Detillier article today addresses offseason, McAllister. (1 Viewer)

workhorse

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Great article...addresses what we really don't want to think about, life without Duece.

http://www.houmatoday.com/article/20080224/SPORTS/777047225/1103/SPORTS02

"If the Saints can’t work out a new deal for McAllister, which would really be the best thing for the player and organization, I expect the team to make an early free agency push to sign San Diego Chargers halfback Michael Turner."

"By this time next week I believe we may know the how, or if, McAllister fits with the Saints plans for 2008. If the Saints make a run at Turner, it is a clear-cut indication that McAllister will not be a part of this team."

"Hopefully something can be worked out financially with McAllister keeping him in a Saints uniform. But to be honest, if the tough decision to jettison him is made, a threesome of Turner, Bush and Thomas is not a bad one to crank up the 2008 season."

Interesting his thoughts are in line with what draftdaddy.com "sources" said about our interest in Michael Turner:

http://www.draftdaddy.com/blog/nfldraft.cfm

"Mike Turner's (Chargers tailback) people are not happy here in Indy. Apparently his agent has been told precisely what I expected -- the draft is loaded with tailbacks and teams in dire need at running back will draft one. The one team that might be his buyer is New Orleans, because Deuce's recovery has hit some snags, according to their trainers."
 

FWtex

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From the Article about Deuce and Norwood teaming up, I got the impression Deuce is going to be very agreeable to whatever the saints need to do.

He mentioned the saints may ask to push back the bonus due until he is further along in his rehab. He also acknowledged that as a business man he understand the saints have to do what it right for the team.

I really expect deuce to agree to a 1 or 2 year extension with a reduced salary this year and incentives added. The extension allows them to make his cap hit minimal for the remaining years.
 

yankmccobb76

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I wouldn't agree with that signing at all. I just don't feel that RB is a huge priority for us. We have Reggie Bush and Pierre Thomas and we have a draft approaching with excellent depth at the position. I would much rather acquire veterans on the defensive side of the ball who need to contribute immediately and go young at RB where he should not have to immediately start for us. Not to mention that we also have a Heach Coach who has not shown a commitment to the run so why not have someone like Bush who can fit it with our spread formations and be that extra receiver on the field.
 

GoldRush26

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I wouldn't agree with that signing at all. I just don't feel that RB is a huge priority for us. We have Reggie Bush and Pierre Thomas and we have a draft approaching with excellent depth at the position. I would much rather acquire veterans on the defensive side of the ball who need to contribute immediately and go young at RB where he should not have to immediately start for us. Not to mention that we also have a Heach Coach who has not shown a commitment to the run so why not have someone like Bush who can fit it with our spread formations and be that extra receiver on the field.

So if we read what you just said you said we don't need a RB because we have a running back that stuggled most of last season in a starting role (Bush) and a player that had 1 great game (PT) and this is supposed to be the core of an offense that we want to compete for a Super Bowl?

I think Payton's reluctance to run the ball was due to an inherent lack of confidence in our backs. He saw those guys every day in camp and practice. Perhaps he knew that they weren't showing him enough. Those feelings aren't going to change all of a sudden come game time.
 

pennstater

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I wonder what Pierre Thomas is thinking. He just out performed Reggie Bush last season. His only start he had over 200 yards of total offense.

What more can a guy do to get more playing time? If we bring in Turner and leave Bush at halfback, then Pierre has been eliminated again. Just sit there and wait for an injury I guess.
 

yankmccobb76

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So if we read what you just said you said we don't need a RB because we have a running back that stuggled most of last season in a starting role (Bush) and a player that had 1 great game (PT) and this is supposed to be the core of an offense that we want to compete for a Super Bowl?

I think Payton's reluctance to run the ball was due to an inherent lack of confidence in our backs. He saw those guys every day in camp and practice. Perhaps he knew that they weren't showing him enough. Those feelings aren't going to change all of a sudden come game time.

Bush was hurt long before he started missing games and his play declined after getting banged up. I think he will perform well this year if given the majority of the carries.

And I personally think that Payton's reluctancy to run the ball has only to do with his wanting to put the ball in the air and nothing more. I think he believes that Brees is our best player and he wants the ball in his hands more than anyone else.......and I agree with him on that point but you have to have some sort of balance.

