American Airlines 767 Caught Fire on Runway (1 Viewer)

I just told my wife about this and as to the cause, she asked if Led Nessman was around and if this might have been caused by a turkey?
 
I believe the shroud will only contain the fan sections. The compressor disks are not shielded by the shroud. NTSB said it was a stage 2 disc that failed. I am not sure if this disc is located in the shrouded section.

I just read that pieces were found a half mile away. So St. Ward was correct in calling it a catastrophic failure.
 
I just read that pieces were found a half mile away. So St. Ward was correct in calling it a catastrophic failure.

That's gotta be pretty rare. Those engines are nearly indestructible. Pretty surprising to see something like this on the ground.
 
Almost everything is aluminum in the airframe. You can't really see what the heat did, what you see is soot from the fire and burned paint. However, it is highly likely that the wing is scrap, at least the skin.

Look at where the left most fire truck is.. the wing tip (or at least it looks like the wing tip) is on the ground.

1577895_630x354.jpg


Or is this something else next to the wing making it look like it underwent creep? (a ladder or something? ) That's what is throwing me off.
 
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Look at where the left most fire truck is.. the wing tip (or at least it looks like the wing tip) is on the ground.

1577895_630x354.jpg


Or is this something else next to the wing making it look like it underwent creep? (a ladder or something? ) That's what is throwing me off.
That's one stubby wing if not ....

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I just read that pieces were found a half mile away. So St. Ward was correct in calling it a catastrophic failure.

Yes, it was a catastrophic failure but it was one that would not have been contained by the shroud. The turbines in theory should never fail and are not enclosed by a shroud capable of contains a disc failure.
 
Look at where the left most fire truck is.. the wing tip (or at least it looks like the wing tip) is on the ground.

1577895_630x354.jpg


Or is this something else next to the wing making it look like it underwent creep? (a ladder or something? ) That's what is throwing me off.


The wing melted like a Hershey's chocolate bar on a hot summer day.
 
Look at where the left most fire truck is.. the wing tip (or at least it looks like the wing tip) is on the ground.

1577895_630x354.jpg


Or is this something else next to the wing making it look like it underwent creep? (a ladder or something? ) That's what is throwing me off.

I can't tell. It looks like an optical illusion.
 
Catastrophic failure is a rare thing. The manufacturers put a lot of research and energy to keep the rotating pieces where they belong. However, they can fail for 3 reasons I can think of at the moment. The first is ingestion. It depends on what is ingested. Rocks and concrete are not a big deal. When they meet the rotating metal they disintegrate. Metal on the other hand does not. In the metal ingestion repairs I have been a part of, the metal comes out as a ball with strike marks on it like facets. Metal fatigue or metallurgical defects in which cracks form where the alloy is uneven. The third is oil system failure. But when that happens the rotating parts just lay over like the trees in that old picture of the meteorite in Russia. That is because the engine stops rotating in a fraction of a second.
 
Yes, it was a catastrophic failure but it was one that would not have been contained by the shroud. The turbines in theory should never fail and are not enclosed by a shroud capable of contains a disc failure.

I know all the sections have a shroud to protect from blade/fan failures. I'd imagine a disc failure would be designed against too, but a disc failing is a very big deal (if this is really a disc section that they found).

The little chatter around here we've had (too busy with end of year stuff, and not enough data) is that there are two major concerns. 1. What led to the incident (in a way you hope it's ingestion, because anything else is very bad),and 2. Why was there an uncontained failure? #2 will likely be the bigger impact.

I'm also curious which engine version was on the 767-300ER... could be the Pratt and Whitney PW4000, GE CF6, or Rolls Royce RB211.

<img src="http://www.pw.utc.com/Content/PW4000112_Engine/img/B-1-4-3_pw4000112_cutaway_high.jpg" width="800" />
 
Speaking of uncontained failures... This is the Southwest one from August.

Investigative Update Provides Initial Findings in Investigation of Uncontained Engine Failure

Initial findings from the examination of the airplane include:

&#8226;The left engine inlet separated from the engine during the flight. Debris from the engine inlet damaged the airplane fuselage, wing and empennage,


&#8226;A 5-inch by 16-inch hole was found in the left fuselage just above the left wing,


&#8226;No fan blade or inlet material was found in the hole and the passenger interior compartment was not penetrated, and


&#8226;During the accident sequence, the airplane experienced a cabin depressurization.


&#8226;The aircraft maintenance records are being reviewed.


Initial findings from the engine examination include:

&#8226;One fan blade separated from the fan disk during the accident flight and


&#8226;The root of the separated fan blade remained in the fan hub; however, the remainder of the blade was not recovered.


Initial findings from the metallurgical examination conducted in the NTSB Materials Laboratory include:

&#8226;The fracture surface of the missing blade showed curving crack arrest lines consistent with fatigue crack growth. The fatigue crack region was 1.14-inches long and 0.217-inch deep,


&#8226;The center of the fatigue origin area was about 2.1 inches aft of the forward face of the blade root. No surface or material anomalies were noted during an examination of the fatigue crack origin using scanning electron microscopy and energy-dispersive x-ray spectroscopy, and


&#8226;The blades are manufactured of a titanium alloy and the root contact face is coated with a copper-nickel-indium alloy.
 
I know all the sections have a shroud to protect from blade/fan failures. I'd imagine a disc failure would be designed against too, but a disc failing is a very big deal (if this is really a disc section that they found).

The little chatter around here we've had (too busy with end of year stuff, and not enough data) is that there are two major concerns. 1. What led to the incident (in a way you hope it's ingestion, because anything else is very bad),and 2. Why was there an uncontained failure? #2 will likely be the bigger impact.

I'm also curious which engine version was on the 767-300ER... could be the Pratt and Whitney PW4000, GE CF6, or Rolls Royce RB211.



It was Cf6.





Nice pic...




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Well, that ones scrap.
 

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