USA Today article of analysis of Saints penalty disparity (1 Viewer)

So what happened to these bias Refs during the 3 game winning stretch we had this year starting with the Jacksonville game... where the team averaged 3 penalties for like 30 yards per game?

Did they forget to screw us? Did they feel sorry for us? Maybe they went on Saints bias vacation?

You guys crack me up.

We need to stop committing dumb penalties during dumb times as a team.... and these concerns will go away... until then... carry on conspiracy theorists. LOL
 
We need to stop committing dumb penalties during dumb times as a team.... and these concerns will go away... until then... carry on conspiracy theorists. LOL

Dang, bro, you missed the entire point of the article. I'm guessing you didn't read it. It's not (only) about OUR penalties. It's about the dropoff of penalties called on all of our opponents when, and only when, they face us.

Now Girod Street endzone does do an in-depth look at the "discretionary" calls against us like holding and hands to the face and whatnot, and there's a huge uptick of those vs. our opponents as well.

I mean if you don't like numbers and analytics and statistics, that's cool. But for people who do, this is fascinating. No one knows WHY and these articles don't answer that question. Only the 'what'. And the 'what' is definitely there. And it's absolutely crazy.
 
So what happened to these bias Refs during the 3 game winning stretch we had this year starting with the Jacksonville game... where the team averaged 3 penalties for like 30 yards per game?

Did they forget to screw us? Did they feel sorry for us? Maybe they went on Saints bias vacation?

You guys crack me up.

We need to stop committing dumb penalties during dumb times as a team.... and these concerns will go away... until then... carry on conspiracy theorists. LOL

Why does it have to be a grand conspiracy to “screw” us every single game? Just because the eye and stat tests may fall short of that doesn’t mean that there isn’t a an issue with inconsistent officiating in the NFL, which the Saints happen to suffer the most from.

Even these 3 games you use as the basis of your rebuttal don’t necessarily disprove anything. Sure, the Saints didn’t get called for a million penalties, but the Cardinals, Jaguars, and Bears (who rank 6th, 1st, 15th in penalties) all got called for (by far) season lows I penalties when they played against us.

How few penalties our opponents get is the biggest point people are making anyway.
 
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See my other posts... I read it... I live in the analytics and statistics universe daily... they can literally be made to prove whatever you are looking to prove if you have a theory in your mind made up (and any supporting data)... and you go looking for the specific data needed to derive the analytics and statistics to support it.... and need to sync up with your conclusion.

It's good brain fodder... not much more.

The fact of the matter is... our team has the capability to stop killing themselves with penalties.... Sean said as much today.... It has been proven in the 3 game stretch I mentioned earlier this year... they just need to be more disciplined.... because these penalties can be the difference between barely winning games, and being dominant.

Dallas has more penality yards than we do... Are the Refs bias against Dallas? LOL

There is a bias because it's perceived, we are committing penalties at a silly rate, and people are looking for a reason outside of "it's our own damn fault".

EDIT: READ ALL MY POSTS... There is an issue with officiating in the NFL in regards to consistency and accuracy... It is not just a problem for the Saints... It's League wide.
 
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It's USA Today. Peter King is aware of it, and if he's not picking it up, then it's a conscious decision.

Maybe. There's an assumption there that I am not sure is absolutely supportable.
 
Sean said as much today.... It has been proven in the 3 game stretch I mentioned earlier this year... they just need to be more disciplined.... because these penalties can be the difference between barely winning games, and being dominant.

What did you expect him to say? "Hey, we gettin' hosed, y'all cut it out?"

There is a bias because it's perceived, we are committing penalties at a silly rate, and people are looking for a reason outside of "it's our own damn fault".

Maybe there is one. It wasn't Tommylee Lewis's fault he didn't catch that pass last year.

So how do you explain the astonishing lack of judgment call penalties against our opponents when we play them? Is THAT just randomness, and luck? So we're really sloppy and really unlucky?

And we're magically 10-2? Heavens, with all that we're either the greatest team ever, or the weirdest.

Hey, you pick. You're the big data guy.
 
So what happened to these bias Refs during the 3 game winning stretch we had this year starting with the Jacksonville game... where the team averaged 3 penalties for like 30 yards per game?

Did they forget to screw us? Did they feel sorry for us? Maybe they went on Saints bias vacation?

You guys crack me up.

We need to stop committing dumb penalties during dumb times as a team.... and these concerns will go away... until then... carry on conspiracy theorists. LOL

Good chance not every last Marine at Guantanamo knew what a Code Red was, either.
 
Choose which is more likely and logical and not "flat-earthy":

1.) The Saints are a super talented / SB level team, that has committed a ton of penalties this year, but have won games despite that - due to that sheer talent... and their opponents (if they want any chance to beat them) must not commit penalties if they want to have any chance at a win, and they know it coming into the game- hence play more disciplined as a product.


