COVID-19 Outbreak Information Updates (Reboot) [over 150.000,000 US cases (est.), 6,422,520 US hospitilizations, 1,148,691 US deaths.] (13 Viewers)

[Arathrael]

Israel is giving fourth doses out to over-60s - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-59749967 .

It's not clear why. The article there mentions that "The BBC's Tom Bateman in Jerusalem says the evidence favouring a fourth shot has not yet been released, and the same committee advised against the move only a week ago." I'd guess the implication is that they're either seeing waning effects after a third dose in that age group, or that a fourth dose provides even better protection than a third dose in that age group so they think it's worth it, or even that they're just guessing it might, but without the evidence it's hard to say.

 

[Sun Wukong]

Quick summary of where things currently stand, with some positive signs that hopefully continue to pan out.

Some glimmers of hope are emerging on omicron, but experts stress caution

Medical experts agree that even if symptoms are milder, the sheer volume and spread of omicron infections still poses a threat to health care systems.

www.cnbc.com

 

[SaintRob]

In 2020 I posted results regarding lab testing by the US government, a biomedical firm in Japan, and one in India showing that the herb Ashwaghanda has components that stops the covid virus from replicating as well as my own personal experience with covid and ashwaghanda (while acknowledging that my personal experience was not statistically relevant in any way). The science is sound and it looks good on paper but of course that doesn't mean it works in humans. Well there is so much promise with it that both India and the UK have started human trials. The herb is perfectly safe and has many positive benefits so it might be a good idea to get some now. Even if it isn't effective, it does other good things and if it does get confirmed as being effective there is going to be a world wide run on it driving the prices up and potentially making it hard to get

ashwagandha covid - Google Search

My daily routine from the start of Covid has been C, D, Zinc, & Ashwaghanda. I added a B complex about 6 months ago. Double Pfizer vaxxed and boosted. So far, so good!

 

[jahsoul357]

Israel is giving fourth doses out to over-60s - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-59749967 .

It's not clear why. The article there mentions that "The BBC's Tom Bateman in Jerusalem says the evidence favouring a fourth shot has not yet been released, and the same committee advised against the move only a week ago." I'd guess the implication is that they're either seeing waning effects after a third dose in that age group, or that a fourth dose provides even better protection than a third dose in that age group so they think it's worth it, or even that they're just guessing it might, but without the evidence it's hard to say.

Bingo

Why did Israel’s COVID-19 team recommend a 4th vaccine? A member explains

He admitted that the decision was based on the experts’ understanding of the situation more than on full evidence.

www.jpost.com

 

[Sun Wukong]

Bingo

Why did Israel’s COVID-19 team recommend a 4th vaccine? A member explains

He admitted that the decision was based on the experts’ understanding of the situation more than on full evidence.

www.jpost.com

Honestly, sketchy reasoning on a few fronts.

And at this point I feel like we need to divorce infections from hospitalizations and severe outcomes as a measure of effectiveness. Sure, maybe people who got boosted are getting infected. But how sick are they getting? Are they dying?

Seems like Israel is jumping the gun here. The guy even admits this decision was made less on hard data and more their feelings about the situation. That's...not science. At all. Whatsoever.

And I'd also add that while they were a valuable resource early in the pandemic, with the new variant starting and taking hold elsewhere, there are more valuable sources of information/research than Israel now.

 

[SaintInBucLand]

Honestly, sketchy reasoning on a few fronts.

And at this point I feel like we need to divorce infections from hospitalizations and severe outcomes as a measure of effectiveness. Sure, maybe people who got boosted are getting infected. But how sick are they getting? Are they dying?

Seems like Israel is jumping the gun here. The guy even admits this decision was made less on hard data and more their feelings about the situation. That's...not science. At all. Whatsoever.

And I'd also add that while they were a valuable resource early in the pandemic, with the new variant starting and taking hold elsewhere, there are more valuable sources of information/research than Israel now.

At this rate they will be on their 6th booster by the end of next year.

 

[faceman]

Honestly, sketchy reasoning on a few fronts.

And at this point I feel like we need to divorce infections from hospitalizations and severe outcomes as a measure of effectiveness. Sure, maybe people who got boosted are getting infected. But how sick are they getting? Are they dying?

Seems like Israel is jumping the gun here. The guy even admits this decision was made less on hard data and more their feelings about the situation. That's...not science. At all. Whatsoever.

And I'd also add that while they were a valuable resource early in the pandemic, with the new variant starting and taking hold elsewhere, there are more valuable sources of information/research than Israel now.

Agreed,hospitalizations and deaths have been the key stats since the beginning. We've only had one death attributed
to Omicron. It was a unvaccinated man in his 50's with underlying health issues. Every death is sad,but it's really good
news so far.

 

[jahsoul357]

Honestly, sketchy reasoning on a few fronts.

And at this point I feel like we need to divorce infections from hospitalizations and severe outcomes as a measure of effectiveness. Sure, maybe people who got boosted are getting infected. But how sick are they getting? Are they dying?

