I throw out the word idiot when someone must clearly be one misunderstanding such a critical plank in someone plan and than claiming you were his most faith full follower.
He never gave any impression that he planned to pull troops out of Afghanistan, immediately or not when running in 2008. It was key part of his foreign policy that he stressed early and often.
For someone who shows up today claiming to 'hang on his speeches like a schoolgirl'; to get something so mind boggling wrong either means you are being purposely dishonest or that you have that much trouble comprehending simple statements made repeatedly.
You don't get civil when making snide comments about the utterly stupid theory that breitbart was killed by Obama.
You don't get civil by making stuff up whole scale to make your point.
I liked when this conversation was civil and the word idiot wasn't being thrown around. I hope I'm mistaking your rudeness for passion correctly. I listened to pretty much every O campaign speech in '08 on POTUS XM (and hung on his every word like a schoolgirl) and I may be wrong on the word "immediately", but quickly was my impression. On my phone but I'll search for sound bites. Curious to know his exact promise on Afghanistan now. Either way, I voted for Bush 2.0 expecting change and next term will be 3.0 regardless. I'm sure many will be having these same ridiculous discussions about who was right and who was wrong while they are still guarding the opium in Afghanistan.
I get that things aren't totally fixed and Obama hasn't accomplished all his goals, but you do realize that my little girl's best friend's dad is home and has been for 4 months and that he hasn't been home that long in her entire 7 years. That's because we're mostly out of Iraq and because we haven't taken on any more 10 year 100k soldier wars. Afghanistan is on a glide path with us no longer patrolling the streets.
Nothing is immediate in the sense you're using the word. It's not a light switch, but I can tell you that had you elected McSame and Barbie, we'd be in Iran now and Egypt and Syria and, god forbid, North Korea.
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"America has only three cities: New York, San Francisco, and NEW ORLEANS. Everywhere else is Cleveland."- Tennessee Williams
Sooner Jim is 100% correct. Obama was for gay marriage before he was against it and now he is for it again. I don't think it has anything to do with "g-u-t-s." He's been lying since he declared his opposition to gay marriage when he decided to run for the Senate. Perhaps Obama should be commended for finally abandoning the lie, but I hardly think that makes him a shining example of valor.
The fact is that Obama stands to gain considerably in terms of fundraising, we are now roughly split down the middle on the issue, and all of the momentum is moving towards acceptance of gay marriage. I'm sure this is a moment to rejoice for supporters of gay marriage, but don't go overboard. Obama would not have made this announcement if he didn't believe the political consequences would be negligible at worst.
I also think running against another guy who was for gay marriage before he was against it factored into the calculus. And calculus is the operative word here - unless you believe that someone:
(1) could support marriage as a state legislator;
(2) change his mind and become opposed to gay marriage when running for the U.S. Senate;
(3) maintain that opposition to gay marriage while running for President;
(4) get elected and then declare his views on gay marriage are "evolving" - but that he doesn't believe in it (again) yet; and
(5) finally re-declare his support.
That would, however, require the willful suspension of disbelief, to quote Hillary Clinton in her campaign against Obama.
I have no problem with gay marriage and Saintsfan hits the nail on the head.
the dems didnt support closing of gitmo - note in the last quote they wouldnt approve funding till obama provided detailed plan which appearently where it all stopped as obama was challanged with comming up with a workable paln
"I can't make it any more clear," Reid said. "We will never allow terrorists to be released in the United States."
The move by Senate Democrats to strip the $80 million from a war-spending bill and the decision to bar, for now, transfer of detainees to the United States, raised the possibility that Mr. Obama’s order to close the camp by Jan. 22, 2010, might have to be changed or delayed.
“Guantánamo makes us less safe,” the Senate majority leader, Harry Reid of Nevada,
In a major setback for President Obama, Senate Democrats have removed funding to close the Guantanamo Bay detention center in Cuba from the emergency war spending bill. They said no money will be considered until the president sends Congress a detailed plan on where the prison's 240 detainees would go.
My point is that we as a society were already moving in the direction of supporting gay marriage, so the story is not as big as the media coverage would dictate.
Moving towards? Perhaps when polled they fudge a bit, but it's been on the ballot in 32 states and has lost in 32 states. Even that liberal bastion, the Peoples Republic of Kalifornia, the measure lost. In the swing state of North Carolina, it tallied 61% against.
