2013 NFL Season: Mark Ingram or Chris Ivory? (1 Viewer)

[Buhbooh]

CHRIS IVORY RUNS OVER THE FALCONS! - YouTube

Nuff said.

 

[Invictus]

So, by all means, let's start yet another Ingram/Ivory thread.

You do understand that this is not a thread where I want to debate who is better between Ingram and Ivory (I've already wasted enough time in past threads debating this silly argument against Ivory' lovers), but one in which I'm willing to place a friendly bet with one of the countless Ingram' haters? Unfortunately it seems that a lot of them are able to red thumb me, but no one is brave enough to show some of their unmitigated faith in The Tusk, who should thrive as the lead RB in New York, because...

Ivory is going to have his toughest challenge ever staying healthy facing 8 man fronts all year with absolutely no threat of a passing game whatsoever, it's even worse than the AP situation in Minnesota as their passing game is far superior to the joke in New York (never thought I'd say that about Min but in this comparison its the truth).

...even if everything whosyadaddy wrote is true, Shonn Greene (a valid, yet not stellar back) managed more than 1.000 yards running behind the Jets' OL both in 2011 and 2012. So, after all the hyperboles reserved to Ivory by his fans, I expected a stronger support concerning his 2013 production. Instead the actual results of the poll show that the Tacoes option is tied with the Chris Ivory' one. So where is the Ivory love when you ask for it?

Ingram should get the nod since he plays in the best offense of the entire nfl and because ivory can't stay healthy. If ingram were to play for the jets, he'd disappear altogether though.

I highly doubt that Ingram would disappear behind the Jets OL, also because I've just reported that other backs have managed good results in NY, even with a shoddy QB situation. Moreover let's see what Chris Ivory can do, before suggesting what Mark Ingram would do in the same situation, please.

I can't even believe we are having this conversation about a player who has been in the league for 2 full seasons and has yet to have a 100 yard game. I am not an Ingram hater, I just hate that we gave up a 1st and 2nd round draft picks for him.

The Saints basically swapped 1st round picks with the Patriots, along with giving them an additional 2nd round pick. Furthermore this is one of the most laughable aspects when the debate between Ingram and Ivory rages on. I've read time and time again, for example, that you shouldn't draft RBs in the first round anymore, because you can find excellent backs even as UDFA. Guess what? You could say the SAME about every other position on the roster. How many OL or DL, for instance, have been selected in the 1st round in the last four years and are already out of the league?

Your comment makes no sense at all!! If the Jets Qb's are so awful don't you think that teams will stack the line of scrimmage to stop the run because the Jets QB's don't scare anyone?

True, but if a decent RB like Shonn Greene produced more than 1.000 yards both in 2011 and 2012, I think that a RB that was once compared to AP (no joking, the comparison was made in an earlier thread) could produce at least the same results...or not?

 

[Zack Lee]

So, by all means, let's start yet another Ingram/Ivory thread.

but this one has tacoes.

 

[HayBear]

Neither one reaches 500 yds. Take it to the bank.

Next season Ingram is a Jet also.

 

[BoNcHiE]

Heck, I wish he had the production of Mike Bell. So for, he is no Mike Bell.

Yeah, Mike Bell's 3.5 YPC he averaged here is so much better then Ingram

 

[Optimistic Ozzy]

I thought it were a sin to compare the two. How dare?

 

[Mad Max2]

Yeah, Mike Bell's 3.5 YPC he averaged here is so much better then Ingram

Where is this stat coming from????

Mike Bell
Height: 6-0 Weight: 225 Age: 30
Born: 4/23/1983 Phoenix , AZ
College: Arizona
Experience: 6 Seasons

2009New Orleans Saints13 31726543.83554123.09022


http://www.nfl.com/player/mikebell/2506767/profile

We can haggle over 1/10 of a yard per carry all day, but it is still meaningless. So far, in my opinion, he is at, or below the production, in his first 2 years, of an un drafted journeyman free agent, and an un drafted free agent out of Tiffin University. It is what it is. The stats are the stats. Hey, I hope he does better and makes us all forget about the oft injured free agent running back out of the super power Tiffin, who himself, never had a 1000 yard season, which makes this all the more pathetic.