Seems like Israel is jumping the gun here. The guy even admits this decision was made less on hard data and more their feelings about the situation. That's...not science. At all. Whatsoever.

And I'd also add that while they were a valuable resource early in the pandemic, with the new variant starting and taking hold elsewhere, there are more valuable sources of information/research than Israel now.

If I recall, they were the first talking about the booster due to waning effectiveness due to delta (which was not seen in one news outlet in the US) and they were the first administrating boosters, which made me pause when I read this quote.

“We all hoped it would not happen, but with time the immunity offered by the third dose is waning,” noted Dagan, who is a professor of Pediatrics and Infectious Diseases at Ben-Gurion University of the Negev.

“This of course does not mean that it is completely disappearing but after three or four months the protection is going down at a rate that does not really suggest that it will stop – and I’m talking about the protection against Delta, without even addressing Omicron.”

 

[Saint_Ward]

Quick summary of where things currently stand, with some positive signs that hopefully continue to pan out.

Some glimmers of hope are emerging on omicron, but experts stress caution

Medical experts agree that even if symptoms are milder, the sheer volume and spread of omicron infections still poses a threat to health care systems.

www.cnbc.com

That's a great big picture look with just enough details.

This was interesting. Probably gets into the "will we be boosting every 6 months or so?" Discussion.

Seems like it's more of an attempt to minimize infections. For many that's not a very big deal, but for a significant number, it just adds to the risk of more severe disease. So, not catching it is still a high priority.

“If you have been vaccinated, if you have had an infection before, you have got some protection, particularly against severe disease, and that means that omicron in reality looks milder. It looks like a milder infection because of the immunity that we have built up, not because the virus is particularly different in terms of its natural innate severity,” he said.

Cowling explained that vaccines offer two lines of defense, firstly through antibodies to protect against infection and secondly through T-cells which protect against severe disease in the event of a breakthrough infection.

“If we get that third dose, the booster, it strengthens that outer line of defense and we are back to where we were maybe six months ago, where having three doses does give us those two lines of defense back.”

 

[Saint_Ward]

At this rate they will be on their 6th booster by the end of next year.

Yes, if they keep doing it every 6 months.

Just keep in mind, they boosted that population in July. So, Dec is now 6 months later. We were late September for that population and high risk. Let's call it October (talking 3-4 days here). We'd be considering a 4th booster in March/April for 65+ and high risk. That's a long ways away.

 

[superchuck500]

Update at my house. My infected 7 year old is mostly asymptomatic- only some nasal congestion. We’re not isolating her in any way, just being normal (she’s not interacting with anyone else, of course). The rest of us were negative as of last night, not sure how long that will last.

 

[Saint_Ward]

Agreed,hospitalizations and deaths have been the key stats since the beginning. We've only had one death attributed
to Omicron. It was a unvaccinated man in his 50's with underlying health issues. Every death is sad,but it's really good
news so far.

Agreed, but in the now, it's an awful stat, because it is such a lagging indicator, it doesn't help drive decision making for the next month or so. It becomes too late.

In the long term bigger picture, however this turns out will drive how we come out of this pandemic. So, I hope the deaths and hospitalizations stay low.

 

[Saint_Ward]

Update at my house. My infected 7 year old is mostly asymptomatic- only some nasal congestion. We’re not isolating her in any way, just being normal. The rest of us were negative as of last night, not sure how long that will last.

I would have isolated a bit.

When our kid had the flu 3 years ago, we kept him to his room and bathroom. Brought him food, drinks, etc. Granted, he felt like a truck hit him so he was sleeping a lot.

When we've done covid isolation (due to potential infection), we would just stick to a room, then mask when walking around the house. Clean contact surfaces a bit more. Wash hands.

It doesn't have to be solitary confinement. But, I'd do a little something.

 

[SharonT]

At this rate they will be on their 6th booster by the end of next year.

And so what? If people in their 70s and 80s want to up their odds of living, is giving them that extra booster any skin off your nose?

It's peace of mind, insurance, for people who have likely watched their friends die needlessly (before vaccines.) Not everything is a conspiracy or OMG OMG OMG. Sometimes it's just risk reduction.

 

[Saint_Ward]

If I recall, they were the first talking about the booster due to waning effectiveness due to delta (which was not seen in one news outlet in the US) and they were the first administrating boosters, which made me pause when I read this quote.

So, maybe someone could explain this better (literally any doctor).... but when they test this in the lab, it's a test really measuring antibody response, and if it allows an infection or not.

So, as many have stated, certain antibodies are short term, some are longer, but at some point, it's a waste of energy for the body to keep antibodies high, so memory cells keep the secret sauce and the body dials back the antibody production.

In a pandemic, it's 2 levels. Prevent infections, prevent serious illness / death (or major bad symptom).

Keeping up antibodies helps prevent infection. Add that to washing hands, wearing a mask, being smart about exposure, and time frames.... and folks can avoid all this.