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Old 01-11-2017, 11:31 AM   #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimEverett View Post
Sure. I could also draw up a document, style it a certain way, an put in there claims that Hillary Clinton regularly visited a pizza parlor in order to engage in sex with kids. Reporting on such a document, and claiming it was unsubstantiated, would be 100% accurate.
So Post-fact America is a level playing field, now. Did we expect a higher level of discourse to suddenly come into being for some reason?

Fwiw, journalism think-tank Poynter came out against releasing the document before having it fully vetted. None of the legitimate news sites have released it either.
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Old 01-11-2017, 11:34 AM   #122
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Does he not realize that Hillary is totally irrelevant history now? Why is he still comparing himself to her?
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Old 01-11-2017, 11:36 AM   #123
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Wow. This presser is a joke. He's actually comparing things to how he ran the Miss Universe pageant.
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Old 01-11-2017, 11:36 AM   #124
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Galbreath34 View Post
Does he not realize that Hillary is totally irrelevant history now? Why is he still comparing himself to her?
I had to stop listening.

We have 4 years of questions with answers that will address nothing at all.

As for Russia...he has to now tread lightly.This **** can blow up at any point and its not over by a long shot.
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Old 01-11-2017, 11:38 AM   #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandadmiral View Post
Wow. This presser is a joke. He's actually comparing things to how he ran the Miss Universe pageant.
HE referred to Putin and his "relationship" as an "asset. Not a liability"

Thats right folks....our POTUS refers to foreign relations as a balance sheet.
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Old 01-11-2017, 11:38 AM   #126
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Galbreath34 View Post
Does he not realize that Hillary is totally irrelevant history now? Why is he still comparing himself to her?
That and he just justified the hacking, essentially.
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Old 01-11-2017, 11:45 AM   #127
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VDK View Post
That and he just justified the hacking, essentially.
He said "Hacking is bad. Just look at what Hillary Clinton did"

What a joke.
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Old 01-11-2017, 11:45 AM   #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimEverett View Post
I have said plenty.
you reply to me with something about golden showers, as if that is the basis of claiming the memos published were unsubstantiated and/or inaccurate. Wasn't that your point?

I responded to your claim that reporting on the memos were 100% accurate. Sure, and so would be reporting on a memo I draft about Clinton engaging in sexual acts with kids at a pizza parlor, right?
What is your problem with the original reporting?

This isn't fake news. This actually happened (in terms of the report itself). Your correlation to the fabricated pizza parlor stuff is a non-sequitur and ridiculous as that was truly fake news that was created out of thin air. These allegations (yes, they're still just allegations) where not created out of thin air. There is a basis for it. What we don't know as of yet is if that basis has hard factual evidence behind it that can corroborate the allegations of if they can't. That is as yet to be determined.

Either way, there is reason to look into this deeper and be concerned about the possible implications if the allegations are indeed true. Trump himself can clear up some of the questions surrounding these allegations by simply releasing information that all presidential candidates have released in the past, but he refuses to do so. That further clouds what is actually going on here. The possible contact and coordination between Trump campaign operatives and the Russian government is also extremely troubling and needs to be investigated.

So seriously, why aren't you taking this seriously? You need to be as a citizen of this country.
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Old 01-11-2017, 11:51 AM   #129
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Trump Cites 'Nazi Germany' as He Rejects Dossier on Alleged Russia Dealings - NBC News



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Old 01-11-2017, 11:51 AM   #130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Galbreath34 View Post
Trump just confirmed in the press conference that the 2 page document and its summary are real and as leaked. He went on to say that if the intelligence community itself leaked it that would be a "huge blot" on them. So basically, he admits the content and existence of the document, but tried to skirt things to conflate the Buzz Feed longer weird *** document with that. None the less, he confirmed receiving the basic report and its legitimacy.
Its the substance of the memos that is getting the play here and elsewhere, though. The most glaring accusation - that concerning Trump's lawyer's visit to Prague, has been debunked.
Presidents and President-elects receive a great deal of information in briefings. Reporting/consuming the substance of that information that is unsubstantiated and in some instances easily proven false is the definition of "fake news" imo.

