Carl Granderson sentenced to 6 months (2 Viewers)

[guidomerkinsrules]

So mister/misses insider information, what exactly did happen? And are these accusations based on facts or are they more falsehoods like the one that you kept repeating?

just out of curiosity, why is this the only thread you post on?

 

[The Reejer]

just out of curiosity, why is this the only thread you post on?

Thanks for asking in a nice manner. Mostly because I wanted to talk about something that I am informed on, and I don’t have a lot of time to look on other threads right now. My mom is recovering from a botched hip surgery, and it is taking up most of my free time.

And I am more of a player fan than a specific team fan. I used to be a one team guy, but with how much players get swapped around the league it makes it more difficult.

I like small college kids. I mostly follow the guys that went to Wyoming, but I also follow other small school kids, and other guys with interesting stories.

 

[Outbackjack]

What's up with the fan reactions like this dude was an anchor piece of the defense.
Isn't this his rookie year and he was undrafted?

Didn't we sign Mario Edwards and Wes Horton in the off season?
We still have Hendrickson.

I mean, it sucks losing anyone right before camp, but this dude would have been a long shot anyways right?

What?

On this thread?

Not one person mentioned they expected 1 single thing from him on the football field.

 

[StudioSaint]

Seriously, how have I been off the mark? I’m am going directly from the reports from the case.

Let's start with a simple fact to see how factually accurate you're being. According to each of the women, how many times did each of them have to push away Granderson's hand?

 

[The Reejer]

Let's start with a simple fact to see how factually accurate you're being. According to each of the women, how many times did each of them have to push away Granderson's hand?

I’m not 100% sure about this but from what I recall, the boob touching was twice and the crotch was once. Correct me if I’m wrong miss/mister insider information. And they didn’t say no, and neither of them knew about the other being touched until after they left the apartment, and were walking home.

UPDATE: Carl Granderson was released on Friday. And he will be under supervised probation, which can be served in a different state. The original Judge seemed to have it out for Granderson, called his therapist and asked personal questions. This in itself was improper abuse of power by the sitting judge. And with the reversal of the Appeals Judge in the sentencing it shows that it was the case.

 

[StudioSaint]

I’m not 100% sure about this but from what I recall, the boob touching was twice and the crotch was once. Correct me if I’m wrong miss/mister insider information. And they didn’t say no, and neither of them knew about the other being touched until after they left the apartment, and were walking home.

Both women claimed to have had to push away is hands a few times before he stopped.

Pushing away some one's hand is the same as saying no. If someone pushes away your hand, they are very clearly nonverbally telling you to stop.

Do you think it's okay to do whatever you want to a mute person since they can't verbally say no?

The original Judge seemed to have it out for Granderson, called his therapist and asked personal questions. This in itself was improper abuse of power by the sitting judge. And with the reversal of the Appeals Judge in the sentencing it shows that it was the case.

It does not in any way show an "abuse of power" or that the judge "had it out for Granderson." It simply shows the judge made a legal mistake. It happens and in this case the mistake was corrected.

I'm more concerned with whether or not the therapist answered any of the judges questions. That's not clear from the reports. If the therapist was not court appointed and did answer the judges questions, then that is a serious breach of patient confidentiality. Unless the therapist was court appointed or believed that Granderson was a danger to himself or others, it would have been illegal and unethical for them to answer the judges questions.

 

[The Reejer]

Both women claimed to have had to push away is hands a few times before he stopped.

Pushing away some one's hand is the same as saying no. If someone pushes away your hand, they are very clearly nonverbally telling you to stop.

Do you think it's okay to do whatever you want to a mute person since they can't verbally say no?
It does not in any way show an "abuse of power" or that the judge "had it out for Granderson." It simply shows the judge made a legal mistake. It happens and in this case the mistake was corrected.

I'm more concerned with whether or not the therapist answered any of the judges questions. That's not clear from the reports. If the therapist was not court appointed and did answer the judges questions, then that is a serious breach of patient confidentiality. Unless the therapist was court appointed or believed that Granderson was a danger to himself or others, it would have been illegal and unethical for them to answer the judges questions.

