Are we just stuck with harpers contract? (1 Viewer)

SAINT HOUSTON #1

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What are the possible alternate solutions if any that we can do to free cap space. does restructure help or do we even want to keep him past this year or next. Can he just tear up the current contract? Not that he would but is there a remedy?
 

Ross

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$6,100,000 of the $7,100,000 cap hit from his contract is dead money.

So if he left the team for one reason or another we'd still be on the hook for 6.1 million this year no matter what.
 

AgnesT

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Are we stuck with him? For this season, yeah. If we cut him, that is 6.5m against the cap. Next season, however is a different story.
 

St.Fury

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Please explain this 'dead money'. Does that refer to monies already paid? Like signing bonuses and whatnot? Paid but not counted against the cap yet?
 

BoNcHiE

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Yep.

It's going to be really painful when Ed Reed signs for less. William Moore got less as well.
Goldson just a touch more.

I think Loomis was high when we signed Harper to that contract. It's literally still top of the market two years later.
 

jayd265

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Please explain this 'dead money'. Does that refer to monies already paid? Like signing bonuses and whatnot? Paid but not counted against the cap yet?
i believe the "Dead money" is signing bonus/guaranteed money left on the contracts...

for example (not for any particular reason), jahri evans contract for "dead money" is this:

2013 - 12,840,000
2014 - 9,130,000
2015 - 5,420,000
2016 - 2,210,000

so as time goes on, your signing bonus/guaranteed money goes down because its getting paid out so the dead money tied up in your contract goes down so it makes it easier to let you go if you are just taking up space on the team...
 

stadanko

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Please explain this 'dead money'. Does that refer to monies already paid? Like signing bonuses and whatnot? Paid but not counted against the cap yet?
From what I understand, the dead money DOES count against the cap. Then if you sign a suitable replacement you're looking at however much he's trying to get. Then you have pretty much double the amount tied up in one safety position and there's no guarantee that his replacement plays any better in our system. I know it hurts to hear, but I don't think Payton or Loomis see safety as a position of need this offseason, at least in free agency. I feel like they're willing to roll with what we have and maybe a draft pick or UDFA for more competition.
 

St.Fury

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From what I understand, the dead money DOES count against the cap. Then if you sign a suitable replacement you're looking at however much he's trying to get. Then you have pretty much double the amount tied up in one safety position and there's no guarantee that his replacement plays any better in our system. I know it hurts to hear, but I don't think Payton or Loomis see safety as a position of need this offseason, at least in free agency. I feel like they're willing to roll with what we have and maybe a draft pick or UDFA for more competition.
You misunderstood. "Counted against the cap yet" as in prior to the current year. My understand of 'dead money' is money that has previously been spent (or guaranteed) but not counting against the cap until the current year's cap number. I'm asking if this is correct.
 

Ross

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Here's how it works...

Signing bonuses are prorated over the length of a contract for salary-cap purposes. If a player leaves the team before his contract expires, the remaining prorated portion of the bonus is counted immediately, in a lump sum, against the cap.

The flip side of dead money is a loophole in the cap rules that allows teams to create additional cap space.

Owners who want to spend more money, rather than pinch pennies, have an easy way to get some wiggle room. If a team has cap space remaining late in a season, because, say, space left for emergency injury replacements was not required, there is a way to push that cap room to the following year.

A team can do this by signing a player to a contract that calls for impossible-to-achieve bonuses; under the rules, a bonus added to a contract during the season is counted against the current cap as "likely to be earned," although it might never be paid.
 

Sev705

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Signing bonuses get paid immediately and then is spread out over the length of the contract. If the player is cut say year 3 of a 5 year deal, the years left with "dead money" like the signing bonuses get accelerated to the year they are cut. Since the money has already been paid it must be accounted for on the books.

I think Harper has three years left so next year his dead money should be around 4 million so he should be easier to cut.
 

PHdeacon

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$6,100,000 of the $7,100,000 cap hit from his contract is dead money.

So if he left the team for one reason or another we'd still be on the hook for 6.1 million this year no matter what.
One of the worst contracts the Saints have ever done. It's still almost worth it just to get rid of this guy.He's cost the Saints more wins than any one player on the team in recent years.:aargh:
 

Ross

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I think Harper has three years left so next year his dead money should be around 4 million so he should be easier to cut.
Harper is a UFA in 2015.

His total cap hit for 2014 is $7.9 million

If we trade him it does not count right?
It's already been paid to him so yes it counts no matter what.
One of the worst contracts the Saints have ever done. It's still almost worth it just to get rid of this guy.He's cost the Saints more wins than any one player on the team in recent years.:aargh:
Having him on the team is without a doubt worth far more than $1 million next year!

Having almost zero pass rush does not bode well for Harpers style of play.

He is better in coverage than Bernard Pollard a guy whom many are high within this forum as a potential pick up.

Pollard is a hard nosed hard hitting safety there's no doubt about it but Roman Harper in 2011 was far superior to Pollard in 2012!

I'm excited to see Harper under Rob Ryan next year and I'm more than confident he can get back to what he does best!
 

1badsailor

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Yep.

It's going to be really painful when Ed Reed signs for less. William Moore got less as well.
Goldson just a touch more.

I think Loomis was high when we signed Harper to that contract. It's literally still top of the market two years later.
None of the players mentioned would bring the physicality that harper brings consistently. How can the defensive leader of the team not deserve what he is getting? The man does everything for this defense.. we have a safety who is our best player against the run and one of our only players who doesn't shy away from contact..I doubt those other players would want to play for the saints with our current roster because they will look very bad coming down hill 20 times a game against rbs and getting there bodies messed up. All I'm saying is we can't forget that we have at least 4 men from the front 7 that shouldn't be starting. Without harper and jenkins teams would run for 250 a game on us because they are our most willing tacklers even our lbs seem to be content with being blocked..
 

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