Are you willing to get the Covid vaccine when offered? (27 Viewers)

[DaveXA]

Thankfully it's not looking good for those challenging the mandate.

U.S. Supreme Court justice rejects challenge to Maine COVID-19 vaccine mandate

U.S. Supreme Court Justice Stephen Breyer on Tuesday turned away a religious challenge to a requirement that healthcare workers in Maine be vaccinated against COVID-19, the latest such bid rejected by the nation's top judicial body.

www.reuters.com

Breyer's order is the third time the Supreme Court has rejected an attempt to challenge a COVID-19 vaccine mandate. Justice Sonia Sotomayor this month refused to block New York City's requirement that public school teachers and employees be vaccinated. Justice Amy Coney Barrett in August denied a bid by Indiana University students to block that school's vaccination mandate.

What's interesting here is Barret is a Trump nominee and part of the conservative wing. Historically when these types
of cases go before the whole court they typically follow the ruling of the justice who made the original ruling.

I read another article this morning,but can't find it now. It said the current Supreme Court has no interest in reopening
the Jacobson v. Massachusetts decision made in 1905 which upheld a states right to enforce a vaccine mandate.

Yeah, the precedent has long been clear on this. So far, the court's measured response to vaccine mandates and rules have been upheld. Not surprised to see they're pretty much unanimous on this front.

 

[DaveXA]

I thought i heard that he tried for the religeous exemtion. which i don't think people understand there is a lot of questions you have to answer to get that, which most are hard to "prepare" for. They have this thought that all you have to do is say "its against my religon"... it doesn't work that way...

Yeah, the religiois exemption is actually very difficult to get, which is how it should be. If I were running things, there would be no provision for religious exemptions. The only expemtions I would allow would be legitimate health reasons.

 

[Sailorsaint]

Yeah, the religiois exemption is actually very difficult to get, which is how it should be. If I were running things, there would be no provision for religious exemptions. The only expemtions I would allow would be legitimate health reasons.

I think it would have to be a recognized, organized religion. Then their tenets be known widely. The only reason there is a questionaire to fill out is because people are claiming their "own religion".

 

[Optimus Prime]

I think it would have to be a recognized, organized religion. Then their tenets be known widely. The only reason there is a questionaire to fill out is because people are claiming their "own religion".

It's hard to say I'm a devout Catholic and have deep religious issues with this vaccine when the Pope says there are no issues, get the shot

 

[DaveXA]

It's hard to say I'm a devout Catholic and have deep religious issues with this vaccine when the Pope says there are no issues, get the shot

And fortunately that's the case for a number of other well-known religions also.

 

[faceman]

I think it would have to be a recognized, organized religion. Then their tenets be known widely. The only reason there is a questionaire to fill out is because people are claiming their "own religion".

The constitution forbids government involvement in establishing and involvement in organized religion. It's the old separation of church and state we were taught as kids.

Here's another good article I found about religion and opposition to the vaccine. There was a decision in 2010 by the 3rd
circuit court. It ruled the plaintiff's refusal to take the flu vaccine was a medical decision.not a religious one. The article also
reaffirms why it's very difficult to get a religious exemption .

Sorting out vaccine mandates, religion and the law

Coronavirus vaccine mandates are spreading, and with them, pushback based on religion. In Washington, D.C., about 1,500

www.politifact.com

Wiley pointed to a 2020 case when an employee at Children’s Hospital of Philadelphia refused to get a flu vaccine. She was fired and then she sued, saying she had been discriminated against for her religion. The Third Circuit U.S. Court of Appeals didn’t buy it.

In terms of religion, the court wrote that it was looking for beliefs that "address fundamental and ultimate questions having to do with deep and imponderable matters," and "are comprehensive in nature."

The court said the employee had given inconsistent reasons, at one point having said that she thought the vaccine would do more harm than good. That, the court said, was a medical, not religious, belief.

Courts might judge present religious sincerity based on past behavior.

 

[DaveXA]

Good news for booster options.

FDA clears Johnson & Johnson and Moderna booster shots for millions of people https://www.cnbc.com/2021/10/20/fda...lions-of-people.html?__source=androidappshare

 

[FullMonte]

Saw an interesting stat today. Apparently, the study done in Israel showed that there were 2.7 incidents of myocarditis for every 100,000 individuals who were vaccinated. Many anti-vax individuals have used this as a reason not to get it.

However, that same study showed that there were 11 incidents of myocarditis for every 100,000 individuals who were infected with COVID. So, it would appear that you are four times more likely to get myocarditis from COVID than from the vaccine.