Do you have a link to the source that states how many times the girls pushed his hands away, or is it just another thing that you made up (like the “plead guilty”)? And seriously? Your argument that made the girls similar to a person that has a physical disability in which they cannot speak... these girls were fully able to speak.

The therapist did answer the questions, which were essentially, “has he had prior sexual abuse, assault, problems in his past?” And the Therapists answers were “no”.

From what I understand, it wasn’t a court appointed therapist. But the therapist answered the questions from the judge, and with the “no” responses, it supposedly had no negative influence on the judges sentencing.

The sentencing in which the judge ignored the plea deal that the prosecuting attorney and the defense attorneys agreed upon, and decided to hand out jail time instead of the unsupervised probation that was agreed upon in the plea deal.

How can you say that the judge didn’t have it out for Granderson? Especially when she risked her career by inappropriately asking confidential questions to a therapist of the defendant, in order to try and trap him and increase his sentence? That is a total abuse of judicial power. Being a “judge” doesn’t include doing your own investigation on a defendant. I think that the judge might have been assaulted when she was in college by a football player and wanted retribution, even if the player in question wasn’t guilty.

 

[The Reejer]

StudioSaint,
I’m saddened that you are into Social Justice and guilt before proven innocent, over Equal Justice and Due Process (innocent before being found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt). Please try to get out of any orders to serve on jury duty.

 

[The Reejer]

Oh boy.



Don’t do the crime if you can’t do the time.

You should update the story so that people aren’t set to prejudge Granderson. Especially since the original sentencing was reversed during the appeals process. And because of an inappropriate abuse of power by the initial sentencing judge.

 

[StudioSaint]

Do you have a link to the source that states how many times the girls pushed his hands away,..

It's in some of the sources already quoted in this thread that they pushed his hand away several times. Where are your sources that say otherwise?

This all started when you tried to downplay the allegations against Granderson by making up a hypothetical situation that did match the actual allegations in this case.

...or is it just another thing that you made up (like the “plead guilty”)?

You entered this thread by making stuff up. I didn't make anything up. I did misspeak when I said he plead "guilty" instead of saying he plead "no contest."

Pleading "no contest" is a lot closer to pleading "guilty" than it is to pleading "not guilty."

And seriously? Your argument that made the girls similar to a person that has a physical disability in which they cannot speak... these girls were fully able to speak.

You missed the point entirely.

You implied that even though both women pushed Granderson's hands away multiple times, since they never said "no" or "stop" then it couldn't be a sexual assault. You are wrong. If a person pushes away physical sexual advances multiple times, then that is the same as saying "no" or "stop." If a person keeps making physical sexual advances after being physically blocked or pushed away, then that is sexual assault, regardless of if what they were or weren't told.

The therapist did answer the questions, which were essentially, “has he had prior sexual abuse, assault, problems in his past?” And the Therapists answers were “no”.

Nothing I've read says what you're claiming here. Please provide a source for this. That's a weird question to ask a therapist. I'll have to see a credible source confirm this before I accept it as true.

How can you say that the judge didn’t have it out for Granderson?

I said nothing about the overruling of the judges sentence proves that the judge had it out for Granderson, that's not the same thing as saying the judge didn't have it out for Granderson.

It's an unprovable matter of opinion whether or not the judge had it out for Granderson, which is why I don't have an opinion on that.

Especially when she risked her career by inappropriately asking a therapist of the defendant, in order to try and trap him and increase his sentence?

This is just more exaggeration and wild opinionated speculation. The judge did not risk her career. Prove otherwise by showing how she's currently being disciplined or stripped of her judgeship. Prove that her career has been damaged.

Prove that she was trying to trap Granderson by talking to the therapist. For all you know, the judge was prepared to hand down a harsher sentence until she talked to the therapist.

That is a total abuse of judicial power. Being a “judge” doesn’t include doing your own investigation on a defendant.

