Dolphins lose two picks (1st and 3rd) and fined for (attempted) tanking and contract tampering (including Payton) (1 Viewer)

[Scorpius the Allfather]

I think the investigation team lead by Mary Jo White concluded that Ross wasn’t being serious. But still, it’s pretty ridiculous.

Oh that female dog was involved?

 

[superchuck500]

Oh that female dog was involved?

Yeah it’s always the same cast of characters.

 

[Scorpius the Allfather]

His agent had the inappropriate contact and Payton is on record for saying that no one talked to him about the Miami offer.

Payton is also on the record as saying he would've been coaching the Saints had he continued coaching this year.

 

[RebSaint]

Forgive this question if it's already been asked, but what the hell are the provisions of suspending an owner? I remember with Payton, it went well beyond being banned from all official team activities and even restricted any and all contact with team officials and players. I can't recall an owner getting ever getting suspended, much less what the provisions of that suspension were.

To draw not a good analogy, it's like saying I own a house, but can't go in the house or sell the house in any way despite the fact that I legally and financially own the house. I suspect it's probably easier because NFL teams are like corporations, but I'm wondering if there are any financial penalties, e.g. restricting the accruing any said financial benefits from the team, or even looking or engaging in other financial decisions that owners make on a routine basis. Being banned from contact with the team is doable and practical, but I'm wondering about the other functions of an owner that relate to financial transactions (I assume not without a legal transfer or giving power of attorney to someone or group).

It just seems impractical and almost impossible to me beyond banning the owner from showing up to games or practices and having any contact with the team. A player, coach, GM, or other official is doable. But an owner?

 

[superchuck500]

Forgive this question if it's already been asked, but what the hell are the provisions of suspending an owner? I remember with Payton, it went well beyond being banned from all official team activities and even restricted any and all contact with team officials and players. I can't recall an owner getting ever getting suspended, much less what the provisions of that suspension were.

To draw not a good analogy, it's like saying I own a house, but can't go in the house or sell the house in any way despite the fact that I legally and financially own the house. I suspect it's probably easier because NFL teams are like corporations, but I'm wondering if there are any financial penalties, e.g. restricting the accruing any said financial benefits from the team, or even looking or engaging in other financial decisions that owners make on a routine basis. Being banned from contact with the team is doable and practical, but I'm wondering about the other functions of an owner that relate to financial transactions (I assume not without a legal transfer or giving power of attorney to someone or group).

It just seems impractical and almost impossible to me beyond banning the owner from showing up to games or practices and having any contact with the team. A player, coach, GM, or other official is doable. But an owner?

I doubt it impacts things like accruing finances/profits/etc and just relates to being on site for activities and contact with the team. It is consensual - the owners agree to be bound to this process in the franchise agreement.

 

[RebSaint]

I doubt it impacts things like accruing finances/profits/etc and just relates to being on site for activities and contact with the team. It is consensual - the owners agree to be bound to this process in the franchise agreement.

Thanks. I put in the google machine and saw that Daniel Snyder was suspended recently and didn't find many details regarding specific provisions. This explanation makes sense from a legal standpoint regarding the ability of owners to do something as simple as sign checks or conduct other nuts and bolts functions of owning an NFL team within the parameters of a suspension.

 

[RJ in Lafayette]

I don't know how many league investigations Mary Jo White has conducted for the NFL, but it seems that in this instance and in Bountygate her investigation produced the exact findings that the NFL wanted. Here, the evidence of tampering was extensive and egregious, and inside the league, owners do not like the idea of top management under contract being contacted without permission by other teams. However, a finding that the owner had been offering under-the-table money to the head coach for the team to lose games would have been devastating to the league's image and integrity-of-the-game pretensions.

PS I am bad about providing links, but there was a February 2022 piece on PFT by Mike Florio, which I just saw and is online, noting that White has a history with the NFL and Ohio State of producing the investigative findings that her clients wanted to see. My take on Bountygate is a tad different from that of many on this forum, but in his piece, Florio notes that when the NFL had its press conference where White could discuss the league's evidence against the Saints, she sounded like a prosecutor giving a closing argument rather than an independent, no-agenda investigator and then misrepresented evidence she cited.

 

[Thunderchild]

Thanks. I put in the google machine and saw that Daniel Snyder was suspended recently and didn't find many details regarding specific provisions. This explanation makes sense from a legal standpoint regarding the ability of owners to do something as simple as sign checks or conduct other nuts and bolts functions of owning an NFL team within the parameters of a suspension.

Irsay was suspended for 6 games as well. Not many details here, either. Barred from team facilities, but not sure about financials. You would think that, with billions on the line that they would at least let him do financials. : shrug:

Good question.

