Cajun Cannon out and Drew Brees in working with Jim Mora (2 Viewers)

[jasonsw]

I doubt it makes a difference. Mora was always conservative to a fault and even though Carl Smith didn’t join him in Indy, Mora still had the same deer in the headlights look every time he got into the playoffs. Moras big fault was that his teams won on playing strong defense and absolutely mistake free conservative offense. In the playoffs that got worse. I swear he would’ve punted on first down because he was scared to take chances. Compare that with New England, Payton, Reid. These guys realize it’s playoffs and you have to dig deep and come up with something different and get an edge. That was never Mora. It did great in the regular season, but not in the playoffs, and I don’t think Brees would’ve made the difference.

You read my mind. Him and Marty were one the same. Great D so-so offense, Kansas City just had a stronger run game. Both relied heavily on F.Gs and defensive generated scores.

 

[jasonsw]

No I think you’d never win a super bowl with Mora’s conservative style teams. I don’t think Drew would have the records he has if he had stayed around playing Marty ball either. We have been enjoying something really special when a player with Drew’s skill set meets the mad scientist CSP. I just hope that whoever follows Drew they can have that same chemistry.

Yep great QBs need to great offensive coaches to work with to achieve optimal results. Drew in his first season while still probably recovering from his shoulder surgery somewhat obliterated his best season in San Diego. That first seasin here was just the beginning of greater things to come.

Drew with Marty probably would have just been a very good Q.B, perhaps a borderline HOFer and not the record shattering one he has become.

 

[J.T.]

The issue is...who is the offensive coordinator???? If it's Carl Smith...not sure it helps.... that guy was not good in terms of his play calling....

Carl Smith was concrete albatross with a lead choke collar. Nobody could overcome that.

 

[kcirdor]

Wrong. The moment Mora would get a two score lead he would begin to run the ball every down and play prevent defense and squander the lead.

 

[kcirdor]

Carl Smith was concrete albatross with a lead choke collar. Nobody could overcome that.

That was Jim Mora telling him to run the ball.

 

[kcirdor]

That could be a pretty funny miked up during a time out:

DREW: Coach, I'm thinking we go Empty Trips Right Tango X Slant Verticals Pony Dog Option Avocado and catch the safety napping. What do you think?

CARL SMITH: Hmmm. Let's do I-formation off-tackle again.

Fixed it for you:
Carl Smith(super bowl winning QB coach): Ok sounds good.

Mora: Run the damn ball! we need to milk the clock and play prevent defense.

"carl smith would have done in Drew Brees"
Also "Carl Smith helps Russel Wilson become one of the top 3 QBs in the league and turned Matt Leinert into a Heisman winner"

 

[sfidc3]

That was Jim Mora telling him to run the ball.

I tend to lean towards believing this was how it went down. Carl Smith's career after the Saints would support this notion i believe....

 

[kcirdor]

I tend to lean towards believing this was how it went down. Carl Smith's career after the Saints would support this notion i believe....

right. Carl Smith did not run the defense and we went into Prevent defense every game we had a lead in. I shed a lot of tears growing up because of that prevent defense.

 

[HouseCall]

Carl Smith ran an offense that ran heavily and passed selectively through an great possession receiver (Eric Martin) and giant Tight Ends with good hands and exceptional downfield and run blocking abilities (Hoby Brenner and John Tice). So Brees, with his accuracy and ability to work progressions would have excelled in a Carl Smith offense and undoubtedly made it much more efficient.


The biggest issues with the Mora Saints offensively were:

1. We had a defense that was incredibly disruptive and potent
2. Morten Andersen
3. Being in the same division as the Niners


Morten Andersen was an extremely dangerous weapon to have and that coupled with a stingy defense meant that Mora could afford to be more conservative since he had a big-legged kicker who was more accurate than any kicker during that era. Once the offense crossed the 40, the philosophy seemed to shift to a conservative "get Morten in range" offense rather than risk a turnover by being aggressive.

The defense was a security blanket for Mora. In his eyes, any lead was good enough, so if Morten could get him a 1-3 point lead, he was comfortable with that.

Playing in the same division as the legendary Montana, Young, Rice, Walsh 49ers cannot be understated in examining Jim Mora's short comings as a coach. If the 1986-1992 Saints were in any other division in football, they would have been multi-year division winners and likely won a playoff game (or several). In 1987, the Saints won 12 games and finished 2nd in the NFC West behind the Niners -- that record would have won the Central and the East that season. In 1992, the Saints again won 12 games and finished 2nd to the Niners -- 12 wins would have won the Central in 92'.

 

[sfidc3]

Morten Andersen was an extremely dangerous weapon to have and that coupled with a stingy defense meant that Mora could afford to be more conservative since he had a big-legged kicker who was more accurate than any kicker during that era. Once the offense crossed the 40, the philosophy seemed to shift to a conservative "get Morten in range" offense rather than risk a turnover by being aggressive.

Except he wasn't a weapon in the playoffs at all....

I agree with some of what you are saying but the 9ers excuse kind of falls flat to me....we easily had a good enough defense to contend and beat the 9ers. We never had a coach that realized you need a more dynamic offense that is willing to take chances to go far in the playoffs....

 

[HouseCall]

Except he wasn't a weapon in the playoffs at all....

I agree with some of what you are saying but the 9ers excuse kind of falls flat to me....we easily had a good enough defense to contend and beat the 9ers. We never had a coach that realized you need a more dynamic offense that is willing to take chances to go far in the playoffs....

But that’s kind of the point. The Saints teams from 1987-1992 had a good enough defense and offense to win just about any NFL division aside the one they happened to be in. Their offense was serviceable but not dynamic and they could basically go blow for blow, as they were, with just about any team in the league — except the dynasty that was in their division running an offense that was revolutionary.

So the point I was making is that the Mora Saints were built exactly like Mora wanted and that would have been good enough for massive success in any division except the division we happened to be in.

 

[sfidc3]

But that’s kind of the point. The Saints teams from 1987-1992 had a good enough defense and offense to win just about any NFL division aside the one they happened to be in. Their offense was serviceable but not dynamic and they could basically go blow for blow, as they were, with just about any team in the league — except the dynasty that was in their division running an offense that was revolutionary.

So the point I was making is that the Mora Saints were built exactly like Mora wanted and that would have been good enough for massive success in any division except the division we happened to be in.

So that point kind of falls apart when you look at the reality of Mora's Saints. They lost every playoff game to teams that weren't the 9'ers.....they could go blow to blow with any team in the regular season, that strategy didn't work in the playoffs. IMO that is the single fact that Mora apologists seem to miss or ignore....

 

[Day1]

That could be a pretty funny miked up during a time out:

DREW: Coach, I'm thinking we go Empty Trips Right Tango X Slant Verticals Pony Dog Option Avocado and catch the safety napping. What do you think?

CARL SMITH: Hmmm. Let's do I-formation off-tackle again.

...and run right at Fridge Perry.

 

[David Robbins]

The issue is...who is the offensive coordinator???? If it's Carl Smith...not sure it helps.... that guy was not good in terms of his play calling....

With Carl Smith, no-one can win a SB. lol.

 

[MLU]

The combination of Jim Mora, Drew Brees, and the Dome Patrol Defense. Would the Saints be able to win a Super Bowl with that combination during that era?
Having Drew Brees, Eric Martin, and Dalton Hillard is a solid Big Three on offense. But would Jim Mora realize that?

Drew would not be the same QB obviously, but the Saints are a better team. No more of Bobby snatching defeat from the jaws of victory. Plus, the Saints become a more attractive team for free agents.