Are you willing to get the Covid vaccine when offered? (3 Viewers)

[DaveXA]

Good luck with that. California is one of 5 states who don't allow religious exemptions.

Yeah, I'm probably more religious than most, and I'm not a fan of religious exemptions on anything, much less related to Covid. There shouldn't be any exemptions outside of legitimate health reasons verified by a doctor.

 

[whiteshadowen]

Yeah, you can save all that garbage for folks that truly deserve compassion/empathy....



I'm truly sorry about your brother, I have also experienced this kind of loss, it sucks because you are really powerless to help in most cases...

But, the point you are missing is that by being vaxxed he is actually also protecting others around him and he very well could have been taking a bed needed for other patients, in some areas he is putting others at risk due to lack of resources at so many hospitals....

I think considering those points, you may not agree that they don't deserve much empathy but maybe you can understand why folks feel that way....

I am not missing the point of why some folks may feel and react in this way, I just think it is misguided. How someone got on the deathbed / grave is immaterial. No longer matters anymore. They are there. Their loved ones are there. At that point I think you should set aside your differences or opinions and give whatever comfort you can.

 

[DaveXA]

I am not missing the point of why some folks may feel and react in this way, I just think it is misguided. How someone got on the deathbed / grave is immaterial. No longer matters anymore. They are there. Their loved ones are there. At that point I think you should set aside your differences or opinions and give whatever comfort you can.

For the families, sure, but for the irresponsible individual who didn't care enough about his own as well as other people's health, I have a hard time being sympathetic. And sorry, but no, how he got there is absolutely relevant.

 

[faceman]

Yeah, I'm probably more religious than most, and I'm not a fan of religious exemptions on anything, much less related to Covid. There shouldn't be any exemptions outside of legitimate health reasons verified by a doctor.

It was posted earlier. Religious exemptions are extremely hard to get even in states that allow them. I'll see if I can find
the questionnaire that went along with the application.

There is also precedent with a lower court decision. I believe the state was VA. A hospital worker was fired for refusing a mandatory flu shot. He sued stating the vaccine went against his religious beliefs. The 3rd circuit court ruled his
refusing the vaccine was a medical decision,not a religious one. The supreme court refused to hear it and allowed the
decision to stand.

 

[DaveXA]

It was posted earlier. Religious exemptions are extremely hard to get even in states that allow them. I'll see if I can find
the questionnaire that went along with the application.

There is also precedent with a lower court decision. I believe the state was VA. A hospital worker was fired for refusing a mandatory flu shot. He sued stating the vaccine went against his religious beliefs. The 3rd circuit court ruled his
refusing the vaccine was a medical decision,not a religious one. The supreme court refused to hear it and allowed the
decision to stand.

Indeed. Good reminder. Same for federal employees. The exemption form is lengthy, and you have to substantiate the reason for the exemption. Just saying your religion doesn't believe in it will not suffice.

 

[whiteshadowen]

For the families, sure, but for the irresponsible individual who didn't care enough about his own as well as other people's health, I have a hard time being sympathetic. And sorry, but no, how he got there is absolutely relevant.

I guess I have to go back to the example of my BIL on that one. Seeing him on that deathbed, in pain. I no longer felt angry at him. I no longer judged him for the things he did. I just felt overwhelming sorrow that I was about to lose this person who had been such a promising wonderful person at one time. And I would have done anything to take away that pain and grief that he was experiencing and for him to have one more chance. I think that if we lose that ability to feel compassion that we are greatly lessened by it. I'm a Christian, and I fall far far short of what I should be for sure. But I think Jesus calls us to be forgiving and compassionate and I do not feel that anywhere in the Bible does He qualify that love we should have for our brothers. I think that He calls us to have love for even the worst of us. Are there consequences? Yeah, sure. Two theives on the crosses right beside Him. Consequences. But he also granted mercy to the thief who called on Him as Lord. He gave us a new commandment, to love one another. I think we need to do that.

 

[donato]

I guess I have to go back to the example of my BIL on that one. Seeing him on that deathbed, in pain. I no longer felt angry at him. I no longer judged him for the things he did. I just felt overwhelming sorrow that I was about to lose this person who had been such a promising wonderful person at one time. And I would have done anything to take away that pain and grief that he was experiencing and for him to have one more chance. I think that if we lose that ability to feel compassion that we are greatly lessened by it. I'm a Christian, and I fall far far short of what I should be for sure. But I think Jesus calls us to be forgiving and compassionate and I do not feel that anywhere in the Bible does He qualify that love we should have for our brothers. I think that He calls us to have love for even the worst of us. Are there consequences? Yeah, sure. Two theives on the crosses right beside Him. Consequences. But he also granted mercy to the thief who called on Him as Lord. He gave us a new commandment, to love one another. I think we need to do that.

