COVID-19 Outbreak (Update: More than 2.9M cases and 132,313 deaths in US) (9 Viewers)

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Got that right. The 2 main parties in this country are mostly full of self-serving pyscopaths that don’t care about the common person. To think 2 parties should represent most citizens in a country of this size is laughable.

I've long thought that a parliamentary system of government similar to the system in Britain would be preferable to what we have. It allows for more parties that actually represent groups of people but also requires some level of compromise to elect a Prime Minister and get things done.
 
If u have already filed for this year. Their using this years tax returns. If not they are using last years.

Yes, but in that scenario those upper groups would be excluded or limited from the stimulus based on their high salaries, but they may be in a much lower bracket by the end of this year.
 
Are you suggesting we should seal people in their homes and buildings like China?
No but if wanted to shut it down we could without going to those extremes. It would take teamwork and a clear message with consequences to those that dont listen. Dont stay home, lose government checks. Dont stay home, get fined.

Spain and Italy are getting it done. Took a lot of effort to get there though and it wont be easy.

Then on the backside we would have to deal with no international travel until vaccine is out. To me it just seems that is so much better than half shutting economy for a year or more with overwhelmed healthcare and mass death.
 
Consensus is 14-18 months is best case scenario before human trials are over, a vaccine is approved, the vaccine is manufactured and distributed on a large enough scale to hit most people.

I've read several articles that say they can get it done in a year and maybe less. They will rush through trials at a pace that they have not done before. In fact, at least one possible vaccine is already in human trials. No doubt it will take time to manufacture and distribute but once it does hit the market it will greatly slow the spread as more and more people are naturally immune and then the vaccine adds to that number. And it could even be faster if they get rid of a bunch of the bureaucracy involved in FDA approval.

But I mean, I don't know maybe 12 months isn't consensus. But there is some outside date to all of this and the idea is obviously to crack down now, get the curve going down, and deal with the economic impact later. And some things can be done now to limit the damage to the economy. But, if we don't do enough now, the economy will be severely damaged by a pandemic that has run wild and killed millions of people while crippling our healthcare system. For those worried about the stock market, it's not going to do well when there are reports of thousands of dead per day on the news and hospitals going bankrupt. And, dead people don't pay back loans.
 
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Yes, but in that scenario those upper groups would be excluded or limited from the stimulus based on their high salaries, but they may be in a much lower bracket by the end of this year.
1 crisis at a time. Right now they trying to keep people working. They have changed unemployment benefits drastically guaranteeing wages for 4 months for most people. Can they cure ever single persons situation. Of course not. But there is multiple options that they have put In place and working on. This isn't going to be the last stimulus package
 
I spoke to my parents yesterday and they surprised me (in a good way). They are intelligent people, and speaking to them on different issues/ topics is always fun, but when you back out of specific issues it is obvious that they live in the Fox echo chamber and though I can break them down on almost every major issue as disagreeing with the man, will likely vote for Trump.

That said I was terrified they would not be taking this thing seriously. I was wrong, they are very aware of their risk (74 with some underlying health issues and 73) and have changed their lifestyle to match. They recently moved to a place called "The Villages" in Florida, and though I have not seen the place yet I am assuming they are living around mostly people in their own demographic.

They have a great deal of social activities that they like to partake in, and they have stopped all of them. They have not hoarded by any stretch of the imagination, but my mom says she has some "Hurricane Supplies" if they cannot go to the store. As for trips to the store apparently their local store is fairly low volume and has regular sanitizing "breaks" during the day. They have been going on multiple walks daily, but say that everyone keeps a good distance and there are never more than couples walking together.

In the place of their social activities they have decided to pick up golfing (badly) for the time being. They got a golf cart when they moved to this place, because apparently that is the thing to do for getting around there, and their local golf course has lifted the minimum party size to tee off.... so it is just the two of them puttering around in a golf cart, playing golf badly, going for walks, and reading books.

Since they have retired a decade ago they have been almost non-stop go. They have hit all the national parks in the western United States, traveled to almost every major urban center in the US and Canada, traveled Northern, Western, and Southern Europe for months at a time. Run pretty much every cruise route in the Caribbean, both the Alaska and Hawaii cruise and done a number of 80 day cruises touching every continent except Africa.