Heart Problem More Common After Covid-19 Than After Vaccination, Study Finds (Published 2021)

The research did not assess the risks specifically for young males, who are the most likely to develop the rare side effect.

www.nytimes.com

 

[DaveXA]

Saw an interesting stat today. Apparently, the study done in Israel showed that there were 2.7 incidents of myocarditis for every 100,000 individuals who were vaccinated. Many anti-vax individuals have used this as a reason not to get it.

However, that same study showed that there were 11 incidents of myocarditis for every 100,000 individuals who were infected with COVID. So, it would appear that you are four times more likely to get myocarditis from COVID than from the vaccine.

Heart Problem More Common After Covid-19 Than After Vaccination, Study Finds (Published 2021)

The research did not assess the risks specifically for young males, who are the most likely to develop the rare side effect.

www.nytimes.com

The question that needs to be asked is in a completely random 100,000 people, how many of those would have incidents of myocarditis? And how would that compare to the 2.7 for those who got vaccinated?

 

[Booker]

Good news for booster options.

FDA clears Johnson & Johnson and Moderna booster shots for millions of people https://www.cnbc.com/2021/10/20/fda...lions-of-people.html?__source=androidappshare

And also allowing mix and match boosters. I had the Pfizer, but I’m interested in getting a Moderna booster, since they seem to show longer term efficacy.

 

[sammymvpknight]

Got my flu shot this morning. I would have actually forgotten that I even got it if I didn't just take off my shirt and see a bandaid on my arm. Not quite the COVID vax experience for either series.

 

[Grumpy Old Manatee]

So what happens to the employee that lied on the disclaimer?

They get suspended for 21 games…

 

[livefromDC]

Got my flu shot this morning. I would have actually forgotten that I even got it if I didn't just take off my shirt and see a bandaid on my arm. Not quite the COVID vax experience for either series.

I've been getting a flu shot annually now for 20+ years. I'm assuming you have as well. What exactly surprises you about this, doc? Getting a flu shot is like running into Brad from accounting in the elevator. Of course you don't work with him every day, but you see him often enough that you remember his name and aren't shocked to see him standing there when the elevator doors open. The COVID vaccine is like stepping into an elevator find a very large dog in a lion costume. You might crap your pants the first couple times it happens. Once the fright wears off, you're thankful it wasn't a real lion.

 

[Saint_Ward]

The question that needs to be asked is in a completely random 100,000 people, how many of those would have incidents of myocarditis? And how would that compare to the 2.7 for those who got vaccinated?

I know I found some stats on this before, but can't recall.... so I looked it up again. It's probably a bit tricky, since many cases go unreported. Also not sure how it is as a function of age.

Viral Myocarditis - StatPearls - NCBI Bookshelf

The incidence of myocarditis is approximately 1.5 million cases worldwide per year. Incidence is usually estimated between 10 to 20 cases per 100,000 persons. The overall incidence is unknown and probably underdiagnosed. In the United States, the frequency of myocarditis is difficult to ascertain as many cases are subclinical. In community-based populations, the prevalence and outcomes of myocarditis are unknown as epidemiologic studies suggest that the majority of Coxsackie B virus infections, an important cause of myocarditis are subclinical, thus following a benign course.

 

[Saint_Ward]

Another way to look at the risk difference. Research from last year.

Association Between COVID-19 and Myocarditis...

Viral infections are a common cause of myocarditis. Some studies have indicated an association between COVID-19 and myocarditis.

www.cdc.gov

Since the introduction of mRNA COVID-19 vaccines in the United States in December 2020, an elevated risk for myocarditis among mRNA COVID-19 vaccine recipients has been observed, particularly among males aged 12–29 years, with 39–47 expected cases of myocarditis, pericarditis, and myopericarditis per million second mRNA COVID-19 vaccine doses administered (6). A recent study from Israel reported that mRNA COVID-19 vaccination was associated with an elevated risk for myocarditis (risk ratio = 3.24; 95% CI = 1.55–12.44); in the same study, a separate analysis showed that SARS-CoV-2 infection was a strong risk factor for myocarditis (risk ratio = 18.28, 95% CI = 3.95–25.12) (4). On June 23, 2021, the Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices concluded that the benefits of COVID-19 vaccination clearly outweighed the risks for myocarditis after vaccination (6). The present study supports this recommendation by providing evidence of an elevated risk for myocarditis among persons of all ages with diagnosed COVID-19.

Not sure how risk ratios work, but the virus value is 6 times bigger than the m-RNA vaccine number.