Quite a bit of difference between addiction and willful ignorance that puts your own life in danger and the lives of others.

 

[DaveXA]

I guess I have to go back to the example of my BIL on that one. Seeing him on that deathbed, in pain. I no longer felt angry at him. I no longer judged him for the things he did. I just felt overwhelming sorrow that I was about to lose this person who had been such a promising wonderful person at one time. And I would have done anything to take away that pain and grief that he was experiencing and for him to have one more chance. I think that if we lose that ability to feel compassion that we are greatly lessened by it. I'm a Christian, and I fall far far short of what I should be for sure. But I think Jesus calls us to be forgiving and compassionate and I do not feel that anywhere in the Bible does He qualify that love we should have for our brothers. I think that He calls us to have love for even the worst of us. Are there consequences? Yeah, sure. Two theives on the crosses right beside Him. Consequences. But he also granted mercy to the thief who called on Him as Lord. He gave us a new commandment, to love one another. I think we need to do that.

That's understandable. I hear what you're saying, and I think sorrow and grief are appropriate. But, if my family member doesn't protect themselves and act responsibly, my sympathy will be more limited and they'll still bear responsibility for their actions. If genuinely sorry for what they did and express regret, I'd me more inclined to express that compassion. But if they're still arrogant and unrepentant, well, I'd have a hard time with that. That might not be unconditional love, but we all have our limits. We're human and no matter how much we might say we love others unconditionally, we ultimately love others with all kinds of conditions. I think that's just being honest about our ability to love.

Anyway. I just thought I'd drop my 2 cents worth. Don't want to derail the discussion from the thread topic too much.

 

[jahsoul357]

Yeah, I'm probably more religious than most, and I'm not a fan of religious exemptions on anything, much less related to Covid. There shouldn't be any exemptions outside of legitimate health reasons verified by a doctor.

I'm faith led in everything that I do and I don't agree with anyone taking a religious stance on this one. On the same note, I question how we can crap on someone's personal conviction and believe that the mandate never truly set out to solve the problem. At the end of the day, it is what it is.

 

[DaveXA]

I'm faith led in everything that I do and I don't agree with anyone taking a religious stance on this one. On the same note, I question how we can crap on someone's personal conviction and believe that the mandate never truly set out to solve the problem. At the end of the day, it is what it is.

I'm not sure why you'd say a mandate doesn't set out to solve the problem when it's part of how we get out of this pandemic? The vaccines work, and the results are compelling.

 

[livefromDC]

I am not missing the point of why some folks may feel and react in this way, I just think it is misguided. How someone got on the deathbed / grave is immaterial. No longer matters anymore. They are there. Their loved ones are there. At that point I think you should set aside your differences or opinions and give whatever comfort you can.

Guess you feel the same way about terrorists, mass shooters, etc. You're better than me.

 

[whiteshadowen]

Guess you feel the same way about terrorists, mass shooters, etc. You're better than me.

I struggle too. I get angry at lot's of criminals for what they do. And think they should face consequences as the law requires. Still, we need to find the compassion for the life wasted. They were somebodies little boy or girl, we can grieve for those family members. Lot's of victims. It's really a crappy world we live in sometimes.

 

[jahsoul357]

I'm not sure why you'd say a mandate doesn't set out to solve the problem when it's part of how we get out of this pandemic? The vaccines work, and the results are compelling.

Time will tell. Being vaccinated doesn't stop one from being a source of transmission and if they really cared about the spread, there would be equal restrictions. So if it isn't about the spread, who are we really protecting? Question is wonder about, if an unvaccinated person spreads COVID to someone that is vaccinated and they get sick, do we look at the person who spread the COVID or the one that wholly trusted the vaccine?

 

[Saint_Ward]

I wonder if this doctor has been constantly exposed over time and has just kept antibodies present at a higher level, but not actually getting sick?

Doubt it. He's very careful. But he did say the frustrating thing about this is how wide spread the antibody response is. Can't predict how protected someone will be. Just on antibody count...

 

[Saint_Ward]

Wifes uncle hasn't been back to work sincee. Its been 5ish months, give or take... His employer called him and let him go because he still can't work. (in Arkansas) they also told him not to apply for unemployment.. um.. nice try... I am not sure if he did or not, not sure how they can tell him that..

Technically it would be disability. Probably short term, then long term. Should be covered.