Hicks

[drbleedgold]

Originally Posted by Chad1886

Played against him. not head up. im a FB played for Univ. of Manitoba
RAAAAW. Big strong powerful. Stands up straight right away. not fast. Zero pass rushing moves (besides bull rush). Didnt take over a game as much as youd think he would. And the CIS is not an elite level at all.
When i heard this pick. i have never been more disappointed in a draft.
He has a lot of work ahead of him before he sees that field.
Alameda Ta'amu was there Brandon Thompson was there. Boykins. the list goes on...
Heres to hoping the rest of our draft turns around!

Do you think with good coaching, that he has potential? He sure has the size.

[lsusurfer]

Chad, appreciate the feedback. Just understand that all of us are on the edge with nightmare scenario type problems hitting the Saints this offseason, so most fans can't take even one more little piece of bad news, like a bad pick. So next time try a compliment sandwich and hopefully won't be so negative, lol. Something good, the bad, then finish with the good.

[JackDiesel]

Originally Posted by Zack Lee

not in very high contrast to what they usually say about their picks is it? I am excited about the kid in the long run but I don't get all the red thumbs for the OP. Thank you Chad, I guess you scratched up some peoples rose colored glasses though. That is what makes our evaluators great though. If he had knocked them dead every outing in College he would not have been there for us to pick.

Well they are always excited by our picks and should be. But in a draft where we had few picks we needed to make them count. And this just wasn't a guy on the list, this was OUR guy. If he wasn't there we would have traded back. Listening to the amount of predraft work they did on this one prospect tells me this is Spags version of Jimmy Graham.

And I respect the OP's opinion, I didn't red thumb him or anything. I'm sure he played him and honestly the people pulling up all the info and stats about him is kinda ridiculous. I just have faith in our scouting staffs and Spags ability as a coach. If this were GW still I would be slightly worried but this is Steve Spagnuleaux, he ***** great defensive linemen.

One thing about the OP's observation. He played him in 2010 but not 2011. After coming from JUCO Hicks was probably everything he said. But he has obviously shown improvement which means he's coachable and dedicated. Never bet against anyone that has taken the hard way to achieve their dream.

[Eman5805]

Originally Posted by Mashburn falcon

Mayock's take: "He couldn't play at LSU, went back to Canada, and he dominates at every level. He's huge and is stout at the point."

and before you say for me to finish reading the rest of the quote. all I have to say is.....oh Canada.

However, that wasn't for football related reasons if I understand it right.

[birdog]

To the OP, Chad....

I really don't mind your dissenting view on A Hicks....as a matter of fact, I welcome it. But you have to understand some of the Saints fans harsh reaction to your view. These Saints fans see that the Saints draft gurus put together their draft board well in advance of the draft, and they slotted all the players according to their talents. They seen A Hicks as the #89th player on their board, and when the real draft came to #89, their top talent was still there. So it was a consensus pick. heck, Joe Vitt said that if Hicks wasn't there at #89, they would have traded down.

So in light of this development, you are setting yourself against their consensus oppinion, when you're questioning their expertise, by saying there were "other" players still available at that slot. This is the main reason for the harsh reaction from the Saints faithful......they see you as someone who might be thinking that these Saints draft gurus have no clue what they're doing.I would not be as ready to dismiss all the criticism from the fans....after all, they like what the Saints draft experts are doing, considering their track record.

As for the talents of A Hicks.....he is raw, everybody said that.....but who heard of Jahri Evans before the Saints drafted him?....or M Colston?....I'm pretty sure there were plenty of doubters then too. Yet those players did pretty good, don't you think?

I give the Saints draft experts the benefit of doubt....let's see if Hicks pans out....he could be a starter in the NFL, if wants to be...or be like Al Woods...a bust. Time will tell.

[GeauxldnGurl]

Originally Posted by Mashburn falcon

Mayock's take: "He couldn't play at LSU, went back to Canada, and he dominates at every level. He's huge and is stout at the point."

and before you say for me to finish reading the rest of the quote. all I have to say is.....oh Canada.

Oh look, here you are in this thread failing in an even larger font.

