Question Does Brady's 2021 Postseason put an end to the Brees vs. Rodgers vs. Brady Debate? (1 Viewer)

sfidc3 · Jan 25, 2021

Stalwart385 said:
Brady's argument is Superbowls. If you watched Brady this postseason you would realize why those are team accomplishments.

This is not the only argument, it's SB's, his performance in said SB's and his career stats. If he plays another year or 2 he will own many of the all time career QB stats...

I wish Drew went to more, he deserved to but he didn't and nothing can change that...

Stalwart385 · Jan 25, 2021

sfidc3 said:
This is not the only argument, it's SB's, his performance in said SB's and his career stats. If he plays another year or 2 he will own many of the all time career QB stats...

I wish Drew went to more, he deserved to but he didn't and nothing can change that...

Only cumulative stats. If you look at efficiency or even per season stats compared to his peers each year he doesn't stand above any other QB. I'm fine if you think he is but the argument of best QB to play the game doesn't stop at Brady to me.

NOFALCONS10 · Jan 25, 2021

sfidc3 said:
Not at all, where did I state it was the only reason or most important stat, I said it was a primary reason. I mean a 3-1 TD-INT ratio plays a big role in 6-3 SB record does it not? And then you glossed over everything else only to bring up a totally unrelated stat (I was talking about SB performance, not the fewest INT's per game or even career best TD/INT ratio, context means something), moving goal posts and cherry pick much? My "own twisted logic"....that's rich....

Only because of his pocket presence? Man you just insulted a ton of really good Saints offensive lineman over the years.....SMFH.....

The rest of your superbowl argument is moot because, of course, if you go to the superbowl 10 times you're naturally going to have the most yards and td's.

If he were really the best in the superbowl then he would have more ti show for it than just career average or the most yards in a single game.

Again, Young threw the most tds and Sims had the best rating and Bradshaw had more yards per attempt.

Plenty of qbs out played Brady in Superbowls and in MVP years.

If this guy played for the Lions, he would be Marino or Rivers.

CRESS_137 · Jan 25, 2021

Football is a team sport.

NOFALCONS10 · Jan 25, 2021

sfidc3 said:
Only because of his pocket presence? Man you just insulted a ton of really good Saints offensive lineman over the years.....SMFH.....

Ask Taysom Hill.

Hill had the same oline as Brees but managed to get sacked 13 times in 4 games, more than Brees did in his previous 15.

Cage1 · Jan 25, 2021

No, but his previous 6 rings and stats did. Now he's just lapping the field.

Imagine the LeBron/ Jordan "debate" if Jordan was still playing and still winning championships every 3 years and LeBron only had the one.

Bespoke · Jan 25, 2021

Brady isn't even having that great of a post-season, 3 Interceptions in the NFC Championship game and 2 more that were dropped.

When we played him Lattimore should have had a pick six on an out-cut if he was a fraction of a second quicker, and Marcus Williams didn't drag his 2nd foot to pick off a horrible deep throw in Cover 2.

It's the Bucs Defense that's carrying them through these playoffs... particularly Devin White, and their D-line... that and Murphy-Bunting is allowed to get away with murder by holding out of the Slot... I guess good luck with him against Tyreke Hill though in the SB....

HogsNSaints · Jan 25, 2021

If Aaron Rodgers was the Bucs QB this season, he would waltz to a Super Bowl. That roster is ridiculously talented. It doesn’t undo what Brady has accomplished and the 10 Super Bowl appearances are incredible for his legacy, but Brady has been very opportunistic this season.

He joined a top 10 defense with 2 pro bowl WRs, and then added another in spite of the fact that he has an on the books court date for a rape charge.. There’s at least 10 QBs in the NFL that would be in the Super Bowl with the TB cast. You could argue Brees would be one of them with that crew..

kizzy821 · Jan 25, 2021

NOFALCONS10 said:
1) He's the best at winning superbowls with a top 10 scoring defense making him appear to be the best qb all-time.

Even Tampa is #9 in scoring defense this year.

2) He's the best at miraculously playing like a 20 year old at 43 (presumably) without steroids.

3) He's the best at having a famous supermodel hot wife of all nfl QBs.

I guess this will have to do.

Posters declaring left and right that he's the best to ever do it, yet they can't support it outside of team wins... OR they substantially decrease the sample size and make it only about performances in the SB. As if a SB appearance is the first criteria when ranking greatness.

I've asked that question 3 or 4 different ways and nothing. Not even one superlative like most accurate, most elusive, toughest, best at improvising on a busted play - nothing.

Koketsu_Sama · Jan 25, 2021

I know a lot of tampa bay number 12 jerseys will get sold while ticket sales are down. That's all I got

sfidc3 · Jan 26, 2021

Stalwart385 said:
Only cumulative stats. If you look at efficiency or even per season stats compared to his peers each year he doesn't stand above any other QB. I'm fine if you think he is but the argument of best QB to play the game doesn't stop at Brady to me.

Well, I think cumulative stats matter, I mean it would be different if he were like an Eli Manning where he just was just ok or average during the regular season and played well in a handful of big games....but that is not the case. His career stats are
similar to Brees and he may well surpass him in many categories.

So, he has been to more, won more SB's than any other QB and he will hold a number of the all time career records for a QB, his season averages are among the best ever over his career (64% completion, 4,208 yds a season, 31 TD's, 10 Ints).

