COVID-19 Outbreak Information Updates (Reboot) [over 150.000,000 US cases (est.), 6,422,520 US hospitilizations, 1,148,691 US deaths.] (20 Viewers)

[Goatman Saint]

The thought I have on schools is essentially there is a whole lot of unknowns, and a whole lot of political pressure to open up. As we were talking about in my county which maybe, possibly, might’ve, almost potentially peaked , is that we are at the point if we can’t do it outside it’s shut down. I mean we are just a step above lockdown again. Now, I’m not a genius, but if I have this kind of environment is it really a good idea to open schools back up? Forget the battles of how bad kids can have it. They can spread it. They are confined in a poorly ventilated box for 6-7 hours. They will take those germs home to their families. We will have more cases. That’s just standard logic. Unless this virus is made of unicorns and fairy dust, that’s how they work. From what I hear they are opening the convention center for hospital overflow next week.
I would much rather go into the year knowing I will be remote teaching. I have a weeks worth of classes I am halfway through on the latest research how to do it. I have new curriculum which has been built for distance learning. So we have a plan, we have training and the district has hired people to enforce accountability on the families through home visits and such. This to me is so much better than reacting to the mess we know we are going to have if we try to go back.

 

[superchuck500]

 

[Goatman Saint]

I woke up this morning with a sore throat. I sleep on my back and sometimes sleep with my mouth open all night (I suppose) and wake up with a sore throat that goes away after a few minutes. I've been up for 4 hours and not only do I still have the sore throat and it feels like my glands may be swelling. I'm hoping I'm just paranoid. Fingers crossed I feel better as I drink more coffee and the day goes on.

Fever, loss of smell and taste, extreme fatigue. Those are the key signs. As my friend said she went from feeling ok more or less to barely able to go to the bathroom in 6 hours.

 

[RazorOye]

The children’s hospital here which was originally having overflow from the hospitals is now having to refocus on kids. Due to the worrying quantity of children 5- under, let alone 6-18, they have come out publicly and forcefully to keep schools closed.

It must underscore the difference between there and here... because Sick Kids Hospital, which is the nation's premier pediatric hospital, has been saying recommending a return to class with recommended measures. And it included collaboration with other universities and pediatric hospitals and specialist health units. They concluded:

The authors agree bringing children and youth back to school for in-person, full-time learning, with appropriate risk-mitigation strategies to ensure everyone’s safety, is the ultimate goal. Together, they examined the latest evidence from around the world and reviewed the experiences from other jurisdictions to inform how students and staff in Ontario can safely return to school in September. However, as research into COVID-19 continues to rapidly evolve, the authors caution the document may need to be updated accordingly. The authors drafted and accepted the guidance statements based on consensus and highlighted areas of disagreement as additional viewpoints.

they are clear that close monitoring and a quick trigger on another shutdown, if necessary, is key.

Some of the cited facts:

Quick Facts

• Updated COVID-19: Guidance for School Reopening builds on the previous document. Some of the changes include:
  • Increased focus on epidemiology of COVID-19 and the influence of community transmission on school reopening plans.
  • Additional discussion on the benefits and risks of mandatory masking in schools with age-specific and epidemiological considerations.
  • Additional guidance statements on implementing physical distancing in schools with age-specific considerations.
  • Enhanced guidance statements for children and youth with medical, physical, developmental and/or behavioural complexities.
  • Additional guidance statements on safety for teachers and school staff.
  • Suggested priority areas of research to close crucial knowledge gaps.
• Multiple reports from around the world indicate that children and youth account for less than 5-10% of SARS-CoV-2 symptomatic infections. In Canada, of 111,911 COVID-19 cases reported as of July 26, 2020, 8,890 (7.5 per cent) were in individuals aged 0 to 19 years.
• Current evidence suggests that young children may be less susceptible to COVID-19 and children younger than 10 years of age are probably less likely to transmit the disease than older children and adults. There is also strong evidence that the majority of children who get COVID-19 may not display any symptoms or have only mild symptoms.
• School closures have significant adverse health and welfare consequences for children and youth. Some of these unintended consequences include adverse impacts on children’s behaviour and mental health, food insecurity and increased risk of family violence. The goal of reopening schools should be to maximize child and youth health rather than facilitate a return to work for parents and caregivers.