[Jason]

Originally Posted by Chad1886

Played against him. not head up. im a FB played for Univ. of Manitoba
RAAAAW. Big strong powerful. Stands up straight right away. not fast. Zero pass rushing moves (besides bull rush). Didnt take over a game as much as youd think he would. And the CIS is not an elite level at all.
When i heard this pick. i have never been more disappointed in a draft.
He has a lot of work ahead of him before he sees that field.
Alameda Ta'amu was there Brandon Thompson was there. Boykins. the list goes on...
Heres to hoping the rest of our draft turns around!

The Saints have a caliber of coach lightyears beyond Regina coaches so I have faith that they will indeed coach Hicks into the monster he would have been had he been able to stay at LSU. That is the main thing everyone is looking at here. If he had been able to attend LSU, once again who have coaches far superior to Regina, we could have been talking about him going in the first round. He did the best he could with the little resources he had. Now, it is time to welcome him into the fold and watch him flourish.

Who Dat.

[outvoted]

There is absolutely no reason to be bashing Chad for posting first hand experience AND his opinion of a THIRD ROUND draft pick, and those that are having a coronary should lay off the coffee!!!!

Let us all take a break, step back for a moment and think of past drafts........

Where, as in which rounds, have most of the "busts" come from?? ALL OVER THE PLACE!!!

Which rounds have the studs come from?? ALL OVER THE PLACE

Who thought Colston would be the kind of player he is?
Who thought that Sullivan was going to be that kind of bust?
Who had Nicks slotted as a Pro Bowler and one of the top 2 guards in the league?

Gems come from the bottom and busts come from the top, so yes, we all want our draft picks to pan out.
Blasting someone for disagreeing with the very "experts" you whine about during the offseason is extremely childish folks.

What happened to the "hope you have to come back and eat crow" responses?? Why is everyone so against a fellow Saints fan that thinks something other than the masses??
IT IS NOT PERSONAL AND ACTING LIKE IT MAKES YOU LOOK FOOLISH!!!!!!

IMHO

[Nemo]

While Chad's post is a unique and interesting point of view (can't recall ever seeing a post from someone who played against one of our draft picks), you've got to put what he's saying into perspective. Chad does not dispute that Hicks is a beast and does not dispute that he is a raw talent with lots of potential that will take time to develop. Actually seems consistent with the Saints' view of the player. I bet that some of the players who played against Jhari Evans or Marcus Colston might have had the same reaction if you had told them that the guy the were playing against at small school U would go on to be an ELITE NFL player - "yeah, right - that guy? he did not dominate or take over the game when I played against him, yada yada...." In some sense, whether Chad will admit it or not, the viewpoint is colored by a "sour grapes" mentality. I would be more worried about the situation if Chad were a former teammate of Hicks and said that the guy had poor work ethic or character.

Since Chad did not play against the other DTs who he is saying we should have picked instead, I don't see where he is really qualified to make the comparison about whether they or Hicks has the better NFL potential. I think the Saints scouts (who have shown they can be money in evaluating small school talent) and Spags (who knows a good DT when he sees one) who watched the guy play (on tape and in person) are better qualified. If playing against a player a time or two made you an expert talent evaluator, guys like Chad would be working as NFL talent scouts, not posting on SR.

That said, Chad is entitled to his opinion and we should take his views into account. Seems to support the likelihood (Hicks needs a lot of work on technique) in setting our expectations for the timetable on him having impact. To my understanding, DT is a tough position to handle right out of the gate, so we should only expect him to make modest contributions in year one. I think years two and three will be the judge of whether the Saints made a wise investment yesterday.

[Ti Rider]

Originally Posted by Mashburn falcon

Mayock's take: "He couldn't play at LSU, went back to Canada, and he dominates at every level. He's huge and is stout at the point."

and before you say for me to finish reading the rest of the quote. all I have to say is.....oh Canada.

It's a shame the kid never got to show what he could do against better competition say like the East-West Shrine game, oh wait.......

It's also too bad that Mayock is convinced the kid completely lacks upside and barely talked about him, oh wait........

Shame the Saints don't have a new DC who is an expert at finding DL and built the current SB champs
DL, oh wait.....

How much did Mayock say about the Falcons third round pick?

