Why teams don’t value a good kicker (1 Viewer)

[ChaChingBaby]

BTW, if you re-watch the replay on Parkey's miss, it was blocked. A hand can be seen with fingertips grazing the ball.

He does not deserve blame for that. It still had two doinks despite the block.

The Bears didn't lose on their kicker. There was some questionably play calling from Nagy which led to that point.

 

[Saintsandcardinalsfan007]

This is simply not true.



This is a screenshot from seconds before the Wide Right miss.

1 for 5 on attempts of 40+ yards or more on grass fields. It was not in his range at all.

Norwood was not the reason they lost that game. He didn't cause their offense to score only one touchdown all day (they scored 51 points in the AFCCG and then only 19 in the Super Bowl with just one TD all day). He didn't make them go 1 for 8 on third down. He didn't tell them to stop running the ball when Thurman Thomas was averaging 9 yards per carry.

Back in 1990, there really wasn't many long leg kickers back then like now. Outside of Morten Andersen, it's hard to name another kicker that could nail these kind of kicks consistently. Lin Elliott was pretty good for a few years but his name will forever be associated with the 3 misses in the 1995 Chiefs/Colts game (all those misses were shorter than Norwood's distance). Us Saints fans will find it difficult to believe that John Carney back in the day was one of the better kickers of that era when he was with the Chargers. Carney actually ranks in the top 5 all time on field goal percentage.

Well, sure, for any game, we can look back and say oh the kicker missing the game are not the reasons we lost, but the bottom line is whatever happened in the game, and it comes down to one last play the kicker missing or making it, everything else doesn’t matter before what had happened. Kickers get paid great money and are supposed to be world class pros with a simple job, the only job to kick it through the uprights. The fact that some shank kicks that are totally makeable is mind blowing. How do you think Minny fans feel when Blair Walsh missed a chip shot against Seattle that would have won the game but instead cost them the game and that was like a 25 yarder?

 

[Saintsandcardinalsfan007]

BTW, if you re-watch the replay on Parkey's miss, it was blocked. A hand can be seen with fingertips grazing the ball.

He does not deserve blame for that. It still had two doinks despite the block.

The Bears didn't lose on their kicker. There was some questionably play calling from Nagy which led to that point.

Yes it was tipped, but is that entirely the fault of the offensive guy not blocking the guy or the kickers fault in part for not elevating it more and who is to say the tipped pass didn’t actually help direct it the right way rather than the wrong way?

 

[Saintsandcardinalsfan007]

This is simply not true.



This is a screenshot from seconds before the Wide Right miss.

1 for 5 on attempts of 40+ yards or more on grass fields. It was not in his range at all.

Norwood was not the reason they lost that game. He didn't cause their offense to score only one touchdown all day (they scored 51 points in the AFCCG and then only 19 in the Super Bowl with just one TD all day). He didn't make them go 1 for 8 on third down. He didn't tell them to stop running the ball when Thurman Thomas was averaging 9 yards per carry.

Back in 1990, there really wasn't many long leg kickers back then like now. Outside of Morten Andersen, it's hard to name another kicker that could nail these kind of kicks consistently. Lin Elliott was pretty good for a few years but his name will forever be associated with the 3 misses in the 1995 Chiefs/Colts game (all those misses were shorter than Norwood's distance). Us Saints fans will find it difficult to believe that John Carney back in the day was one of the better kickers of that era when he was with the Chargers. Carney actually ranks in the top 5 all time on field goal percentage.

I appreciate your assessment about Norwood but he wasn’t a good kicker to begin with. Even in that era, being one out of five on 40 plus on grass is flat out bad.

 

[Icon]

BTW, if you re-watch the replay on Parkey's miss, it was blocked. A hand can be seen with fingertips grazing the ball.

He does not deserve blame for that. It still had two doinks despite the block.

The Bears didn't lose on their kicker. There was some questionably play calling from Nagy which led to that point.

I still haven't figured out the Parkey obsession.

It feels like there have been half a dozen threads created about him this week.

The team with arguably the 5th or 6th best QB in the NFC playoffs is now OUT of the playoffs after their kicker missed. Is it really THAT interesting?

 

[Saintsandcardinalsfan007]

I still haven't figured out the Parkey obsession.

