Are the Saints "good enough in the trenches"? (1 Viewer)

Great Dane

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We have upgraded DE, LB and CB positions. But is this enough to sustain pressure from opposing teams? Last year both offensive and defensive lines took a step backwards. Do we have play off caliber lines? Will we win the war in the trenches?
 

zorro37

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On the O Line, it depends on Goodwin, if the consecutive 100 yard rushing games really were mostly thanks to him, and were not a fluke, we should be fine.
If Hollis can get through the middle, which I didn't see him do much, I think that is the key to our defensive line. In the 3 end 3rd down formation with Smith, Grant, Thomas, McCray we should destroy other teams.

IMO if they play like 2006 they are more than worthy of accolades, but not if they play like 2007. I'll be honest and say I think we will draft a defensive and offensive lineman in the first 3, probably a right and defensive tackle
 

DarkBuddha

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if both of the top DT's are gone at #10, I really see us picking up an OT. its not what I want but it is tough to argue with.
 

Joodas Avila

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As of right now, NO. Our interior line is suspect at best, we have a slew of "servicable" players. Our DE's are pretty good, but beyond that, we're not our DT's are B-teamers at best. I think if we could land one of the top DT's, either Ellis, Dorsey, Laws, or Balmer, the rest of our guys will be allot better off.
 

Nevimeister

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We're not nearly good enough. Our offensive line is decent in pass protection but that is helped by Drew Brees quick release and decision making. When the Titans used some stunts the offensive line was owned. They are not road graders who can open huge holes. We're also not very effective in 3rd/4th and short situations. End arounds have tended to work better (but is high risk)

Our defensive front is not nearly good enough. How many times did the Rams who were 0-8 convert 3rd and long in obvious pass situations??? Peyton Manning put up 42 points and the pressure wasn't forthcoming when a rookie was playing his 1st ever NFL game. McCray helps but we need to draft a defensive lineman. My preference would be trading up for Ellis/Dorsey and take a 3rd down edge rusher in about the 5th round range. There's a good history of being able to get someone there

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/2008-03-09-sw-defensive-line-prospects_N.htm

Kabeer Gbaja-Biamila Height: 6 ft 4 in (1.93 m) Weight: 247 lb (112 kg) College: San Diego State NFL Draft: 2000 / Round: 5 / Pick: 149

Alex Brown Height: 6 ft 3 in (1.91 m) Weight: 260 lb (118 kg) College: Florida
NFL Draft: 2002 / Round: 4 / Pick: 104

Robert Mathis Height: 6 ft 2 in (1.88 m) Weight: 245 lb (111 kg) College: Alabama A&M
NFL Draft: 2003 / Round: 5 / Pick: 138

Trent Cole Height: 6 ft 3 in (1.91 m) Weight: 270 lb (122 kg) College: Cincinnati
NFL Draft: 2005 / Round: 5 / Pick: 10

Elvis Dumervil Height: 5 ft 11 in (1.80 m) Weight: 260 lb (118 kg) College: Louisville
NFL Draft: 2006 / Round: 4 / Pick: 126

Mark Anderson Height: 6 ft 4 in (1.93 m) Weight: 255 lb (116 kg) College: Alabama
NFL Draft: 2006 / Round: 5 / Pick: 159

There is good history in drafting under sized 3rd down pass rush specialists in the 4th and 5th rounds. Jarvis Green and Jared Allen were drafted in the 4th round and Aaron Kampman in the 5th as well.
 

Domeination

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We're not nearly good enough. Our offensive line is decent in pass protection but that is helped by Drew Brees quick release and decision making. When the Titans used some stunts the offensive line was owned. They are not road graders who can open huge holes. We're also not very effective in 3rd/4th and short situations. End arounds have tended to work better (but is high risk)

Our defensive front is not nearly good enough. How many times did the Rams who were 0-8 convert 3rd and long in obvious pass situations??? Peyton Manning put up 42 points and the pressure wasn't forthcoming when a rookie was playing his 1st ever NFL game. McCray helps but we need to draft a defensive lineman. My preference would be trading up for Ellis/Dorsey and take a 3rd down edge rusher in about the 5th round range. There's a good history of being able to get someone there

I agree with your analysis of the weaknesses of our O and D lines, but I don't like the idea of trading up in round 1 simply b/c we still have too many needs.
 

BACKLASH

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As of right now, NO. Our interior line is suspect at best, we have a slew of "servicable" players. Our DE's are pretty good, but beyond that, we're not our DT's are B-teamers at best. I think if we could land one of the top DT's, either Ellis, Dorsey, Laws, or Balmer, the rest of our guys will be allot better off.




I really agree with that ALL the way!
 

TnSaint

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Our current starting NT and 3tech DT are well below average as well compared to the rest of the league.
 

birdog

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I heard Adam Schein this morning on Sirius say that D Robertson is done in NY! It remains to be seen if the Jets can either trade him, or cut him by the June 1 deadline. But DR will not play another down for the Jets.

Solly also mentioned that DR has a "knee" problem......