 

[Goatman Saint]

It must underscore the difference between there and here... because Sick Kids Hospital, which is the nation's premier pediatric hospital, has been saying recommending a return to class with recommended measures. And it included collaboration with other universities and pediatric hospitals and specialist health units. They concluded:


they are clear that close monitoring and a quick trigger on another shutdown, if necessary, is key.

Some of the cited facts:

I’m not doubting that at all, and I’ve kept up on it. However, as Fauci pointed out in his meeting with the AFT yesterday, different areas have different situations. Up there you guys have seemingly done a very good job with it. Numbers are low, and the situation is seemingly pretty well managed.
Here we have military teams supplementing hospital staffs which cannot maintain the level of staffing, and they are in the process of opening up the convention center as a Covid ward. Also, when you look at the numbers we are still 2 weeks behind peak, if that was peak, and there’s 300 more cases a day to add to the mess hospitals are in. The valley here is not in a good situation. So, in this way I can see why they are saying hit the brakes. They are like others and fighting a heavy caseload with a total of 17 with the inflammatory reaction some kids get to this. They are being stretched thin.
In your situation, I’d be all for opening. But each area is different.

 

[Infoman]

As with all things that need to be discussed within this subject (In this case School openings) - Each specific case/location/situation needs to be examined - The contextual data needs to be considered, studied, and used - And political ideals need to be tossed in the crapper.... See below:

____________________________________________________________________

Early this spring, school gates around the world slammed shut. By early April, an astonishing 1.5 billion young people were staying home as part of broader shutdowns to protect people from the novel coronavirus. The drastic measures worked in many places, dramatically slowing the spread of SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19.

However, as weeks turned into months, pediatricians and educators began to voice concern that school closures were doing more harm than good, especially as evidence mounted that children rarely develop severe symptoms from COVID-19.

Continued closures risk “scarring the life chances of a generation of young people,” according to an open letter published last month and signed by more than 1500 members of the United Kingdom’s Royal College of Paediatrics and Child Health (RCPCH). Virtual education is often a pale shadow of the real thing and left many parents juggling jobs and childcare. Lower-income children who depend on school meals were going hungry. And there were hints that children were suffering increased abuse, now that school staff could no longer spot and report early signs of it. It was time, a growing chorus said, to bring children back to school.

By early June, more than 20 countries had done just that. (Some others, including Taiwan, Nicaragua, and Sweden, never closed their schools.) It was a vast, uncontrolled experiment.

When Science looked at reopening strategies from South Africa to Finland to Israel, some encouraging patterns emerged. Together, they suggest a combination of keeping student groups small and requiring masks and some social distancing helps keep schools and communities safe, and that younger children rarely spread the virus to one another or bring it home. But opening safely, experts agree, isn’t just about the adjustments a school makes. It’s also about how much virus is circulating in the community, which affects the likelihood that students and staff will bring COVID-19 into their classrooms.

“Outbreaks in schools are inevitable,” says Otto Helve, a pediatric infectious disease specialist at the Finnish Institute for Health and Welfare. “But there is good news.” So far, with some changes to schools’ daily routines, he says, the benefits of attending school seem to outweigh the risks—at least where community infection rates are low and officials are standing by to identify and isolate cases and close contacts.

School openings across globe suggest ways to keep coronavirus at bay, despite outbreaks

Science explores reopening strategies from South Africa to Finland to Israel

www.sciencemag.org

Science's COVID-19 reporting is supported by the Pulitzer Center.

 

[bclemms]

It must underscore the difference between there and here... because Sick Kids Hospital, which is the nation's premier pediatric hospital, has been saying recommending a return to class with recommended measures. And it included collaboration with other universities and pediatric hospitals and specialist health units. They concluded:


they are clear that close monitoring and a quick trigger on another shutdown, if necessary, is key.