Can you provide a direct quote from the judge from the that overruled her sentence in which that judge says she abused her power?

I think that the judge might have been assaulted when she was in college by a football player and wanted retribution, even if the player in question wasn’t guilty.

Why let a complete lack of supporting evidence or facts get in the way of blaming everything on a vindictive woman, am I right?

 

[StudioSaint]

StudioSaint,
I’m saddened that you are into Social Justice and guilt before proven innocent, over Equal Justice and Due Process (innocent before being found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt). Please try to get out of any orders to serve on jury duty.

Whoever you are,
You don't know me, let alone what I'm into. I see the term "Social Justice" thrown around a lot, but its a meaningless term to me. Just seems like a lazy way to try to make someone wrong or the enemy. I'm neither.

I support equal justice. Everything I've ever written in this thread and anywhere else on this board is evidence that I support equal justice. The same is true of my support for due process.

Don't you worry yourself with whether or not I ever serve on jury.

 

[StudioSaint]

You should update the story so that people aren’t set to prejudge Granderson. Especially since the original sentencing was reversed during the appeals process. And because of an inappropriate abuse of power by the initial sentencing judge.

Some important factual clarifications:

• The sentence was overruled, the charges to which he plead of no contest were not. He's still serving a reduced sentence.
• To this day, Granderson did not legally contest the allegations and charges against him, that's literally what no contest means.
• No on has shown any charges or disciplinary actions against the original judge for "abuse of power," at this point that is merely some people's opinion.

Just stating the facts.

 

[The Reejer]

Ok miss or mister facts, can you show me ONE source that says how many times his hand was pushed away? And it was also the Appeals Judges opinion that her actions were improper. We will have to wait to see if she gets any negative repercussions for her actions.

You have gone against your own supposed beliefs in equal justice when you went against the facts of the proceedings of the case, and you became the judge and jury and self determined that he was guilty. And you completely ignored the sequence of events that led him from the not guilty plea to the no contest.

And how can you still say that the judge didn’t have it out for him when she stepped out of her position, and acted inappropriately by asking the therapist questions. These actions were one of the reasons that the Appeals Judge decided to overturn the original harsh sentence. That, and he didn’t feel that Granderson was a danger to society for touching a girls arse *update*- because we were both wrong according to an article on this site, he just touched their bum (outside of their underwear, while they were laying next to him in his bed wearing just their underwear). Oooh yeah that is most definitely worth 6 months in jail...

And my hypothetical situation was exactly following the facts of the case as they were reported here in Wyoming, just with the script flipped with a female doing the touching.

So if you want to crucify Granderson for arse grabbing two girls that were wearing nothing but underwear in his bed, then so be it. But if I was in his situation, and two pretty girls decided to freely strip down to their underwear and hop into my bed, that it would show that they were interested. I might be wrong, and the new thing to do is strip down and hop into bed with a person, now just means “Don’t touch me, I don’t like you like that, I just want to be friends.”, I guess I’m just old school.

But you should send about 90% of the males in America to prison too. Because with the new standards for sexual assault, and harassment where it is considered rape if either of the sexual participants are intoxicated, and you can have HR have a sit down with you for simply opening a door for a female, or saying that she looks nice, and essentially needing a written contract to kiss, fondle or hug someone... FFS we will have a population shortage in the next two decades because of fear of litigation or imprisonment for attempting to get to the point of having a sexual encounter.

 

[StudioSaint]

Ok miss or mister facts, can you show me ONE source that says how many times his hand was pushed away?

Miss or mister whoever you are, I already told you those facts are in articles posted in this thread. Read them or don't, your choice.

And it was also the Appeals Judges opinion that her actions were improper.

That is correct. You kept trying to imply that the appeal judge accused her of abusing her power. That is not true.

You have gone against your own supposed beliefs in equal justice when you went against the facts of the proceedings of the case...

