30 for 30: Michael Vick (3 Viewers)

Optimus Prime

Subscribing Member
VIP Subscribing Member
VIP Contributor
Joined
Jul 18, 1998
Messages
7,030
Reaction score
6,374
Offline
Sticky Post
Part One airs tonight
=====================

You don’t have to forgive Michael Vick for dogfighting, but ESPN wants you to understand the context.

“Vick,” a two-part “30 for 30” documentary set to air Thursday with the second half premiering the following Thursday, takes a deep dive into the factors that surrounded the former NFL quarterback’s midcareer imprisonment, including race, poverty and sudden stardom and wealth. Among the complexities of his saga are the differing ways communities reacted to his arrest and lengthy sentence, and what to make of his football legacy.

Perhaps the biggest question, though, was raised by the documentary’s director, Stanley Nelson, in a phone interview Wednesday with The Post: “How does something that so many of us see as horribly cruel and torturous, how does anybody not see that?”

“And how, to some people, does this seem like something that’s not wrong?” Nelson added. “So we wanted to examine that.”...........

 

kizzy821

#1 BandWagon Fan
VIP Contributor
Joined
Dec 20, 2009
Messages
2,718
Reaction score
4,173
Offline
Sure pick and choose what you want. I do pray for the skill to make a quick and clean kill.

How about the rest of my post? Oh, you dont have a leg to stand on. Later Francis I am done.
Once I realized that you believe you're commissioned to do god's work, that he hired you for the animal control division - the rest of your post didn't matter. The irony of your predicament is all I can see now. The irony of god miscalculating. Of needing you to shoot the animals because there's no other way to get rid of them once they're here. And if humans never came along? Who would keep the animal population under control?

There is no limit to what we will tell ourselves (and others) in order to justify our actions.
 

Mamba

SR is my life!
VIP Contributor
Joined
Apr 21, 2001
Messages
11,760
Reaction score
4,341
Age
38
Offline
Look if this guy has changed his life so be it. Good for him. It doesnt mean I have to gush about what a great human is. He is who he is and its between him and which ever god he chooses to worship. My decision to not care about him does not effect him in the slightest. He will move on in life and my feelings wont impact him in the slightest. My foot is not on his neck.
You sure seem like you care, though.
 

renegadewa

Super Forum Fanatic
VIP Contributor
Joined
Jul 7, 2011
Messages
8,001
Reaction score
10,548
Location
Baton Rouge
Offline
You need there to be "a world of difference" between the two
so you can remain self-righteous. In the end, the animals are dead and unlike Vick, you ingest the animals.

But in your head, you are 100% justified. It's funny how we can always find ways to justify what WE want to do. How we can always find ways to make ourselves "right." But I don't see what you do as anymore necessary or more legitimate than dog fighting.

I don't see how you can be 100% ok with one and completely "outraged" by the other. Being hypocritical has always gone hand-in-hand with self-righteousness.
What I do by hunting is something that has been done by men since the beginning of time unlike fighting and killing dogs for sport and it is more legitimate because there are no laws against it. In fact it is regulated by law and I strictly follow those laws.

Tell me where there are laws that protect dog fighting. Vick could have been charged with far more than just dog fighting if they would have fully thrown the book at him. There could have been illegal gambling, drug and prostitution charges brought against him if he would have pleaded not guilty but by virtue of him striking a deal the charges against him were greatly reduced.

In other words........................he got off easy because of who he was!!

And where did I say that I was outraged by what Vick did? I was far from outraged because it didn't surprise me one little bit when him and his "posse" of 'boyz" were arrested and charged and as I said before the only reason that people are of the mind that he is a better person is because he got caught.

You can preach from your throne all you want but I highly doubt that I'll ever go to prison for buying a hunting license.
 

kizzy821

#1 BandWagon Fan
VIP Contributor
Joined
Dec 20, 2009
Messages
2,718
Reaction score
4,173
Offline
What I do by hunting is something that has been done by men since the beginning of time unlike fighting and killing dogs for sport and it is more legitimate because there are no laws against it. In fact it is regulated by law and I strictly follow those laws.

Tell me where there are laws that protect dog fighting. Vick could have been charged with far more than just dog fighting if they would have fully thrown the book at him. There could have been illegal gambling, drug and prostitution charges brought against him if he would have pleaded not guilty but by virtue of him striking a deal the charges against him were greatly reduced.

