen).

Baylor is the one that impresses me.

But, like I said. Give them KSU. It's not worth continuing the argument.

It's still so close that they went with the worse loss. Had Bama played some close games outside of their loss at LSU I think it may of swayed voters but the mindset appeared to be that they dominated everyone in their 11 wins and you could of put a few more ranked teams on there and gotten the same outcome.

With the way Bama played in their 11 wins against an SEC schedule, albeit an easier SEC schedule then usual, I don't think you can really make the case that OSU proved more because they beat 7-5 Texas, giving them one more ranked win. Auburn is 7-5 as well. This isn't a Boise State schedule we are debating here.

At any rate, it's decided and I'm looking forward to a hell of game vs. LSU skull dragging OSU's garbage defense around the field.
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Old 12-06-2011, 11:19 AM   #90
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Are you serious? Its a winner take all game for one. Alabama is the underdog for two. And frankly have you ever heard how much pressure the Patriots players felt when they were 18-0 to finish the season undefeated? Its intoxicating they said.

The pressure is equal my friend. Don't buy into that hype that Alabama has something more to prove any more then LSU does.
Not buying any undefeated "pressure." It is a relatively common occurence in college football. Hell, Auburn just did it last year.

Barring a romp at the hands of Alabama in a little more than a month from now, LSU has likely already earned a "split" of the national championship before they even play the game.
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