Some of the cited facts:

I agree with both.

The two situations couldn't be more different based on case load.

It's also very different because Canada and just about every other country will shut schools back down at a level of cases far below where the USA already is.

 

[Goatman Saint]

A month and a half ago, I was thinking it may happen here as we were in California and had done a relatively good job. Then it got into the meat plants and is now through the agricultural workers. That’s a huge number, and a generally highly at risk community. So, our path has changed.

 

[faceman]

Fever, loss of smell and taste, extreme fatigue. Those are the key signs. As my friend said she went from feeling ok more or less to barely able to go to the bathroom in 6 hours.

My son in law said his first symptom was a bad headache that also turned to body aches the 2nd day

 

[RazorOye]

I’m not doubting that at all, and I’ve kept up on it. However, as Fauci pointed out in his meeting with the AFT yesterday, different areas have different situations. Up there you guys have seemingly done a very good job with it. Numbers are low, and the situation is seemingly pretty well managed.

In your situation, I’d be all for opening. But each area is different.

agreed - which is why I opened with how the different approaches highlight the differences in situations

 

[RazorOye]

my father's sister passed this morning. She had all sorts of complications. She was a lifelong heroine addict and used other drugs pretty extensively. Extremely poor in health and financially. Apparently, her decline was extremely quick and sudden.

 

[Poppy]

I just want to know how effective these ridiculous masks are. Watch people. They are touching them constantly. I know I am. A constant flow of snot, saliva, food particles, etc. And whats the number one way to prevent infection?? wash hands. simple as that. Supposedly increased cases, but everyone has a mask on now. How can that be?

 

[superchuck500]

As with all things that need to be discussed within this subject (In this case School openings) - Each specific case/location/situation needs to be examined - The contextual data needs to be considered, studied, and used - And political ideals need to be tossed in the crapper.... See below:

____________________________________________________________________

Early this spring, school gates around the world slammed shut. By early April, an astonishing 1.5 billion young people were staying home as part of broader shutdowns to protect people from the novel coronavirus. The drastic measures worked in many places, dramatically slowing the spread of SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19.

However, as weeks turned into months, pediatricians and educators began to voice concern that school closures were doing more harm than good, especially as evidence mounted that children rarely develop severe symptoms from COVID-19.

Continued closures risk “scarring the life chances of a generation of young people,” according to an open letter published last month and signed by more than 1500 members of the United Kingdom’s Royal College of Paediatrics and Child Health (RCPCH). Virtual education is often a pale shadow of the real thing and left many parents juggling jobs and childcare. Lower-income children who depend on school meals were going hungry. And there were hints that children were suffering increased abuse, now that school staff could no longer spot and report early signs of it. It was time, a growing chorus said, to bring children back to school.

By early June, more than 20 countries had done just that. (Some others, including Taiwan, Nicaragua, and Sweden, never closed their schools.) It was a vast, uncontrolled experiment.

When Science looked at reopening strategies from South Africa to Finland to Israel, some encouraging patterns emerged. Together, they suggest a combination of keeping student groups small and requiring masks and some social distancing helps keep schools and communities safe, and that younger children rarely spread the virus to one another or bring it home. But opening safely, experts agree, isn’t just about the adjustments a school makes. It’s also about how much virus is circulating in the community, which affects the likelihood that students and staff will bring COVID-19 into their classrooms.

“Outbreaks in schools are inevitable,” says Otto Helve, a pediatric infectious disease specialist at the Finnish Institute for Health and Welfare. “But there is good news.” So far, with some changes to schools’ daily routines, he says, the benefits of attending school seem to outweigh the risks—at least where community infection rates are low and officials are standing by to identify and isolate cases and close contacts.

School openings across globe suggest ways to keep coronavirus at bay, despite outbreaks

Science explores reopening strategies from South Africa to Finland to Israel

www.sciencemag.org

Science's COVID-19 reporting is supported by the Pulitzer Center.

