Tom "Not So Terrific"

cbord12 · 02-08-2012, 04:51 PM

Just stumbled across this article and thought it was a good read and very true. Besides 2 seasons with Moss catching his prayer deep balls in double coverage, Brady has been a dink-and-dunker to the extreme. Check it out!

Tom Brady: Not So Terrific | Cold Hard Football Facts

cbord12 · 02-08-2012, 05:03 PM

I know Brady is great and I am not arguing that much, but the stats dont lie... Brady was carried by his defense in 2 of his 3 Superbowl wins. I think Brady was crowned best ever based on Superbowl rings not based on body of work. Minus one season with Randy Moss, Brady has never lead the league in TD passes or yardage and his team is just as pass happy as the Saints, Colts, and Packers.

2009ring · 02-08-2012, 08:23 PM

They put up 31 points in 2 super bowls against the Giants. We put up 32 points in 2 quarters against the Giants with alarming regularity.

I'll say it - Brady is over-rated.

bergeaux · 02-08-2012, 08:32 PM

Brady was clutch when he didn't have to carry the team. He performed some pretty good game winning drives in those SB years, you can't argue about that. However, since he lost his defense and has had to put the team on his shoulders, he has struggled to pull it out in the biggest games.

RussTKD · 02-08-2012, 08:45 PM

Wait... Stop the clock...

You mean to tell me a QB that doesn't have a receiver that can stretch the field doesn't have the same number of TDs or YPC as he does when he has that receiver?

What's next? A team with a piecemeal offensive line gives up more sacks than a team with a solid line? Or a defense with a good pass rush gives up less passing yards?

Wow... Great analysis.

2009ring · 02-08-2012, 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RussTKD

Wait... Stop the clock...

You mean to tell me a QB that doesn't have a receiver that can stretch the field doesn't have the same number of TDs or YPC as he does when he has that receiver?

What's next? A team with a piecemeal offensive line gives up more sacks than a team with a solid line? Or a defense with a good pass rush gives up less passing yards?

Wow... Great analysis.

Show me the Randy Moss on the Saints. Sure we have guys that can stretch the field, but not HOF material like Randy Moss.

jrdbrn · 02-08-2012, 09:31 PM

Saying Brady is overrated is ridiculous.

TheIronSheik · 02-08-2012, 10:42 PM

Passes 21 yards or more downfield[2001 stats by distance was not avilable in the ESPN splits page].
Year Brady vs Brees
02 10/51 20/56
03 20/63 10/35
04 26/78 21/53
05 16/62 21/50
06 23/63 26/50
07 28/69 13/46
08 DNP. 27/65
09 16/60 31/57
10 14/36 23/60
11 15/48 31/61

Not even close. 4 of Brees 6 years in New Orleans he had a better year then Brady had in 2007. Maybe the fact that Brady not a great deep passes may be hard for the Brady lovers in the media to accept.

cbord12 · 02-08-2012, 11:15 PM

Quote:

Wait... Stop the clock...

You mean to tell me a QB that doesn't have a receiver that can stretch the field doesn't have the same number of TDs or YPC as he does when he has that receiver?

What's next? A team with a piecemeal offensive line gives up more sacks than a team with a solid line? Or a defense with a good pass rush gives up less passing yards?

Wow... Great analysis.

Good job dude! Brady has thrown for 30+ TDs 3 times in his career. Who does Brees having speeding down the sideline making one handed grabs and touchdowns in double coverage? Yes we have a better receiving group then Brady but by no means do we have a Moss on our team. My whole argument was more aimed towards the playoffs and how even when he had Moss, Brady was only average. Brady does not have near the body of work or consistency that Drew or Peyton have had throughout their careers. Granted Brady has 3 rings to their 1. If thats a measure of great QB's then Bradshaw would be unanimous #1 with 4 rings.

RussTKD · 02-09-2012, 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cbord12

Good job dude! Brady has thrown for 30+ TDs 3 times in his career. Who does Brees having speeding down the sideline making one handed grabs and touchdowns in double coverage? Yes we have a better receiving group then Brady but by no means do we have a Moss on our team. My whole argument was more aimed towards the playoffs and how even when he had Moss, Brady was only average. Brady does not have near the body of work or consistency that Drew or Peyton have had throughout their careers. Granted Brady has 3 rings to their 1. If thats a measure of great QB's then Bradshaw would be unanimous #1 with 4 rings.