I've got the facts straight and corrected the one thing I misspoke on. Since you keep insisting you are the only one being factually accurate, let's put that to the test:

• What did the DA initially charge Granderson with?
• What was Granderson's response to those initial charges?
• What was then the plea agreement that the DA and Granderson struck?
• What were the charges and plea agreement that were taken before the initial judge?
• What was Granderson's plea when he appeared before the judge?
• Did the judge change Granderson's plea or his sentence?

...and you became the judge and jury and self determined that he was guilty.

You've got the facts wrong about what I've said in this thread.

I never once said he was guilty, because I don't know if he's guilty or not. You mistakenly assume that I think he's guilty. Before you accuse me of being dishonest, maybe you should first go back through everything I've written in this thread. If you do that, then it will be clear to you that I haven't decided his innocence or guilt and I haven't been talking about his guilt or innocence.

And how can you still say that the judge didn’t have it out for him...

Again, read what I actually wrote. I said you have no proof that the judge had it out for Granderson. You still don't. It's merely speculation and opinion on your part. I never once said the judge didn't have it out for Granderson, I simply pointed out that there's no way any of us can know if that is true or not. Like you, I can't know whether or not she had it our for Granderson.

You can have whatever opinion you want, but no one's opinion makes something true.

...yeah that is most definitely worth 6 months in jail...

It's considered sexual assault under Wyoming law and 6 months of prison time is within the sentencing guidelines for sexual assault under Wyoming law. Sounds like you have more of a problem with the laws of Wyoming than anything else.

And my hypothetical situation was exactly following the facts of the case as they were reported here in Wyoming...

Your hypothetical situation was and is still not consistent with the accusations made by the women.

So if you want to crucify Granderson...

I don't and I'm not.

...for arse grabbing two girls...

Which is sexual assault in Wyoming.

But if I was in his situation, and two pretty girls decided to freely strip down to their underwear and hop into my bed, that it would show that they were interested. I might be wrong...I guess I’m just old school.

Not only would you be wrong and old school, if you did what Granderson was accused of doing, you could be convicted of sexual assault and sentenced to prison in the state of Wyoming. Again, it seems like your main issue is with the laws of Wyoming.

But you should send about 90% of the males in America to prison too.

If they break the sexual assault laws of their states, then yes they should be sentenced according to their state's laws.

Because with the new standards for sexual assault, and harassment where it is considered rape if either of the sexual participants are intoxicated,

They are laws, not standards. All we have to do to stay out of prison is obey the law, right? Ignorance of the law is no excuse, right? We only have ourselves to blame if we break the law and go to prison, right?

...and you can have HR have a sit down with you for simply opening a door for a female, or saying that she looks nice...

I open doors for women and say they look nice at work a lot. I've never once had a complaint filed against me or had a "sit down" with HR. Sorry to hear you're having that trouble at work, maybe take a look at your own actions?

...and essentially needing a written contract to kiss, fondle or hug someone...

I'm not having a problem with any of that and neither are any of the men I know. Sorry to hear that you are, maybe take a look at your own actions?

...fear of litigation or imprisonment for attempting to get to the point of having a sexual encounter.

I don't have any of those fears and neither do any of the men I know. Sorry to hear that you are too afraid to try to have sexual encounters. I can't imagine how miserable that must be. Maybe you shouldn't be so afraid?

 

[The Reejer]

• What did the DA initially charge Granderson with? A: Third-degree sexual assault.
• What was Granderson's response to those initial charges? A: Not guilty
• What was then the plea agreement that the DA and Granderson struck? A: A plea of no contest to a charge of sexual battery and unlawful touching (2 misdemeanor charges that had unsupervised probation as the punishment).
• What were the charges and plea agreement that were taken before the initial judge? A: see answer above.
• What was Granderson's plea when he appeared before the judge? A: see answer above
• Did the judge change Granderson's plea or his sentence? No on the plea, yes on the sentencing. She dropped the terms of the plea agreement and sentenced him six months of jail with additional supervised probation.
• Any other questions? Because I have answers.