 

[Mad Max2]

The Saints basically swapped 1st round picks with the Patriots, along with giving them an additional 2nd round pick. Furthermore this is one of the most laughable aspects when the debate between Ingram and Ivory rages on. I've read time and time again, for example, that you shouldn't draft RBs in the first round anymore, because you can find excellent backs even as UDFA. Guess what? You could say the SAME about every other position on the roster. How many OL or DL, for instance, have been selected in the 1st round in the last four years and are already out of the league?

Well, that set me straight. We basically sent the Patriots our second round pic in 2011 and "swapped" our first round pick in 2012 for their first round pick in 2011. I feel much better about it now. I was thinking Ingram basically cost the Saints a first and second round picks to draft him.

 

[Optimistic Ozzy]

Well, that set me straight. We basically sent the Patriots our second round pic in 2011 and "swapped" our first round pick in 2012 for their first round pick in 2011. I feel much better about it now. I was thinking Ingram basically cost the Saints a first and second round picks to draft him.

However you look at it, not a bright move.

 

[Wheelo]

Ingram beat ivory in those categories last year. I see no reason for any change.

 

[Mad Max2]

However you look at it, not a bright move.

Uhhhhhhhhhhh, no, probably not.

Quick trivia question, in the last 15 years, how many times have the saints packaged multiple picks to move up or back into the first round, and how many times did it work out in the Saints favor and how many times was it a complete flow and waste of picks?????? One little tidbit on the subject, in the 2009 draft, after drafting Malcolm Jenkins in the first round, the saints tried to move back into the first round by trading a pick in the 2009 draft (2nd rounder I think) and the 1st round pick in 2010. Does anyone know who they were trying to trade back into the first round to get??? Big hint, it was a rb and we could add it to the "not worth trading multiple picks to move up/back into the first round" debate.

 

[rail]

Since I've been here on SR the amount of threads where Saints' fans discuss (almost endlessly) who is better between Mark Ingram and Chris Ivory is absolutely ridiculous.

So, you start another one.

 

[chank]

 

[TylerDurden]

Where is this stat coming from????

Mike Bell
Height: 6-0 Weight: 225 Age: 30
Born: 4/23/1983 Phoenix , AZ
College: Arizona
Experience: 6 Seasons

2009New Orleans Saints13 31726543.83554123.09022


Mike Bell, RB at NFL.com

We can haggle over 1/10 of a yard per carry all day, but it is still meaningless. So far, in my opinion, he is at, or below the production, in his first 2 years, of an un drafted journeyman free agent, and an un drafted free agent out of Tiffin University. It is what it is. The stats are the stats. Hey, I hope he does better and makes us all forget about the oft injured free agent running back out of the super power Tiffin, who himself, never had a 1000 yard season, which makes this all the more pathetic.

Yep. Mike Bell had a 3.8 ypc avg, plus 654 yards, and 5 TDs, and if you watched the games that year, Bell was a valuable part of the offense due to his running style. He ran with a punishing running style kind like Ivory has for us the last couple of years. It is not all about stats. Bell's and Ivory's style of running; bowling over smaller DB's, breaking tackles fighting for extra yards, and delivering hits rather than taking them helped set the tone, or change the momentum in some of those games. I have not yet seen Ingram do that.

 

[sammymvpknight]

Ivory is better but Ingram will have the edge as far as total numbers.

Ingram should have a more productive season. he's got the #1 passing attack in the NFL opening things up and two other RBs that will probably get more attention as far as game planning goes.

Not the case for Ivory. CI will have absolutely 0 help around him. he should honestly get an award if his YPC is over 4.2 or so



you expect a 1st round RB to produce at a high level. he has been a decent short yardage back but so was Mike Bell

You also expect a CB, WR, DT, and S to play at a high level...I'm looking at you Robinson, Meachem, Ellis, and Jenkins. But none of those guys got even close to the amount of heat that Ingram gets. And the truth is that if it wasn't Ingram...it would be someone else. PT vs Bush, Ivory vs Ingram, PT vs Sproles. Why can you see that the Saints have nothing but role players on the team and it will be hard for any of them to stand out? But Saints fans just can't let it permeate through the skull. The This RB vs That RB debate is obnoxious. I am not even taking sides...I am just tired of it year in and year out.