I feel gays have the right to be as miserable in matrimony as hetro's but apparently many don't. Perhaps civil unions with identical rights a marriage would be the logical compromise. Bet that would pass.
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Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote. - Benjamin Franklin
I get that things aren't totally fixed and Obama hasn't accomplished all his goals, but you do realize that my little girl's best friend's dad is home and has been for 4 months and that he hasn't been home that long in her entire 7 years. That's because we're mostly out of Iraq and because we haven't taken on any more 10 year 100k soldier wars. Afghanistan is on a glide path with us no longer patrolling the streets.
Nothing is immediate in the sense you're using the word. It's not a light switch, but I can tell you that had you elected McSame and Barbie, we'd be in Iran now and Egypt and Syria and, god forbid, North Korea.
If you saying the most he has been home is four months in 7 years, then your lying to everyone on this board.... Read the regulations and report to the people on this board you just lied to.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wcklink
Moving towards? Perhaps when polled they fudge a bit, but it's been on the ballot in 32 states and has lost in 32 states. Even that liberal bastion, the Peoples Republic of Kalifornia, the measure lost. In the swing state of North Carolina, it tallied 61% against.
I feel gays have the right to be as miserable in matrimony as hetro's but apparently many don't. Perhaps civil unions with identical rights a marriage would be the logical compromise. Bet that would pass.
So, separate but equal. Cool.
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President Obama raised a million dollars in 90 minutes yesterday. According to the WAsh Post, one in six donors is gay. Were he to have the courage of his convictions, his rationale would center less on dinner conversations with his ten year old Sasha, who wonders why her Sidwell Friends classmates have such committed gay parents without ruights, and more on getting into the well of Congress, and get the legislation passed. A ten year old with that stated degree of societal sophistication, and the admission by her father that he entertains philistine College republicans who agree with his now "evolved" gay marriage position, are verbal troups used repeatedly in place of action.
And the media swooned.
Here's how a pro does it. LBJ cajoled, bribed, threatened, begged, and willed Civil Rights legislation into being. Obama has never liked the close up action of politics, and will forever be grateful for the two year filibuster-proof window during which he sent this country into an impending collectivist abyss.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJA101
If you saying the most he has been home is four months in 7 years then your lying to everyone on this board.... Read the regulations and report to the people on this board you just lied to.
I'm sure the dude is in the Navy. So you know the Navy's deployment cycles? I do. I was a Marine and lived around Sailors my whole career. Those guys are gone all the time.
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If you saying the most he has been home is four months in 7 years then your lying to everyone on this board.... Read the regulations and report to the people on this board you just lied to.
The kid has been in my daughter's class since Kindergarten. The mom had a double mastectomy while he was deployed about 3 years ago and her mom had to move down to help because he was deployed. Since Kindergarten, the dad hasn't been here enough for me to have even known what he looked like despite having had their family over for weeks at the beach and watched both kids grow up.
He's been home since around Christmas and that's the first time I'd seen him in more than a year so you may be right. In 7 years, he's maybe been home that much. Over the past 3, if he's been in country it hasn't been where his family is.
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There is no way this was done with political considerations.
There is not a single state where this issue will help him. The only potential benefit is that it is in line with the Democrats targeting upper middle class educated voters - particularly women. But any potential benefit there is more than offset by the loss (albeit small) of conservative and moderate Democrats in swing states as well as the energy it gives to social conservatives.
I think this was just a case of him knowing his silence was making him look really silly.
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I'm sure the dude is in the Navy. So you know the Navy's deployment cycles? I do. I was a Marine and lived around Sailors my whole career. Those guys are gone all the time.
OK than you know if they are deployed for 4 months than there home 4 months.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJA101
OK than you know if they are deployed for 4 months than there home 4 months.
Sure, but during that time, especially if they're shipboard, They always go out to sea locally for work-ups, training, etc.
I remember one guy that lived next door to me. I was on a MEU when we went to Afghanistan in late 2001 and I was on the ship that he was stationed on. We got home at the same time and then he was gone a month later, never staying home more than a few days at a time for the next year. We then were on the ship together again for the Iraq invasion.
Am I saying all the Navy is like that? No. But it's not outside the realm of possibility, either.
Anyway, sorry for the thread derailment.
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