Can Coach Payton be successful without a top-flight Defensive Coordinator? (1 Viewer)


Resist, Ronald, resist!
Dec 7, 1998
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This post isn't a reflection of my feelings on yesterday's performance. I feel like the defense did enough to keep the game competitive had the offense gotten in any sort of rhythm.

This is about Coach Payton and his legacy as our coach and how he's seemingly squandered numerous seasons with a HOF QB on underwhelming and sometimes downright putrid defenses.

Gregg Williams is a dirty word around here and for good reason. His mishandling of his portion of the NFL investigation into so-called "bounties" helped set us back into the pit we find ourselves in now. But he was a pretty good coordinator on some pretty great Saints teams.

Gary Gibbs was a fair, yet underwhelming defensive coordinator from 06'-08'. He was jettisoned after 08' and Gregg Williams was brought in to give our defense a boost -- an edge -- an identity. A force of personality like Payton coexisting with a similar Williams seemed like a tall order. Payton established himself as Alpha Dog and gave Williams enough slack to do his thing. Some would argue it was too much slack given to a man with a tendency to push boundaries.

The pairing got off to a fast start as Payton's offense had spirited battles with William's defenses in camp and practices and in the end, they achieved unprecedented success as a team during Williams' tumultuous tenure.

<b>41-13 </b>

That's the Saints record (including postseason) from 2009-11. That included two division titles and a World Title.


That's Payton's record in the other seasons, (06'-08' and 2013-present) when you include the post season.

We experienced a nightmare in 2012 under Spags (who many respect as a coordinator) and we had an all-too brief resurgence under Rob Ryan in 2013. However many argue that he's not really considered a top-flight D-coordinator and that 2013 success was just a mirage.

Now we have Dennis Allen -- who has shown signs that he's improving the defense, no doubt --- but do you feel like he's going to get us to the next level defensively?

People have said, myself included, that our defense need only be average for us to contend but I wonder if that's true still. I seems like beyond stats and rankings, NFL defenses need an identity.

Does Sean Payton need a dynamic, aggressive coordinator to mesh with his aggressive style of offense? Is an aggressive defensive identity what is needed most of all?

Is Allen the person to bring that edge/identity or will the improvements be minor in the hopes of establishing a solid but not great defense?

Dennis Allen is the man with the job but is the man for the job? What can we expect of Allen's defense next season?


Super Forum Fanatic
Feb 16, 2005
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i agree with the defense this week, if the offense wouldnt have been poor we could have won

though the dropped pick 6 for moore would have changed the tone of the game

we need oline help as much or more than any group - even in games where the offensive numbers are good/great Drew takes alot of hits, too many


Patience pays..SB champs!
Mar 14, 2003
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Yes if coach finally decides to hand over play-calling to Carmichael or stop trying to drive with his foot on the brake pedal. The offense has been stagnant too many times this year. We have Drew Brees and good young receivers. Open it up and stop dinking and dunking. Regardless of what the defense is giving you, you have to take your shots to open things up. Detroit did.....


Subscribing Member
Mar 4, 2003
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Perhaps? Here is what it takes to get it done....

2015 Wade Phillips
2014 Matt Patricia
2013 Dan Quinn
2012 Dean Pees
2011 Perry Fewell
2010 Dom Capers
2009 Gregg Williams
2008 Dick LeBeau
2007 Steve Spags
2006 Ron Meeks


Son of Adam
VIP Contributor
Sep 21, 2006
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Saints Country
This defense has played against a lot of HOF and Pro Bowl QB's this year, and they haven't fared well against any of them. To beat them, you have to play good defense AND offense.

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