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Agreed.
Charles Barkley: Conservatives...they're really just fake Christians (1 Viewer)
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Agreed.
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StChadwick
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I understand that there are differences in understandings of when life begins, but what has always bothered me is the fact that abortion is legal in this country up until the woman is in labor at 9 months. Now premature fetuses have been known to survive at 6 months, so to me there is something wrong with this and am glad the Supreme Court took a look at partial birth abortion and stopped it, but of course other measures are used in its place. As for when fetuses feel pain, sticking an 8 week old human fetus in the palm of his hand he opens his mouth and pulls his hand away. These are the things christians know and make them concerned about the 4 millions abortions a year take place in America. We understand theres many factors that go into this happening and we arent about condemning the people as who are we to do that and what good would it do anyway? We understand for every abortion there's a woman that had it and man who participated. They need help as well and without helping them post abortion, the pro life community are failing in their mission.
I dont believe Christ would be deemed a heretic today as many religious of all types follow Christ's example in helping the needy without judgement. Back in Jesus' time, yes, He was deemed a heretic because they had something against people proclaiming themself as God. It wasnt the way they were expecting the messiah to come. They were expecting the messiah to release them from Roman bondage like in a chariot of fire scenario. Wasnt what they were expecting after the thousands of years of waiting. Same can be said for christianity, we've waiting for His return for 2,000 years and many get the rules wrong of what Christ asked of us until His return, like what happened to the Jews. No matter what we've done we arent dead yet so nobody is destined for Hell. Thats why we live the amount of days we do, to try again as long as it takes.
Again read scripture in context.
I agree with you here and realize there are hypocritical people of all types.
This is using an example that was used in comparing the difference between someone's action which may be objectively wrong but in the same vein, not knowing their motivation would make an act unjudgeable because all the facts arent known and is why I say christians arent suppose to condemn, but recall one of the Spiritual Works of Mercy, one of which is to Admonish the Sinner. To use a different example-a woman has an abortion which christians would deem as wrong, but maybe she had no support and was pushed to do what she did. Maybe she was told that its not a baby and is just a glob of tissue. This would be a situation of not judging her motives because it would be lacking understanding, but at the same time the act objectively wrong.
For Catholics for something to be a mortal sin 3 factors must be present:
1) the matter itself is serious or grave;
2) there must be sufficient reflection; and,
3) there must be full consent of the will
Otherwise, even thugh the act itself can be wrong objectively it isnt and why its important to not condemn someone. While we're here we arent any better than anybody else so we should all help each other no matter what we've done. Like Mother Teresa once said about a serial killer in India, "without the grace of God that would be me".
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BullDawg
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He was also called a heretic for hanging out with a bunch of low lives and a prostitute. In fact the company He kept was used by the Sadducees and Pharisees to discredit Him all together. Are you telling me that today if a man proclaimed to be a man of God (much less the very Son of God) and spent every day of his life living, eating, and drinking with a bunch of roughnecks, a prostitute, and a whole herd of undesirables while flagrantly tossing the religious status quo back in the face of the leaders of Christianity that he wouldn't be called a quack, a fake, and a heretic?
NCSaint
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Is methinks now an official word?
Shawn
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Quoted for obvious reasons.
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NCSaint
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I saw that before I posted. But not in the same form as being used today. Part of "me thinks" <ME thinks>this is just slang...
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What the heck was that? It's like he got a case of the runs right in the middle of his swing. Chuck it's time to give it up. I think he has gotten worse not better over the years.
StChadwick
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Good points Bulldog and I believe this is a good example why people shouldnt condemn or judge people because there's definitely a difference between hanging with lowlifes to proclaim the kingdom of God to them or hanging with them and joining in their sins. Mark 2:17, Jesus said to them, "It is not those who are healthy who need a physician, but those who are sick; I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners." Those are exactly the kind of people Jesus needed to be with everyday and whom we should as well per His example to help those who need it. The difference is Jesus was bringing them into His way not taking part in theirs. Those Scribes couldnt see past their laws. Its like James 2:20,"..faith apart from works is barren". James may have been pointing his finger right at the Scribes here especially, but even christians today in only living outwardly. I think this is the message often missed by all types of christians, we arent suppose to remove and ostrasize the sinners but make it a point to show love and charity to them as that was the word and deeds of Christ to them. Christians arent the ones to convert a sinner, that is only grace of the Holy Spirit. We can be used as instruments, but to also remember the bible also saying in how we shouldnt take part in needless debates about God, which is often fruitless.