We don't need a Moss. We have Colston/Henderson/Meachem, all of which are capable of spreading the field, and two of which can get behind a defense.

Brady's got two tight ends and a slower version of Lance Moore. And an old Deion Branch.

2009ring · 02-09-2012, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RussTKD

We don't need a Moss. We have Colston/Henderson/Meachem, all of which are capable of spreading the field, and two of which can get behind a defense.

Brady's got two tight ends and a slower version of Lance Moore. And an old Deion Branch.

Colston is not a down-the-field-get-behind-the-defense speed guy. He's a big guy for red zone and over the middle catches in traffic.

Deion Branch is 32. He's not old. At 32 (2010) Reggie Wayne had 1355 yards....

Oh - and by the way, our biggest receiving threat this year was a TE too.

So I don't buy any of what you're selling.

RussTKD · 02-09-2012, 10:33 AM

Our biggest receiving threat this year was our biggest receiving threat because of guys like Colston/Meachem/Moore/Sproles/Thomas. The Patriots don't have the weapons around Brady that we have around Brees. They had nobody that could streak down the field and take a CB and a safety with them to open up the underneath stuff so a TE could exploit a mismatch like Jimmy did so often. Their 'burner' was supposed to Chad Ochocinco, but he was a major flop for them.

If Brady had the weapons around him that Drew does, it would be him holding the yardage record for a single season, and probably would be getting sized this week for his fourth ring.

And nice job comparing Branch to one of the best receivers in the game today. That's a fair comparison.

2009ring · 02-09-2012, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RussTKD

Our biggest receiving threat this year was our biggest receiving threat because of guys like Colston/Meachem/Moore/Sproles/Thomas. The Patriots don't have the weapons around Brady that we have around Brees. They had nobody that could streak down the field and take a CB and a safety with them to open up the underneath stuff so a TE could exploit a mismatch like Jimmy did so often. Their 'burner' was supposed to Chad Ochocinco, but he was a major flop for them.

If Brady had the weapons around him that Drew does, it would be him holding the yardage record for a single season, and probably would be getting sized this week for his fourth ring.

And nice job comparing Branch to one of the best receivers in the game today. That's a fair comparison.

Branch is a former Super Bowl MVP. Neither he nor Reggie Wayne are currently a top 5 receiver in the game.

If they had nobody going deep so that the TE could benefit from a mis-match, how did Gronkowski and Hernandez produce?

The bottom line here is that Brady and Belichek both are not the mystical deities that they were once made out to be. Belichek can't draft well and puts out terrible defenses even though he's supposed to be some defensive genius (and he still won't hire a coordinator). Brady puts up 400 yard 4 TD performances against lousy teams but seldom brings a good game anymore to anyone half decent. 1 win all year against a team with a record over .500 and that was the AFCCG where they needed a Lee Evans drop and a kicker shanking a short FG to advance....

RussTKD · 02-09-2012, 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2009ring

Branch is a former Super Bowl MVP. Neither he nor Reggie Wayne are currently a top 5 receiver in the game.

If they had nobody going deep so that the TE could benefit from a mis-match, how did Gronkowski and Hernandez produce?

The bottom line here is that Brady and Belichek both are not the mystical deities that they were once made out to be. Belichek can't draft well and puts out terrible defenses even though he's supposed to be some defensive genius (and he still won't hire a coordinator). Brady puts up 400 yard 4 TD performances against lousy teams but seldom brings a good game anymore to anyone half decent. 1 win all year against a team with a record over .500 and that was the AFCCG where they needed a Lee Evans drop and a kicker shanking a short FG to advance....

So now not only is Brady's skill is diminished because of not having a monster receiving corps, it's also his fault that Pioli left, Belicheck doesn't draft as well, their defense is in down from the early years of their dynasty, and he won 13 of the 16 games he played in the regular season?

Your Brady hate is so obvious. Unjust, but obvious.

crosswatt · 02-09-2012, 05:02 PM

First ballot Hall of Famer. NFL record for touchdowns in a season. Second highest yardage in a season in NFL history. Three time Super Bowl winner. Two time Super Bowl MVP. Two time NFL MVP. Top ten all time passing touchdowns. Top twenty all time passing yardage. Top five in quarterback rating and in attempts/interception ratio. Unanimous All Pro selection. Now one less than perfect post season and he's overrated? I can't tell you how relieved I am that none of you guys are able to evaluate me at my job...