[tomdda]

Originally Posted by Mashburn falcon

Mayock's take: "He couldn't play at LSU, went back to Canada, and he dominates at every level. He's huge and is stout at the point."

and before you say for me to finish reading the rest of the quote. all I have to say is.....oh Canada.

Let's see.......couldn't.......didn't. Couldn't.....didn't. Seems like 2 different words to me. Our scouting department finds players that win playoff games, does yours?

[new city champ]

Chad, thanks for the input. When you play against a guy twice a year, of course you develop a take on him and appreciate getting yours. It's a lot more information than anyone else around here has about Hicks.

A couple of points. The reports I've read about him indicate he had a pretty pedestrian first year at Regina when you played against him, but was much better his second year. Any thoughts on that?

Second, he obviously went up some draft boards based on his post-season play and practice at the Shrine game, where he dominated against elite college players. Sometimes when a guy is a big fish in a small pond (like Regina) he ends up getting so much attention from opposing squads that it's hard to get an accurate read on his ability. Then when he goes to an all star game and he's just another guy going one-on-one he can show more of his stuff. This is why some guys pop up at these post-season games.

Some folks have said they trust the Saints scouting department and I do to. But let's not be blind to history. We've done a great job drafting offensive guys in the middle or later rounds, not so much drafting defensive guys in the middle rounds. Several of our mid-round offensive picks have ended up being Pro-Bowlers, which is outstanding. Several of our mid-round defensive picks have ended up being cut or released from the squad and never making an impact, which is pretty poor drafting.

I hope Hicks is the guy that breaks this trend.

[Chad1886]

Originally Posted by drbleedgold

Do you think with good coaching, that he has potential? He sure has the size.

I do. From what i gathered from in his first year at Regina, of course we all talked about him before during and after playing him bc he was a monster from LSU. We gameplanned for him hard! but come halftime we felt we didnt need to. Didnt get to face him in his second year which he couldve devoloped more.
But what i did see what a slow first step, stood up straight, bull rush, powerful huge human being.
and i did get to see that because he also was put out at end where i would backside block him or double team w the tackle drive block.
I know all this from first hand, teammates, and film study.
Thanks for the positive posts guys!
In coaching careers i think they feel refreshed when they actually get to come in and mold a talent from nothing into something. i feel thats why Vitt and Spags love it bc they will actually have to roll up the sleeves and really help him along. He has a lot of work ahead. Hopin for the best.

[Zack Lee]

Originally Posted by JackDiesel

Well they are always excited by our picks and should be. But in a draft where we had few picks we needed to make them count. And this just wasn't a guy on the list, this was OUR guy. If he wasn't there we would have traded back. Listening to the amount of predraft work they did on this one prospect tells me this is Spags version of Jimmy Graham.

And I respect the OP's opinion, I didn't red thumb him or anything. I'm sure he played him and honestly the people pulling up all the info and stats about him is kinda ridiculous. I just have faith in our scouting staffs and Spags ability as a coach. If this were GW still I would be slightly worried but this is Steve Spagnuleaux, he ***** great defensive linemen.

One thing about the OP's observation. He played him in 2010 but not 2011. After coming from JUCO Hicks was probably everything he said. But he has obviously shown improvement which means he's coachable and dedicated. Never bet against anyone that has taken the hard way to achieve their dream.

I got you. I just was pointing out that offering that quote alone does not discredit anything the OP said. I would be shocked if they ever said that they did not get their guy or that nobody in the war room agreed. As a whole it is a given that every single year without fail, the average reaction to picks outside the first three rounds will be over-expectation. Not all of us, but that is just the nature of all the hoping we do at this time of year. There is a reason guys last to the third though and for me, I will hold off until I see him in camp and I will leave room to be pleasantly surprised by him. Thankfully, our present draft brain trust has left me pleasantly surprised almost exponentially more often than any previous regime.

[No2DC]

Curb the enthusiasm everybody! We have yet to find a gem on D in a while. Guys have flashed potential-- Junior, Tez-- but we have yet to find a Coltson or Jimmy caliber player after the 2nd round on D. Maybe Spags will be the difference, but the truth is that we struggle on the D side of the ball when it comes to mid to late picks.