In other words........................he got off easy because of who he was!!

And where did I say that I was outraged by what Vick did? I was far from outraged because it didn't surprise me one little bit when him and his "posse" of 'boyz" were arrested and charged and as I said before the only reason that people are of the mind that he is a better person is because he got caught.

You can preach from your throne all you want but I highly doubt that I'll ever go to prison for buying a hunting license.
It doesn't matter if there are arbitrary laws making it ok for you to kill animals. The reasons men like you and Michael Vick partake in such actions are very similar. Therefore, whatever feelings you harbor towards Vick, be it outrage, anger, disgust - should also be directed inwards.

I don't understand why anyone would do either activity. But I get that people like it: hunting and dog fighting. To each his own. Just don't try and paint a picture where what you do is morally superior or vastly different. You both operate within the same zip code.
 

Loose Cannon

Tangibles
VIP Contributor
Joined
May 26, 2002
Messages
27,960
Reaction score
5,222
Location
Austin, TX
Offline
Look if this guy has changed his life so be it. Good for him. It doesnt mean I have to gush about what a great human is. He is who he is and its between him and which ever god he chooses to worship. My decision to not care about him does not effect him in the slightest. He will move on in life and my feelings wont impact him in the slightest. My foot is not on his neck.
You have a lot of posts in this thread for a guy who doesn't care.
 

0rion

Hall-of-Famer
Joined
Jan 20, 2010
Messages
5,341
Reaction score
8,342
Location
Central Ohio
Online
It doesn't matter if there are arbitrary laws making it ok for you to kill animals. The reasons men like you and Michael Vick partake in such actions are very similar. Therefore, whatever feelings you harbor towards Vick, be it outrage, anger, disgust - should also be directed inwards.

I don't understand why anyone would do either activity. But I get that people like it: hunting and dog fighting. To each his own. Just don't try and paint a picture where what you do is morally superior or vastly different. You both operate within the same zip code.
I understand your point. I don't agree with it necessarily but I understand it. I hunt and my kids hunt. If we can kill 3 deer a year we buy very little, if any, beef all year. It's a trade off for us. Meat is going to be eaten either way. If you eat meat the same things are going on with your food. You're just paying someone else to do it.
 

renegadewa

Super Forum Fanatic
VIP Contributor
Joined
Jul 7, 2011
Messages
8,001
Reaction score
10,548
Location
Baton Rouge
Offline
It doesn't matter if there are arbitrary laws making it ok for you to kill animals. The reasons men like you and Michael Vick partake in such actions are very similar. Therefore, whatever feelings you harbor towards Vick, be it outrage, anger, disgust - should also be directed inwards.

I don't understand why anyone would do either activity. But I get that people like it: hunting and dog fighting. To each his own. Just don't try and paint a picture where what you do is morally superior or vastly different. You both operate within the same zip code.
Then we'll just agree to disagree because we both won't see the other point.

I don't see it being in the same zip code at all but whatever.

Either way I'm done with you.
 

kizzy821

#1 BandWagon Fan
VIP Contributor
Joined
Dec 20, 2009
Messages
2,718
Reaction score
4,173
Offline
I understand your point. I don't agree with it necessarily but I understand it. I hunt and my kids hunt. If we can kill 3 deer a year we buy very little, if any, beef all year. It's a trade off for us. Meat is going to be eaten either way. If you eat meat the same things are going on with your food. You're just paying someone else to do it.
The part where you and your kids kill for the meat, is recreational. It's not necessary. There is some other motivation to shooting and killing wild animals besides the money saved on buying beef.

You probably get a rush or a sense of satisfaction when you or one of the kids hits your target. You probably like the ritual of it all. Cleaning your guns, making sure you packed all the right stuff, buying new gear. It's a sport that involves bloodshed and dead animals. Not unlike dog fighting.

I know how my food gets made (some believe the conditions in which farm animals are slaughtered is worse than both dog fighting and hunting). It's why I can't imagine getting up on a soap box, acting as if I'm above animals being hurt for my pleasure.
 