Pierre Thomas has had only one great game but it was the only game he was given the chance to. How many great games has Turner had and who knows if he could carry a full time load. I just think we have already spent too much on RBs and would rather go with a young guy to put in the mix.

But, I really hope Deuce comes back and can contribute with Reggie and Pierre because I think that would make a pretty decent trio if all healthy.
 
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supersaint15

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Pierre should get a start, but its good to have another good rb
 

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A RB with two ACL tears has little to zero bargaining power. Furthermore roster spots are so few that you don't have the luxury to keep a guy that may not be able to go on gameday. I look (and hope) for us to bring in a top RB. PT is a playmaker and will be on the final roster and a big part of the game plan.
 

bobad

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I wonder what Pierre Thomas is thinking. He just out performed Reggie Bush last season. His only start he had over 200 yards of total offense.

What more can a guy do to get more playing time? If we bring in Turner and leave Bush at halfback, then Pierre has been eliminated again. Just sit there and wait for an injury I guess.

+1

I'm tired of PT being the "invisible man". Every time he is called upon, he has never disappointed. Yet, the coach, the media, and many of the fans act as though he doesn't exist.

Ixnay on Turner. We have too many needs on the lines to pay a RB big bucks. We can pick up a couple of RB's in Rd. 7, FA, and UDFA rookies.
 

SaintJ

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Of course coaches always get "their own players", since usually they are coming into a meltdown situation caused largely by poor talent evaluation over time, resulting in bad records and coach firings. At least half of the guys you find in those situations shouldn't be anybody's players, and of course the decks have to be cleared.

While the McAllister discussion is the easy one to have, in the subtext of Mike's article essentially about being able to properly assess your own players' strengths and weaknesses, as I found the Faine discussion to be a lot more interesting.

Detillier apparently believes that Faine needs to be retained, and to the extent I remember any comments, it looks like the Saints might feel the same way, although we'll see how FA shakes out. In my infinite layman's armchair wisdom, I had reached the exact opposite conclusion: for all the smarts Faine may have, he's been the weak link of the line the last two years, where we really haven't been effective at all in short yardage running the ball. I just don't think he's got the physical tools to be a top-half center in the NFL, and I think Faine if Faine gets re-signed, he'll be a poster child for the inability of coaches to reassess their own personnel decisions.

Unfortunately, the reinforcing effect of making the decision to get him in the first place makes it more difficult (and so, so many coaches fall victim to this) to continue cold-blooded objective analysis. I'd be just as happy letting Faine go get rich someplace else and starting Goodwin, or working Nesbit over and starting our 3rd round pick from last season.
 
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GoldRush26

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Bush was hurt long before he started missing games and his play declined after getting banged up. I think he will perform well this year if given the majority of the carries.

And I personally think that Payton's reluctancy to run the ball has only to do with his wanting to put the ball in the air and nothing more. I think he believes that Brees is our best player and he wants the ball in his hands more than anyone else.......and I agree with him on that point but you have to have some sort of balance.

Pierre Thomas has had only one great game but it was the only game he was given the chance to. How many great games has Turner had and who knows if he could carry a full time load. I just think we have already spent too much on RBs and would rather go with a young guy to put in the mix.

But, I really hope Deuce comes back and can contribute with Reggie and Pierre because I think that would make a pretty decent trio if all healthy.

But the Saints ran the ball a ton in '06. Deuce had over 1,000 yards, remember?

I have yet to see anyone suggest this; Maybe Deuce lost a step or two in between '06 and '07. Maybe the grind of the rehab from the previous year finally caught up to him. We saw 0 signs of Deuce being effective last season, in the limited time we saw him. I think it's because Payton already knew he lost a step, and had to give more of the load to Reggie, who he knew wasn't ready for that role.

PT can't be counted on. It was the last regular season game where defenders were no doubt going through the motions. Given the stage of the performance I'm not all that impressed. It takes a lot more to prove you can be the man to shoulder the load.
 
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Tulane Saint

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Decue

I hope Deuce agrees to restructuring. Not only does he have a savy and realistic business sense, but he also has a sincere love for the region, the team, and the fans. (As it seems to me anyway).