I have significant concerns about the idea that children "rarely spread it to others" - I think the research on this is muddy and the conclusion is counter-intuitive . . . which makes me nervous. Just this week, a report published in the JAMA Pediatrics journal and written by a team from Northwestern University School of Medicine and the Lurie Children's Hospital in Chicago found that Covid-positive children 5 and under carried substantially higher viral load in their upper respiratory tract than older children and adults. (See below).

If this is true, it suggests that young children have more virus to spread through coughing, sneezing, talking/singing, and respirating. So if they aren't efficient spreaders of the virus, what other process is happening to make that so? When research aligns with intuition (i.e. children are humans and you presume that the viral mechanics work similarly) it is more credible to me than research that doesn't align with intuition and fails to explain the divergence.

If Americans are going back to work, that means daycare. And in the US, most children are in school by 4K (the year before kindergarten) and kindergarten includes many children 5 years of age. I have substantial anxiety that the reason why schools (especially schools with young children who will be difficult to mask and follow other safe protocols) have not yet been seen as a vector for transmission is because they have been mostly closed since very early in the outbreak.

While I recognize that it is indeed a weighing of competing interests (there are compelling reasons why children need to be back in school) I'm concerned that we lack the ability to be appropriately nimble in the event that children (especially young children) are a significant vector of transmission. Unlike professional athletes and those who meet with the president, school children aren't being tested regularly - and the vast majority won't be tested at all without some reason to be (e.g. symptoms or contact).

This sets up a potential for substantially worsening the situation in the United States and I don't think we will be able to recognize it early enough to mitigate it. We're going in on what amounts to a determination to tolerate this risk. But that risk is unknown. This means the operative concept is hope - we hope it doesn't turn out that way.

Don't misinterpret - I'm not advocating for one result or the other. Just pointing out why I have serious anxiety about it (I'm not typically an anxious person).

Age-Related Differences in Nasopharyngeal SARS-CoV-2 Levels in Patients With Mild to Moderate COVID-19

This cohort study investigates age-related differences in nasopharyngeal severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) levels in patients with mild to moderate coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19).

jamanetwork.com

 

[Charlie Brizzown]

I just want to know how effective these ridiculous masks are. Watch people. They are touching them constantly. I know I am. A constant flow of snot, saliva, food particles, etc. And whats the number one way to prevent infection?? wash hands. simple as that. Supposedly increased cases, but everyone has a mask on now. How can that be?

If you're only going to come here to birch and complain without consuming any of the great information that is provided, I suggest you take your rants to Facebook or somewhere else.

 

[superchuck500]

I just want to know how effective these ridiculous masks are. Watch people. They are touching them constantly. I know I am. A constant flow of snot, saliva, food particles, etc. And whats the number one way to prevent infection?? wash hands. simple as that. Supposedly increased cases, but everyone has a mask on now. How can that be?

Infection from breathing in virus is now believed to be the primary pathway. Research has demonstrated that masks are effective (especially when universally worn) at substantially limiting spread. And this makes sense: if the infected person wears a mask, the expelled viral particles will be substantially reduced. And if uninfected persons are wearing masks there is an additional filter before reaching the airway.

I don't think that washing hands has been shown to be the number one way to prevent infection of an airborne respiratory virus. Certainly washing hands is very effective, in general, to limit the spread of viruses, but ones that transmit easily through the air require additional measures.

Universal mask wearing still isn't happening in the US. Many localities have only recently gone to mask mandates. Where I live, for example, in Charleston SC, the state was one of the first to re-open and fairly quickly became a hotspot. It wasn't until July 5 that the mask mandate went into effect, but within about 10 days, the trends reversed and the numbers have fallen off substantially.

But by no means are people following the recommendations - Americans are engaging in all sorts of behaviors without masks. Restaurants (and bars in many places) are operating with indoor seating. People don't wear masks in restaurants and sit in the same area with others not wearing masks for an hour or more. People aren't wearing masks with their families or circles of friends - which would be fine if those were closed circles, but they're not. One family member's circle includes others from outside and not wearing masks in those situations increases risk.

Then there are the non-believers, who only make it worse.