Derek Carr world tour thread (updated with combine visits) (4 Viewers)

[jahsoul357]

Me too brother. It’s why I was not calling for Drew’s head when he threw 22 interceptions in one season.

Seems like the only thing people remember about that season was the Seattle game..lol

 

[JackDiesel]

I'd argue that he's at the top of that second group. The only one of those I might rank ahead of him would be Watson, and of course he had his own issues, although mostly off the field stuff. Rodgers and Stafford are in the twilight of their careers, so I'd rather have Carr in his prime than a 1-2 year rental. That puts Carr firmly in the top 10 QBs. Clearly better than average. And if you go by his stats prior to last season, he easily qualifies.

He's most certainly at the top of that group. Most of those guys only have 1-2 years of good production. Purdy has to be a joke to get included in that group, he has like 5 games in a QB friendly offense.

Carr has been producing consistently despite a Raiders o-line that has been magnitudes worse than ours for most of his career. He's always had some good receivers but never a good line.

 

[DSnfla]

I agree with you on all points. We are not a team on the rise.

They really are not, they went 5-2 in the easy part of the schedule then went 2-7 the rest of the way. If that were reversed then maybe you could say they we on the rise

 

[Just Win Maybe]

He's most certainly at the top of that group. Most of those guys only have 1-2 years of good production. Purdy has to be a joke to get included in that group, he has like 5 games in a QB friendly offense.

Carr has been producing consistently despite a Raiders o-line that has been magnitudes worse than ours for most of his career. He's always had some good receivers but never a good line.

Carr has had some good lines and was still mediocre. At one point the Raiders spent nearly 80% of their payroll on the offensive side of the ball and Carr was still pedestrian. Jacobs just had a career season behind that line. Typically Carr and the Raiders have moved the ball fairly well between the 20`s but their RZ TD numbers have been mediocre/low. Carr has had the weapons with Jacobs, Waller, Renfrow and Adams and others.....but........

Remember last season Saints vs Raiders when the Raiders never crossed midfield? Until Stidham relieved Carr and moved the ball nicely in his first possession....

Carr is no longer a Raider and I have no dog in this hunt but I'm telling you, some pundits can pull some stats that paint a pretty picture of Carr while most of us Raider fans have watched his every snap and are thrilled he is gone. He is the very definition of QB purgatory.......good enough to win a few games and keep his job but not good enough to carry a team and win the big games.

 

[DSnfla]

I'd only disagree that Carr is an average qb. Last season was his first where he was decidedly average, and there were issues that led to that beyond him.

If he's in the right situation, I think he's solidly a top 10 qb. I see people saying he's not going to be any better because of our coaching, but clearly, if DA has another poor season, then next year, you get a new coaching staff and hopefully someone who can get the most out of Carr.

Whether he's worth it is certainly debatable, but considering how hard it is to find a top shelf qb, I think you get one while you can rather than waiting for a rookie to pan out.

Couldn't agree more. Plus the FA QB market for the next few yrs is not looking any better, and they will be more expensive. All the top FA QBs like Burrow, Hurts, and Herbert are not gonna be allowed to move. If we don't sign Carr and roll with someone like Dalton and wind up with like the #10 pick we're either going to have to trade up for a Williams or Maye, more likely using our 2024 1st and more. At best they take 2yrs to develop that's if they are not busts. That's 3yrs or more of being a bad team. If they turn out to be busts???? Then we're CLEVELAND

 

[DSnfla]

Mahomes, Allen, Herbert, Burrow, Lawrence, Hurts, Rodgers, Jackson, and Stafford are firmly ahead of him.

I suppose you can argue that he’s a part of the next group, a very big group. Prescott, Goff, Geno, Tua, Cousins, Daniel Jones, Watson, Murray, Purdy, Wilson, and Tannehill. I suppose at a guy like Fields could have an argument, though I wouldn’t agree. Jimmy G probably has an argument but I think that availability is a skill, so I say no. But you can see…I listed 20+ guys who I know that some would take over Carr if they were starting their own franchise today.

Below that tier you have unproven young players like Pickett, Mac Jones, and Lance and veterans like Brissett, Dalton, Minshew, and Winston rounding out the top 32 QBs in the NFL.

I personally think that the second tier is closer to the league average QB than the bottom tier, and considering that Carr is firmly in that second tier I think that he is pretty average. But heck…average is better than we have had the past two seasons. I’m just not sure that an average QB is worth $45 million/year, especially with our build. I think we are a few years away even with Carr…so I think that Allen’s fate is almost sealed. Do we really want to invest $45 million per on a QB this year knowing we have a lame duck HC? I say that’s foolish. Ride out the storm and regroup next season

To say Stafford is firmly ahead of him is a over exaggeration to say the least/ If you look at stats hey are about even and that's with Stafford having Megatron to throw to

 

[DSnfla]

This is all I see:

FR has gone with veteran QBs in his last 2 attempts and it has not worked out for him, I think they draft a QB

 

[DSnfla]

For one, the Jets found ways to win in spite of their QB woes. They also have the #4 ranked defense. While our defense had its moments and technically was ranked high too I can’t say I’m confident in them. Zero pass rush, questionable back end and loses like Tampa were just awful play. Not to mention, I see a coach in Salah that motivates his players. I don’t see that with Allen. I especially don’t see a top offensive mind when I look at Pete. Payton was the brains and heart of this coaching staff. Listening to Matt Flynn talk about his time with Allen makes me all the more worried that he is what he is and a head coach he is not. So yes, if I’m Carr and I’m looking to resurrect my career, I take the Jets, Salah, Wilson, Hall and their defense over the Saints 7 days a week and twice on Sunday.