I get that folks don't like him and that he played for a team with a great coach and defense but I don't think that diminishes what he did on the field...others do, ok....

NOFALCONS10 said:
The rest of your superbowl argument is moot because, of course, if you go to the superbowl 10 times you're naturally going to have the most yards and td's.

If he were really the best in the superbowl then he would have more ti show for it than just career average or the most yards in a single game.

Again, Young threw the most tds and Sims had the best rating and Bradshaw had more yards per attempt.

Plenty of qbs out played Brady in Superbowls and in MVP years.

If this guy played for the Lions, he would be Marino or Rivers.

I think I stated that but it is not "moot" he holds the records until someone breaks them. You are cherry picking with the best of them....by you're "criteria" Brady could only be the best if he not only been in more SB's, won more SB's, held multiple career qb records and held every single SB individual game record....ok...sounds reasonable....LMAO.....

NOFALCONS10 said:
Ask Taysom Hill.

Hill had the same oline as Brees but managed to get sacked 13 times in 4 games, more than Brees did in his previous 15.

Is the same Taysom Hill that has been analyzed by a number of folks whose major criticism is he holds onto the ball too long? I mean do you really want to argue that? Ok....

NOFALCONS10 · Jan 26, 2021

sfidc3 said:
Well, I think cumulative stats matter, I mean it would be different if he were like an Eli Manning where he just was just ok or average during the regular season and played well in a handful of big games....but that is not the case. His career stats are
similar to Brees and he may well surpass him in many categories.

So, he has been to more, won more SB's than any other QB and he will hold a number of the all time career records for a QB, his season averages are among the best ever over his career (64% completion, 4,208 yds a season, 31 TD's, 10 Ints).

I get that folks don't like him and that he played for a team with a great coach and defense but I don't think that diminishes what he did on the field...others do, ok....

I think I stated that but it is not "moot" he holds the records until someone breaks them. You are cherry picking with the best of them....by you're "criteria" Brady could only be the best if he not only been in more SB's, won more SB's, held multiple career qb records and held every single SB individual game record....ok...sounds reasonable....LMAO.....

Is the same Taysom Hill that has been analyzed by a number of folks whose major criticism is he holds onto the ball too long? I mean do you really want to argue that? Ok....

Superbowls don't even factor into the equation for me when discussing individual greatness.

Individual accolades require individual merits to back them up.

Has he done more with less than Dan Marino?

Does he have more MVPs than Peyton Manning?

Does he own the highest QB rating in history for a 70,000+ yard passer?

His solo claims to greatness as an individual player are

--Multiple MVPs (one with Moss scoring 23 tds)
--NFL Career Touchdown record
-- Playing at a high level into his early 40s with guys like Mike Evan's and Antonio

Again, If he played for Detroit his entire career how many rings would he have compared to any other QB?

Pocket presence includes sensing pressure and knowing when to get rid of the ball.

What exactly do you think pocket presence is?

sfidc3 · Jan 26, 2021

NOFALCONS10 said:
Superbowls don't even factor into the equation for me when discussing individual greatness.

Individual accolades require individual merits to back them up.

Has he done more with less than Dan Marino?

Does he have more MVPs than Peyton Manning?

Does he own the highest QB rating in history for a 70,000+ yard passer?

His solo claims to greatness as an individual player are

--Multiple MVPs (one with Moss scoring 23 tds)
--NFL Career Touchdown record
-- Playing at a high level into his early 40s with guys like Mike Evan's and Antonio

Again, If he played for Detroit his entire career how many rings would he have compared to any other QB?

Pocket presence includes sensing pressure and knowing when to get rid of the ball.

What exactly do you think pocket presence is?

Right, this supports your notion that he has to be the best at every single measurable to be the best....that is an insanely high bar and honestly unrealistic.

And then attempting to learn me about pocket presence and implying Brady is somehow lacking in that area? that's gold Jerry....gold....

Let's just agree to disagree, our definitions/measurements on what determines who is the best are....different....

NOFALCONS10 · Jan 26, 2021

sfidc3 said:
Well, I think cumulative stats matter, I mean it would be different if he were like an Eli Manning where he just was just ok or average during the regular season and played well in a handful of big games....but that is not the case. His career stats are
similar to Brees and he may well surpass him in many categories.

So, he has been to more, won more SB's than any other QB and he will hold a number of the all time career records for a QB, his season averages are among the best ever over his career (64% completion, 4,208 yds a season, 31 TD's, 10 Ints).

I get that folks don't like him and that he played for a team with a great coach and defense but I don't think that diminishes what he did on the field...others do, ok....

I think I stated that but it is not "moot" he holds the records until someone breaks them. You are cherry picking with the best of them....by you're "criteria" Brady could only be the best if he not only been in more SB's, won more SB's, held multiple career qb records and held every single SB individual game record....ok...sounds reasonable....LMAO.....

Is the same Taysom Hill that has been analyzed by a number of folks whose major criticism is he holds onto the ball too long? I mean do you really want to argue that? Ok....

For good measure:

Even the thing he holds his hat on currently (the td record) is shaky because several modern qbs own a better touchdown percentage than Brady including Peyton Manning, Steve Young, Aaron Rodgers, and Tony Romo.

NFL Passing Touchdown % Career Leaders | Pro-Football-Reference.com

1. Sid Luckman (7.9%), 2. Frankie Albert (7.4%), 3. Frank Ryan (7.0%), 4. Otto Graham (6.6%), 5. Len Dawson (6.4%),