You do bring up a good point though, what if Jesus returns in a way foreign to what christians expect? Will they accept him unless he actually returns with sounding trumpets? For example many christians expect a rapture of sorts to occur first while catholics dont. If Jesus returned the way He did the first time how many would ostrasize Him without looking at His fruits as proof apart from how we think we're only governed by the law? Its just in my experience there are many christians who are living by the example of Jesus more than the "law".
Even then Sadducees and Pharisees differed greatly in their beliefs, Pharisees believing in a resurrecton and the Sadducees not so despite their differences they seem to put their 613 laws in more importance than anything else and if you didnt live them to their expectations you were a heretic. That is why Jesus also said "For I say to you, that unless your righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven" (Matthew 5:20) and "Woe to you, Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you cleanse the outside of the cup and dish, but inside they are full of extortion and self-indulgence ...For you ...indeed appear beautiful outwardly, but inside are full of dead men's bones and all uncleanness ...You also outwardly appear righteous to men, but inside you are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness" (Matthew 23:25-28). Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples, "The Scribes and the Pharisees sit on Moses’ seat; therefore, do whatever they teach you and follow it; but do not do as they do, for they do not practice what they teach. This is at the root of the dangers of saying the right things but not doing anything to help those you see need help. For those christians people see today are hypocrites, perhaps the same advice should apply, "follow their advice but live better than they do as inside they are empty. This shows by example that inside the Church this does happen but it doesnt nullify it as christians are sinners too and fall perhaps in different ways in trying to follow what they think. Early Church had apostles that turned Jesus in for money (Judas) apostle who denied Jesus three times (Peter) apostle who didnt believe Jesus resurrected until he saw (Thomas) and the fact that only one of his twelve was present at his crucifixion (John), the rest hiding and locking the doors in fright. The Church had their problems and these are a testament to show those problems will never cease because it is man that has a part in His Church until He returns. Remember there are over 40,000 different christian denomination with many starting each day, there will be some confusion in belief, but this doesnt change the basic tenet of the teachings of Christ. You will know them by their fruits?" Matthew 7:16.
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BullDawg
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>>Even then Sadducees and Pharisees differed greatly in their beliefs, Pharisees believing in a resurrecton and the Sadducees not so despite their differences they seem to put their 613 laws in more importance than anything else and if you didnt live them to their expectations you were a heretic.
Sounds a lot like today does it not?
/concreterules
Sounds a lot like today does it not?
/concreterules
StChadwick
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Sounds a lot like today does it not?
Very true, but Jesus still said to the crowds and to his disciples, "The Scribes and the Pharisees sit on Moses’ seat; therefore, do whatever they teach you and follow it; but do not do as they do, for they do not practice what they teach". There are still those in authority, but woe to them whom abuse that power in His name.
CCL36
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Brilliant as usual.
Heaven knows the Chruch has problems, and our fair share of Pharisees, Saducees and Hypocrites but Godliness is not Condoning evil acts.
But this age makes Jesus into who they want him to be - thus developing a different Jesus and sinking us into relativism. Which makes sense in this discussion for it probably justifies the extreeme sinful lifestyles that many NBA players live and have lived.
Heaven knows the Chruch has problems, and our fair share of Pharisees, Saducees and Hypocrites but Godliness is not Condoning evil acts.
But this age makes Jesus into who they want him to be - thus developing a different Jesus and sinking us into relativism. Which makes sense in this discussion for it probably justifies the extreeme sinful lifestyles that many NBA players live and have lived.
>>But this age makes Jesus into who they want him to be...
So are you suggesting, that in his run for the Presidency of the United States, Larry Flint was, in fact, lying, when he proclaimed that Jesus was an Anarchist?
TPS
So are you suggesting, that in his run for the Presidency of the United States, Larry Flint was, in fact, lying, when he proclaimed that Jesus was an Anarchist?
TPS
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Who would dare question Larry Flint's theological bona fides?
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