Again, the pizza example. Is there a difference from "reporting" the story itself v. couching it as law enforcement ha informed Hillary Clinton that they are investigating claims that her associate (or her) is engaging in systematic child rape, give the details, and then say "these reports are unsubstantiated now"?
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Old 01-11-2017, 11:52 AM   #131
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimEverett View Post
Its the substance of the memos that is getting the play here and elsewhere, though. The most glaring accusation - that concerning Trump's lawyer's visit to Prague, has been debunked.
Presidents and President-elects receive a great deal of information in briefings. Reporting/consuming the substance of that information that is unsubstantiated and in some instances easily proven false is the definition of "fake news" imo.

Again, the pizza example. Is there a difference from "reporting" the story itself v. couching it as law enforcement ha informed Hillary Clinton that they are investigating claims that her associate (or her) is engaging in systematic child rape, give the details, and then say "these reports are unsubstantiated now"?
No, none of those details were at all in the serious media reporting or in my OP or concerns from the CNN article which was into none of that. It's a straw man to act like those were ever part of the article or the outrage. The first mention of the Buzz Feed crap came with skepticism by the person linking, and my reply of strong skepticism was the next post, and no one sense has taken it as more than drivel. The substance is in the presentation made by intelligence sources, not the strange manufactured long document.

The story and everything everyone besides you is discussing is a REAL 2 page synopsis presented to POTUS and PEOTUS and leaked to the media. None of it has sensationalized details in it. What it does have, and what the creation of the document means is that the charges are very serious.
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Old 01-11-2017, 11:54 AM   #132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coldseat View Post
What is your problem with the original reporting?

This isn't fake news. This actually happened (in terms of the report itself). Your correlation to the fabricated pizza parlor stuff is a non-sequitur and ridiculous as that was truly fake news that was created out of thin air. These allegations (yes, they're still just allegations) where not created out of thin air. There is a basis for it. What we don't know as of yet is if that basis has hard factual evidence behind it that can corroborate the allegations of if they can't. That is as yet to be determined.

Either way, there is reason to look into this deeper and be concerned about the possible implications if the allegations are indeed true. Trump himself can clear up some of the questions surrounding these allegations by simply releasing information that all presidential candidates have released in the past, but he refuses to do so. That further clouds what is actually going on here. The possible contact and coordination between Trump campaign operatives and the Russian government is also extremely troubling and needs to be investigated.

So seriously, why aren't you taking this seriously? You need to be as a citizen of this country.
What is the basis for the substance? An unnamed M16 agent hired by opposition research whose memos are totally unsubstantiated and in at least one very important respect has been easily debunked? Or is there another basis?
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Old 01-11-2017, 11:57 AM   #133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Galbreath34 View Post
No, none of those details were at all in the serious media reporting or in my OP or concerns from the CNN article which was into none of that. It's a straw man to act like those were ever part of the article or the outrage. The first mention of the Buzz Feed crap came with skepticism by the person linking, and my reply of strong skepticism was the next post, and no one sense has taken it as more than drivel. The substance is in the presentation made by intelligence sources, not the strange manufactured long document.
Okay, then what exactly is the new news here?
It cannot be that intelligence agencies had investigated or are investigating potential ties with Trump and Russia - we knew that months ago.
Goint back to your OP it seems the "news" here is the attempt by Russia to bribe and the direct collaboration between the Trump campaign and Russia - both are sourced from the Buzzfeed memos, right?
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Old 01-11-2017, 11:58 AM   #134
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Dang. Putin even got to Tom Brokaw.

Where will this all end?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_B6istqcCI
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Old 01-11-2017, 11:59 AM   #135
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimEverett View Post
What is the basis for the substance? An unnamed M16 agent hired by opposition research whose memos are totally unsubstantiated and in at least one very important respect has been easily debunked? Or is there another basis?
How has he been easily debunked, because maybe that's the disconnect that exist. I haven't read or heard any such thing.

It's been widely reported that the MI6 agent was doing opposition research. So there is obviously cause for skepticism on that point. It's also been widely reported that the MI6 agent has good sources in Russia, is well connected and has a history of providing/producing credible intelligence

So layout the debunked part for all of us!
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