Colts' Jim Irsay suspended six games, fined $500K

The NFL levied a six-game suspension on Indianapolis Colts owner Jim Irsay on Tuesday and fined him $500,000 for violating the league's Personal Conduct Policy.

www.nfl.com

 

[superchuck500]

Thanks. I put in the google machine and saw that Daniel Snyder was suspended recently and didn't find many details regarding specific provisions. This explanation makes sense from a legal standpoint regarding the ability of owners to do something as simple as sign checks or conduct other nuts and bolts functions of owning an NFL team within the parameters of a suspension.

Almost all of these teams are owned by multiple individuals, the person we identify as the "owner" is usually the majority owner - which means he/she owns more than 50% of the club or that a conglomerate that owns more than 50% has designated that person as their lead . . . and this is all usually based on some kind of management document (general partnership, LLC, or something along those lines).

I think Ross actually owns nearly all of the Dolphins, like 90+ percent. But these are sophisticated organizations with management structure including corporate officers. I don't think the 21st Century NFL owner sits in his/her office with a cigar signing checks. Not that you were saying that's the case, I'm just illustrating it that way . . . the business will function without the owner being there because it functions that way anyway, there's somebody else (or layers of people) with authority to "sign checks" and do nuts and bolts things.

That said, I'm sure that there's still major business that the owner is essential on, like a major stadium or sponsorship negotiation - and I don't know the answer as to whether the suspension impacts that. I would imagine that it doesn't, it's really more to being at the activities or working with the GM/team directly on personnel and other issues. But I suppose we don't really know what it means.

 

[sainthood]

I try to look on the bright side of this off season. There is a world where Sean Payton is traded to the Dolphins. Much of our retained staff follows him even if Dennis Allen says I could see a world where Ryan Neilson or Chris Richard is the DC in Miami and Pete Carmichael is the OC in Miami and team continuity of the Dennis Allen era suffers or worse the Saints are forced to go in an entirely new direction if Allen does not stay in New Orleans with the turmoil. The Saints could have taken the Payton picks as the ammunition to trade for Deshaun Watson who then on appeal by the NFL is suspended for the entire year and we have a PR nightmare left to wallow in the doldrums coachless, QBless, and rudderless.

Instead Payton had to put on this show of this fake retirement like his cohort Tom Brady's fake retirement. We get to keep Payton as a non-traitor and feel good about his time in New Orleans. Maybe the Saints openly trade him so the tampering issue is no longer relevant to Jerry Jones and Dallas next year, we get their first to replace the Olave trade. We have a wants-to-be-here lower salary cap zero draft pick used Jameis Winston with come back player of the year potential. We have rebuilt our entire wide receiver core, replaced our top two lost free agents at LT and FS. We have a new SS for retired Malcom Jenkins. Our recent draft picks look promising and the city is abuzz with optimism about the 2022 Saints loaded with young players not dwelling on the father figure that betrayed them in Miami.

I feel like Payton earned the right to go to Miami but the real fallout would have been raiding the remaining coaches in New Orleans and part of the shift in culture of an abandoned ship versus a personal decision. It is subtle but could be very relevant. The reality was the Miami Dolphins owner was willing to sell his soul and maybe the biggest coaching contract of all time to pair Brady and Payton in Miami. Those draft picks and in a way money went to Kansas City and Tyreek Hill instead. The idea Dolphins owner Steven Ross did not try to tank for Burrow is naive. Of course he tried. Flores wouldn't do it. It all blew up and the league cannot formally fine or suspend him for that because Congress would get involved because of the gambling and Las Vegas implications and impacting the real money of the league.

 

[JBofWDN]

A timeline and a little gasoline for the fire:

Early January (5th-ish) - Miami tampers with Payton

January 10 - Miami fires Flores

January 18 - Flores meets with NYG and schedule interview for January 27

January 24 - Belichick texts "the wrong Brian (Flores)" about NYG job

January 25 - Payton retires (the next day lol)

January 27 - Flores has NYG "interview" and then announces plan to file suit

January 29 - Brady retires

January 31 - Flores interviews with Saints (must've been some interesting convo)

February 1 - Flores files suit

February 28 - Reports of Miami formally requesting to speak with Payton & promptly being denied and full Payton/Brady plan, surfaces

 

[bclemms]

I don't trust any investigation led by the NFL.

The real truth will eventually come out but I'm not going to worry about it until it does.

 

[Big_L]

Facts apparantly don't matter to Big-L

Wow. Let’s keep it real, you don’t know either. Sure, Payton could be saying that to cover his 6 at this point.