I was afraid they would use this as a way to try to find low cost travel arrangements, but they canceled any plans they had for the next year, and told me they are going to go into "Google" exploring mode for the next year, maybe two, until they see conditions as safe enough to resume their travels. Their hope is they can take this time to find destinations and activities they would not have and add them to the list for a time that they can venture forth again.

I had been worried since the onset of this thing that my parents would let the blinders they have put on in their media/political steer them into harms way... but underneath it seems that they are still the critical thinking pair that raised me when it counts.

I rambled way off course, but basically now is a good time to call your loved ones... they are probably bored and stressed, and even if you just talk about what flowers are blooming in the garden, or what good meals they have eaten lately it is relieving and comforting (at least it was for me).
I've been there, it's a nice place.

I think the University of Florida, through the State, is partnering with the Villages to expand testing, since it is such a large at-risk group. it mean, it's a city of almost 60k people all at retirement age or north.
 
Cuomo says we can control the size of the outbreak.

Investors think this means we can open up for business.

The disconnect is phenominal. We can control the outbreak by shutting everything down. The two are contradictory.
My employer is the same.

I can't believe that people with doctorates are unable to comprehend what's going on and the penalty that we'll all suffer for getting it wrong.
 
If the hospitals are overrun, why is the economy lost in that situation more so than the shutdowns?

A few million people die, and I am pretty sure the economic impact will be somewhere between the great recession of 2008 and the great depression.

That is a pretty wide range of outcomes I will admit but I just dont know what the psychological impact of say ~2.5 million dead in 2020 would be on the economy. I would venture to say consumer behavior would be dramatically impacted, whole sectors of the economy would grind to a halt (no matter how "open" they are), and every business that could, would be shedding expenses and striving for as much liquid capital on hand as possible.
 
If I get a check, I may try to return it. Social Security and pensions come in via automatic deposit. Why would I need a stimulus at all? There's very little to spend it on right now, anyway, unfortunately. We'll see what happens.

By contrast there are without question folks who need it desperately and they needed it at least a week ago. The problem with these sorts of blanket giveaways is that there will inevitably be bad inequities. That said, the government has to do something and do it quickly before the economy shuts down.

It's an honorable idea and I respect anyone willing to make a decision like that. But, IMO, you should probably either donate it to funds that are out there to help the poor and unemployed or just use it to order food for delivery to keep local restaurants open and help some people keep their jobs. The government will just waste the money and not use it to help people.
 
Actually, you are right. All the mixed messages and constant shift in plans make it impossible to do a real coordinated shutdown. We got too far behind with testing to prevent the spread from going all over the country so we'll probably just have to live with it the next couple years until there is a vaccine or we gain herd immunity.

So we can just do a $2 Trillion fiscal stimulus plan every few months and only support airlines, cruise industries, auto makers, hotels, restaurants, entertainment industry and sports. If we do this every 2 months, then it'll only be $12 Trillion between now and next summer.
We just need a new normal. The question shouldn't be, do we fly again or not. It is how to we continue to allow the airlines to fly, and keep the public safe?

We can't just be in a shut down or not. We need a new normal. I'd use some of that stimulus to buy masks, and sanitizer.
 
If I get a check, I may try to return it.

Find a healthcare charity, a needy family, a food bank, etc, and give it too them.

Given the three ring circus that we are seeing out of DC right now... I dont think giving it back would do one damned bit of good.
 
If I get a check, I may try to return it. Social Security and pensions come in via automatic deposit. Why would I need a stimulus at all? There's very little to spend it on right now, anyway, unfortunately. We'll see what happens.

By contrast there are without question folks who need it desperately and they needed it at least a week ago. The problem with these sorts of blanket giveaways is that there will inevitably be bad inequities. That said, the government has to do something and do it quickly before the economy shuts down.
Save it for when sheet hits the fan, or if something comes up. You can't give it back. Give to a charity or a neighbor in need.
 
[MOD EDIT - Removing Overly Political commentary - SW :nono: ]

"Sorry if you're broke now, you should have saved that income from 2018 in case of emergency! Even though the corporations we are bailing out didn't save their income from 2018 in case of emergency!"
Need to stop eating avocado toast.
 
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