2.) The Saints are beyond making this many mistakes. The teams they play must be getting help. The Refs are against us. Let's pull some numbers to support this.

Have a good one guys... LOL
 
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Choose which is more likely and logical and not "flat-earthy":

1.) The Saints are a super talented / SB level team, that has committed a ton of penalties this year, but have won games despite that - due to that sheer talent... and their opponents (if they want any chance to beat them) must not commit penalties if they want any chance to beat them, and they know it coming into the game- hence play more disciplined as a product.


2.) The Saints are beyond making this many mistakes. The teams they play must be getting help. The Refs are against us. Let's pull some numbers top support this.

Have a good one guys... LOL

#2 easily.

Yes, a team can play more disciplined... But I've watched the games. Excluding this last game vs ATL... the calls have all been ticky-tack and I've seen LOTs of uncalled egregious fouls committed by our opponents not get called. Against ATL, I remember telling co-workers that it looks like our guys just said "screw it"... and went out and played ball knowing that the Refs couldn't do us "worse".

Our boys didn't just start playing sloppy 4 weeks ago. If you think they did, then give me ANY believable reason why that would've happened. I have a reason, and it's very believable. We were on the cusp of clinching the NFC South before Thanksgiving, and that's bad for football. You can only get away with that most years in the AFC East.
 
I appreciate the responses guys... for those that answer #2.... do me a favor and let's get that hat size and quantity put in here so we can just make one big order before Christmas.

Thanks,


You are mighty dismissive to other level headed who dat brethren here. Try having a dissenting point of view without the condescending attitude champ.
 
I appreciate the responses guys... for those that answer #2.... do me a favor and let's get that hat size and quantity put in here so we can just make one big order before Christmas.

Thanks,
I’m sure your dad was a very fine ref and we’re probably not counting him among these terrible ones the NFL is stocked with today.
 
Or does it show that the Saints are their own worst enemy, and generally commit way too many penalties, and their opponents have to play near mistake free football to have a chance to beat them...?

As with most data... you can use it to see what you are looking for... That's why context and substance of the data is way more important than raw numbers.
You need to read the Girod street endzone article about this subject. It breaks it down further and adds context. This disparity is pretty eye opening to say the least. You can believe what you want in that it's still a coincidence but the breakdown in that article convinces me that there is something afoot in the NFL front office and the officials to stick it to the Saints. A let's show them who's boss type of attitude being disseminated down the ranks. That Carolina game was a tipping point for me. When they missed that FG, the officials flag came out way to late and like someone else pointed out, they huddled and thought the better of it because that would have been way to obvious.
 
See my other posts... I read it... I live in the analytics and statistics universe daily... they can literally be made to prove whatever you are looking to prove if you have a theory in your mind made up (and any supporting data)... and you go looking for the specific data needed to derive the analytics and statistics to support it.... and need to sync up with your conclusion.

It's good brain fodder... not much more.

The fact of the matter is... our team has the capability to stop killing themselves with penalties.... Sean said as much today.... It has been proven in the 3 game stretch I mentioned earlier this year... they just need to be more disciplined.... because these penalties can be the difference between barely winning games, and being dominant.

Dallas has more penality yards than we do... Are the Refs bias against Dallas? LOL

There is a bias because it's perceived, we are committing penalties at a silly rate, and people are looking for a reason outside of "it's our own damn fault".

EDIT: READ ALL MY POSTS... There is an issue with officiating in the NFL in regards to consistency and accuracy... It is not just a problem for the Saints... It's League wide.

You dismiss other posters with thinly vieled insults about not understanding analytics, yet refer to 3 out of 12 games as "proof".

What analytics do you actually do where 1/4 of the data is used as proof to discount the other 3/4???

You keep returning to this thread for what exactly.?
 
Choose which is more likely and logical and not "flat-earthy":

1.) The Saints are a super talented / SB level team, that has committed a ton of penalties this year, but have won games despite that - due to that sheer talent... and their opponents (if they want any chance to beat them) must not commit penalties if they want to have any chance at a win, and they know it coming into the game- hence play more disciplined as a product.


2.) The Saints are beyond making this many mistakes. The teams they play must be getting help. The Refs are against us. Let's pull some numbers to support this.

Have a good one guys... LOL

So you are positing that teams who commit a lot of penalties in all of their games (of which we have played several) just magically turn off that switch, become disciplined, and commit the fewest penalties of any team in the league that week, simply because they know they have to play well to beat us, only to revert to committing their standard amount of penalties in the following weeks/games?

And this hasn’t happened once or twice, but seemingly every single week. That seems normal to you?

I think there is a wide gap between calling out these inconsistencies and your condescending “flat earther” labels.
 

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