It feels like there have been half a dozen threads created about him this week.

The team with arguably the 5th or 6th best QB in the NFC playoffs is now OUT of the playoffs after their kicker missed. Is it really THAT interesting?

Well to me that was just an example of the larger picture which I was trying to make which is, why teams don’t put more emphasis on finding a great kicker. They never seem to do until you get in a moment like what happened to parkey or Walsh. The worst feeling as a fan, is in a tight game and you’re thinking it is going to come down to whether your kicker can make the field goal and you not having any faith that he can.

 

[Icon]

Well to me that was just an example of the larger picture which I was trying to make which is, why teams don’t put more emphasis on finding a great kicker. They never seem to do until you get in a moment like what happened to parkey or Walsh. The worst feeling as a fan, is in a tight game and you’re thinking it is going to come down to whether your kicker can make the field goal and you not having any faith that he can.

It's silly to suggest that they don't. Kickers can be amazing for a while, then they aren't.

Justin Tuckers aren't easily found. And even he had that PAT gaffe against the Saints, and a missed 50 yarder that he would usually drill in his sleep vs. the Chargers.

 

[Saintsandcardinalsfan007]

It's silly to suggest that they don't. Kickers can be amazing for a while, then they aren't.

Justin Tuckers aren't easily found. And even he had that PAT gaffe against the Saints, and a missed 50 yarder that he would usually drill in his sleep vs. the Chargers.

 

[Saintsandcardinalsfan007]

Agreed, but am talking about moreso a lot of teams that continually keep their kicker who miss many kicks and yet are still kept on. Sure. some have some guaranteed money but it can’t be that hard to find good kickers out there. I mean there are only 32 spots to find great kickers in the entire world.

 

[Saintsandcardinalsfan007]

It's silly to suggest that they don't. Kickers can be amazing for a while, then they aren't.

Justin Tuckers aren't easily found. And even he had that PAT gaffe against the Saints, and a missed 50 yarder that he would usually drill in his sleep vs. the Chargers.

A bad kicker can cost you four games in an entire year as it did with the browns a while back.

 

[guidomerkinsrules]

Agreed, but am talking about moreso a lot of teams that continually keep their kicker who miss many kicks and yet are still kept on. Sure. some have some guaranteed money but it can’t be that hard to find good kickers out there. I mean there are only 32 spots to find great kickers in the entire world.

So I guess in your assessment there are x number of teams who pay kickers (let’s say it’s 10)
Then the rest of the league just signs journeyman hacks
This assumes there is a pool of available talent who are choosing not to kick professionally for $500k,
That if every team paid $2-5 mil, there would be 32 kickers who’d hit 85% from 50 and in

Is that what you’re arguing?

 

[Saintsandcardinalsfan007]

It's silly to suggest that they don't. Kickers can be amazing for a while, then they aren't.

Justin Tuckers aren't easily found. And even he had that PAT gaffe against the Saints, and a missed 50 yarder that he would usually drill in his sleep vs. the Chargers.

Anyway it is easy for us to be chill about it until (and hopefully it never happens), if lutz does that in a playoff game. Then the next day we would all be clamoring why didn’t we get a better kicker.

 

[guidomerkinsrules]

Anyway it is easy for us to be chill about it until (and hopefully it never happens), if lutz does that in a playoff game. Then the next day we would all be clamoring why didn’t we get a better kicker.

Like?

 

[Saintsandcardinalsfan007]

So I guess in your assessment there are x number of teams who pay kickers (let’s say it’s 10)
Then the rest of the league just signs journeyman hacks
This assumes there is a pool of available talent who are choosing not to kick professionally for $500k,
That if every team paid $2-5 mil, there would be 32 kickers who’d hit 85% from 50 and in

Is that what you’re arguing?

No, not at all. I am just saying if there are ten premium kickers out there, pay whatever it takes to get one of those ten premium kickers. I would rather pay 5 million for a top kicker than add an extra average receiver or tight end or whatever for 5 million. And I am talking about kicks under 50 yards. 50 yards and plus, one could never blame the kicker for a field goal that is 50 percent chance or less of making it. I am talking about 30 and 40 plus yard ranges.

 

[Saintsandcardinalsfan007]

Like?

Like even a forty something vinitieri who may not make every kick but is clutch.