By restructuring, he ensures himself a solid future with the organization. Not just as a player, but as a future member of the coaching staff.

I can't remember who it was in reference to, but one player from Pittsburgh once was toiling over testing the free market or signing for less money. The advice he got from an old steeler was ' this organization will stick with you'. He ended up taking the pay cut.

Deuce is the first Saints player, in a long time, to show such passion, commitment, character, and high level of performance (when healthy) throughout his career. He could conceivable be in a similar position that Archie is in now, acting as an analyst and unofficial spokesman for the region and the city for many years to come.

Anyway that's my 2 cents, I hope he stays. I've enjoyed his play ever since his first regular season game when he broke a long one for a TD, and all Ricky could do was stare in disbelief. :ezbill:
 

blackadder

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Great article...addresses what we really don't want to think about, life without Duece.

http://www.houmatoday.com/article/20080224/SPORTS/777047225/1103/SPORTS02

"If the Saints can’t work out a new deal for McAllister, which would really be the best thing for the player and organization, I expect the team to make an early free agency push to sign San Diego Chargers halfback Michael Turner."

"By this time next week I believe we may know the how, or if, McAllister fits with the Saints plans for 2008. If the Saints make a run at Turner, it is a clear-cut indication that McAllister will not be a part of this team."

"Hopefully something can be worked out financially with McAllister keeping him in a Saints uniform. But to be honest, if the tough decision to jettison him is made, a threesome of Turner, Bush and Thomas is not a bad one to crank up the 2008 season."

Interesting his thoughts are in line with what draftdaddy.com "sources" said about our interest in Michael Turner:

http://www.draftdaddy.com/blog/nfldraft.cfm

"Mike Turner's (Chargers tailback) people are not happy here in Indy. Apparently his agent has been told precisely what I expected -- the draft is loaded with tailbacks and teams in dire need at running back will draft one. The one team that might be his buyer is New Orleans, because Deuce's recovery has hit some snags, according to their trainers."

Playing in track meet games are exciting to watch, but that normally does not correspond with teams making the playoffs.

If you look at the top teams from the NFC, the Green Bay Packers, Tampa Bay Buccaneers, Seattle Seahawks, Dallas Cowboys and New York Giants, they got into the playoffs because they could play strong defense on a consistent basis. The Cowboys and Packers were the only teams of that group with an explosive offensive attack, but they also had strong defenses.

Exactly in agreement here.

So, let's hope Payton puts the emphasis on the defense. As the sating goes, "offense sells tickets, defense wins championships," which was the case once more this year.

I was puzzled by his comments on Jeff Faine and the importance of re-signing him. The running game seemed better when Faine was out with an injury. And the times when Drew was really pressured, it seemed to come from up the gut, right over Faine...

I think we could upgrade there.
 

dat dam dog

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Of course coaches always get "their own players", since usually they are coming into a meltdown situation caused largely by poor talent evaluation over time, resulting in bad records and coach firings. At least half of the guys you find in those situations shouldn't be anybody's players, and of course the decks have to be cleared.

While the McAllister discussion is the easy one to have, in the subtext of Mike's article essentially about being able to properly assess your own players' strengths and weaknesses, as I found the Faine discussion to be a lot more interesting.

Detillier apparently agrees with Payton and Loomis that Faine needs to be retained, the Saints having tagged Faine earlier this week. In my infinite layman's armchair wisdom, I had reached the exact opposite conclusion: for all the smarts Faine may have, he's been the weak link of the line the last two years, where we really haven't been effective at all in short yardage running the ball. I just don't think he's got the physical tools to be a top-half center in the NFL, and I think Faine is a poster child for the inability of coaches to reassess their own personnel decisions.

Unfortunately, the reinforcing effect of making the decision to get him in the first place makes it more difficult (and so, so many coaches fall victim to this) to continue cold-blooded objective analysis. Also, Payton = smart and Faine = smart, so Payton is comfortable, like most folks, with what he sees in the mirror. I'd have been just as happy letting Faine go get rich someplace else and starting Goodwin, or working Nesbit over and starting our 3rd round pick from last season.


"... the Saints having tagged Faine earlier this week. "

Link, please.


ddd
 

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