To me the most teling thing is how we don't try to adress the DT position in FA......that tells me that the Saints might have found a trading partner somwhere before they pick at #10, so they might be targeting to move up.
 

thundar1084

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We had almost the same lines in 2007 that we had in 2006 when we came 1 game short of the SB. The only difference was Campbell and Young were out due to injuries. Our biggest problem last year was productivity. Both Jamal Brown and Charles Grant did not come back with the types of performances that we expected from them. E.J. was not the blocking TE like Campbell and that hurt the running game also. The coaches thought that Young was going to be able to come back and play so they only went after backups in FA and not a permanent starter. With that being said, I think we can benefit from a blocking TE, if Campbell doesn't come back, a speed pass rusher, and a young and athletic DT. I think that all 3 can be addressed in the draft.
 

CitySaint

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The problems on defense was the subpar play by our D-ends. They played well at filling lanes to stop the run, the whole defense did a decent job of that. The problem is that our d-ends were horrible at putting pressure on the qb. The posters here can shift the blame to the inside of the d-line all they want, but the bottomline is our so-called probowl d-ends did not play well.

The key to our success defensively is how well those two guys on the outside play. It is an absolute must that we get better production from the guys we already have. Hiring that D-line guru to me is a step in that direction. I don't see the interior of the D-line being that suspect with the exception of needing maybe more youth there.
 

Ryano

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We need more push from our DT's on passing downs so that oposing QB's can't step up when Will smith comes of the edge. I can't tell you number of almost sacks he had last season that would have been there if the QB couldn't step up?!?!
 

Mojomajik9

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I'm not disagreeing exactly that DT is one of our weakest links, but I do think Brian Young is really under appreciated.

It isn't really fair to judge him by 2007 as he was injured for the majority of his time, but in 2006 he posted 46 tackles and 5.5 sacks.

To compare some of the big name DTs that have changed teams during free agency, Young holds his own.

Shaun Rogers in 2007, his most prolific sack season, had 39 tackles and 7 sacks.

Dewayne Robertson in 2007 had 57 tackles and 4 sacks. He averages around 3 sacks per year.

Corey Williams had 35 tackles and 7 sacks in 2007, and also 2006.

Even Albert Haynesworth posted just 40 tackles and 6 sacks.

Outside of Tommie Harris and Darnell Docket, no other DT posted near double digit sacks.

I know stats only tell half the tale, but I think we can grab Laws or Sims in the 2nd and be fine. I think taking a top flight CB in the draft is a must. You're not going to sack the QB every down and if the opposing QB only needs 3 seconds to see David/Craft have allowed their WR to run right by them....well...it's going to be a repeat of last year.
 

GoBnG

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I didnt want to thread jack, but let me ask this question. How would you feel if our first three rds went like this:

1st - Ryan Clady OT (Considering Ellis, Dorsey and Gholston are gone)
2nd - Trevor Laws DT
3rd - Chevis Jackson CB

I'd be pretty happy with this.
 

bergeaux

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We're not nearly good enough. Our offensive line is decent in pass protection but that is helped by Drew Brees quick release and decision making. When the Titans used some stunts the offensive line was owned. They are not road graders who can open huge holes. We're also not very effective in 3rd/4th and short situations. End arounds have tended to work better (but is high risk)

Our defensive front is not nearly good enough. How many times did the Rams who were 0-8 convert 3rd and long in obvious pass situations??? Peyton Manning put up 42 points and the pressure wasn't forthcoming when a rookie was playing his 1st ever NFL game. McCray helps but we need to draft a defensive lineman. My preference would be trading up for Ellis/Dorsey and take a 3rd down edge rusher in about the 5th round range. There's a good history of being able to get someone there

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/2008-03-09-sw-defensive-line-prospects_N.htm

Kabeer Gbaja-Biamila Height: 6 ft 4 in (1.93 m) Weight: 247 lb (112 kg) College: San Diego State NFL Draft: 2000 / Round: 5 / Pick: 149

Alex Brown Height: 6 ft 3 in (1.91 m) Weight: 260 lb (118 kg) College: Florida
NFL Draft: 2002 / Round: 4 / Pick: 104

Robert Mathis Height: 6 ft 2 in (1.88 m) Weight: 245 lb (111 kg) College: Alabama A&M
NFL Draft: 2003 / Round: 5 / Pick: 138

Trent Cole Height: 6 ft 3 in (1.91 m) Weight: 270 lb (122 kg) College: Cincinnati
NFL Draft: 2005 / Round: 5 / Pick: 10

Elvis Dumervil Height: 5 ft 11 in (1.80 m) Weight: 260 lb (118 kg) College: Louisville
NFL Draft: 2006 / Round: 4 / Pick: 126

Mark Anderson Height: 6 ft 4 in (1.93 m) Weight: 255 lb (116 kg) College: Alabama
NFL Draft: 2006 / Round: 5 / Pick: 159

There is good history in drafting under sized 3rd down pass rush specialists in the 4th and 5th rounds. Jarvis Green and Jared Allen were drafted in the 4th round and Aaron Kampman in the 5th as well.

I'm with ya on the analysis, good stuff. Unfortunately, your examples of good pass rushers in the late rounds makes it sound like it's easy to do. Those are six examples out of how many that were drafted in that same time frame? It's really hit or miss and hard to know for sure in late rounds. It's not easy.
 

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