LOL we had the #5 D and there was not much difference. Questionable back end ??? We had the #1 passing D

 

[Saint Spud]

LOL we had the #5 D and there was not much difference. Questionable back end ??? We had the #1 passing D

Please leave with your pesky “facts”

 

[Rexman100]

Would you feel comfortable with Payton coaching the Saints this past season? I wouldn't. And if Payton was coaching last season, they likely wouldn't have drafted Olave so it might have been even worse. Payton even said either before or after the draft that he didn't see a need to draft a receiver high in the draft for the Saints. Could you imagine this past season without Olave, with any coach?

What about 2021? Were you comfortable then? Payton or no Payton, the Saints don't have a Superbowl roster, and trying to hold DA to that level without the horses to do that is unreasonable. The Saints have a .500 roster right now with or without Payton. DA may or may not be a good HC, but blaming DA for the Saints being mediocre with the current roster is absurd.

And, I fail to see how this is a lot different from early in Payton's tenure where he had a good offense and a bad defense. DA has the opposite. The defense is good. Just fix the offense. I don't see how that's a lot different except that they don't have a veteran future HOF QB. If Payton had missed out on Brees and drafted Leinart, he would be an OC somewhere. Carr answers a lot of questions, one way or the other.

I agree, people need to go back and look at our Super Bowl roster. We did not have the greatest roster, more like average. https://www.nosaintshistory.com/new-orleans-saints-2009-nfl-season-team-roster/

My point is, that you don’t need the best roster in the game to win a Super Bowl.
On offense, What we did have in 2009, was an elite QB with average WRs and RBs. An above average line, but we didn’t require it to be the best because of Drew Bree’s quick release. Shockey was a good Te.

On defense, what made us great was the scheme. Talent-wise, we had an average D. If you recall, we blizted on every play because we couldn't get pressure with 4. On the back end, Darren Sharper was elite, as he was the sole benefactor of the errant balls forced out early. The LB‘s were average as was the line.

The bottom line in 2009, we had a great QB and a great scheme to fit his skill set. We were a chance taking overly aggressive D. This is all we needed to win a Superbowl.

So, punting for 3 years to overcome the dead cap is pure madness. Also telling a bunch of vets that the answers to their prayers lie wit a rookie college football QB that has never played a down of professional FB.

Currently, we have the scheme and most of the building blocks for an elite D. We have a legit shut down all-world CB in Latt and an up and comer in Alonte Taylor. (The best CB in Saints history by a long shot). We have good experienced safety’s in Mattieu and Maye. On the edge we have the best leader the Saints have ever had on D, with C Jordan. Solid DTs with Oya, Roach and Street, and Payton Turner in case we lose Dav. At LB, we have a great vet with Dd and up and coming youth in Ellis and Werner.

On offense we’re missing at least a Good /great QB. We have a young but great Wr in OLave and another young up-and-comer in Shaheed, and a couple average to decent vets. A promising TE In JJ. At RB, Hill and Kamara, but we’ll need depth. If Penning catches up we‘d potentially have a great Oline considering the emergence of Ruiz and pro bowlers McCoy and Ram. So if you look at the team closely, we’re only a good QB away. As it stands right now, without a QB, we have a better overall roster than 2009.

 

[sammymvpknight]

To say Stafford is firmly ahead of him is a over exaggeration to say the least/ If you look at stats hey are about even and that's with Stafford having Megatron to throw to

Stafford won a Super Bowl on the Rams….5000 yard passer. The body of work says that they aren’t close

 

[cwesleyc]

I’m already over it. He’s not going to be a savior but would be a significant upgrade over who played last season. If it doesn’t work out, and there’s someone in the draft the team feels strongly about, I hope Mickey is aggressive in going to get that guy.

 

[Saint Spud]

Stafford won a Super Bowl on the Rams….5000 yard passer. The body of work says that they aren’t close

He only averaged 25 YPG more than Goff did the previous year.

Stafford isn’t great. He’s in the same tier as Carr.

 

[sammymvpknight]

He only averaged 25 YPG more than Goff did the previous year.

Stafford isn’t great. He’s in the same tier as Carr.

By what quantifiable measure is Derek Carr a better QB than Matthew Stafford, unless hopes and dreams has somehow become objective?

 

[DSnfla]

So here’s a question. Let’s say Carr goes to Jets, what QBs around the league will be a FA after next season? Is it possible the best move might be to let this season ride and look to the following seasons FA pool as well as potentially a new coach?

2024 FA QB market is worse than this yr and 2025 as well