2fya

Bench Warmer
Joined
Nov 2, 2005
Messages
3,110
Reaction score
2,800
Age
33
Location
Duson, LA
Offline
Hunters contribute billions of dollars to nature. I hunt goose, squirrel, rabbit, duck, deer, turkey etc. I kill quickly and efficiently. I dont hold the animal down and torture it. Without hunters animals would over populate. There would be deer starving. Again am I killing an animal? Yes. I dont take questionable shots. I dont light them on fire or electrocute them and watch them suffer in torment while I watch and laugh. Vick is a piece of garbage. I dont care if he feels bad because he got caught and cant do those things any more.
I feel differently, but 100% see and respect your point of view.
 

Loose Cannon

Tangibles
VIP Contributor
Joined
May 26, 2002
Messages
27,960
Reaction score
5,222
Location
Austin, TX
Offline
The part where you and your kids kill for the meat, is recreational. It's not necessary. There is some other motivation to shooting and killing wild animals besides the money saved on buying beef.

You probably get a rush or a sense of satisfaction when you or one of the kids hits your target. You probably like the ritual of it all. Cleaning your guns, making sure you packed all the right stuff, buying new gear. It's a sport that involves bloodshed and dead animals. Not unlike dog fighting.

I know how my food gets made (some believe the conditions in which farm animals are slaughtered is worse than both dog fighting and hunting). It's why I can't imagine getting up on a soap box, acting as if I'm above animals being hurt for my pleasure.
See what you're missing is that hunting is for upstanding members of the community and dog fighting is for thugs.
 

livefromDC

Subscribing Member
VIP Subscribing Member
Joined
May 12, 2006
Messages
9,103
Reaction score
14,742
Age
40
Location
Atlanta, GA
Offline
I understand your point. I don't agree with it necessarily but I understand it. I hunt and my kids hunt. If we can kill 3 deer a year we buy very little, if any, beef all year. It's a trade off for us. Meat is going to be eaten either way. If you eat meat the same things are going on with your food. You're just paying someone else to do it.
You, like your kids, probably grew up hunting. Sadly, many people in this country grew up with dog fighting being the norm. And while some forms of hunting are legal in the United States, many people still dont see it as morally different from dog fighting. And what is legality? Are you against dog fighting because it's illegal? Would you be okay with it if the U.S adopted Japan's view on dogfighting? I doubt it. So the legality of it isnt the issue. It's the morality.
 

ELLIASJWILLIAMS

More than 15K posts served!
VIP Contributor
Joined
Nov 28, 2007
Messages
17,002
Reaction score
30,192
Online
Once I realized that you believe you're commissioned to do god's work, that he hired you for the animal control division - the rest of your post didn't matter. The irony of your predicament is all I can see now. The irony of god miscalculating. Of needing you to shoot the animals because there's no other way to get rid of them once they're here. And if humans never came along? Who would keep the animal population under control?

There is no limit to what we will tell ourselves (and others) in order to justify our actions.
Well played.

It’s always easier to criticize someone else’s skeletons as long as your own closet remains closed.


See what you're missing is that hunting is for upstanding members of the community and dog fighting is for thugs.
Lol
 

sfidc3

Pro-Bowler
Joined
Mar 14, 2015
Messages
2,223
Reaction score
2,411
Offline
Stop lying. No need to exaggerate what he did or why he did it in order to prop up your own actions.
He is not exaggerating....at all....those who have not read the excellent book on what went on and what happened to the dogs that survived may want to (or maybe not so you can continue being ignorant of some of the facts).. I believe it is called the Lost Dogs....
 

kizzy821

#1 BandWagon Fan
VIP Contributor
Joined
Dec 20, 2009
Messages
2,718
Reaction score
4,173
Offline
He is not exaggerating....at all....those who have not read the excellent book on what went on and what happened to the dogs that survived may want to (or maybe not so you can continue being ignorant of some of the facts).. I believe it is called the Lost Dogs....
The holy hunter said Michael Vick was killing dogs because he enjoyed watching them die.
Everything I've read and heard suggests they killed the dogs that weren't fighting well and wasn't going to yield them money.
 

Create an account or login to comment

You must be a member in order to leave a comment

Create account

Create an account on our community. It's easy!

Log in

Already have an account? Log in here.

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 1)



Headlines

Top Bottom