Drew Brees 4th Down Leap (1 Viewer)

[Drew Beers]

Why does this play still exist? Sooner or later, one of two things is going to happen:

A) A defender is going to knock the ball out of Drew's hands.
B) The refs are going to rule (correctly) that breaking the plane of the first down line does not equate to a first down, and the ball will be spotted where Drew is actually downed.

NOTE: I'm not saying that Drew did not end up getting the first down, but I'm saying that his leap and reach doesn't automatically make it a first down.

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[darkhornet]

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Does not exist when the ball carrier gives up yardage on his own. A point many, many people in the thread seem to miss.

 

[Brennan77]

It's not quite the same but it reminds me of the leap by Pierre Thomas. Only in that situation the ball was knocked backwards.

 

[Taker597]

He was not hit on the helmet until after he pulled the ball back. If they had reviewed, the spot would have been the forward-most point after he was touched by the defender. I missed the hit on the helmet as I watched it yesterday, so I had to go back and look. The timing of the hit to the helmet would not have helped him in this case:


Timestamp: 7:41 for the play, in case the link doesn't take you there.

Ummm... It was reviewed?

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[HouseCall]

It's not quite the same but it reminds me of the leap by Pierre Thomas. Only in that situation the ball was knocked backwards.

Yup. That was in the OT of the NFC Championship in 09'. Thankfully they didn't have a good enough angle to "move" the spot. Was sweating bad during that sequence.


As for Drew...

I'm with the few who think running that type of leap sneak is risky because it relies on the refs "getting it right" and as we know -- that's a scary proposition.

Brees pulled the ball back before he was contacted -- even if the contact to his helmet initiated the "forward progress" mark, he was given the spot at his arm's full extension -- which he retracted before being hit by a defender. So I believe we benefited from a close call.

I think Arians had grounds to challenge -- but it would have been almost impossible to overturn due to the pile-up. In the end -- the call worked, but it was very risky to rely on the refs.

 

[darkhornet]

Ummm... It was reviewed?

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If I recall correctly, it was not reviewed. The Saints were able to get the next snap off before Tampa Bay challenged.

Edit: Confirmed by the fact that Tampa Bay had one timeout before the play, and still had one timeout later in the highlights. Tampa didn't get a challenge off for that play

 

[BELOWSEALEVEL]

Watch them call it on us in the playoffs.
Roger Goodell has a plan

 

[Super44]

I thought, as with any play, the spot was the forward progress of the ball

CORRECT! Regardless if the player is not down by contact, such as Drew was. Essentially the QB is giving himself up on that play, for forward progress. Similar to a player giving themselves up, without being touched, to stop the clock.

 

[Taker597]

If I recall correctly, it was not reviewed. The Saints were able to get the next snap off before Tampa Bay challenged.

Edit: Confirmed by the fact that Tampa Bay had one timeout before the play, and still had one timeout later in the highlights. Tampa didn't get a challenge off for that play

Yep, you're right. Just pulled it up. It was the just the measurement and Fox bringing Mike in for his opinion.. Watch way too much football yesterday

Where he landed still look good.

 

[VPCajun]

1. A team tried the Drew Brees Special in the exact situation and they ended up fumbling it. Redskins vs Bears MNF

2. You're incorrect. Since he's immediately contacted. It's forward progress

Forward progress only comes into play when a DEFENDER pushes the carrier backwards.

Until the ball carrier is touched, the ball is where the ball is.

Drew wasn't touched until he had pulled the ball back to himself.

 

[bobad]

I think technically he should’ve been short since he brought the ball back. Breaking the plane only works on the goal line and didn’t see the defense contact him until after he had pulled the ball back.

The defensive wall stopped Drew's forward progress. If not, he would still be going, right? It doesn't matter if the OL was sandwiched in between, the defense still is what stopped forward progress.

 

[Noble Saint]

The defensive wall stopped Drew's forward progress. If not, he would still be going, right? It doesn't matter if the OL was sandwiched in between, the defense still is what stopped forward progress.

That’s not how it works. You aren’t down until you are touched by defense or give yourself up.

 

[Quiet Storm]

I don't really remember Drew doing the leap when it didn't involve the goal line.

You would be correct.

He's never done that in the middle of the field, only in goal line situations. So to the OP, this is the only time he done this for a first down. Otherwise it's always been for a TD.

I did wonder how he would be with that type of play with his thumb. Seemed confident.

 

[bearze34]

Why does this play still exist? Sooner or later, one of two things is going to happen:

A) A defender is going to knock the ball out of Drew's hands.
B) The refs are going to rule (correctly) that breaking the plane of the first down line does not equate to a first down, and the ball will be spotted where Drew is actually downed.

NOTE: I'm not saying that Drew did not end up getting the first down, but I'm saying that his leap and reach doesn't automatically make it a first down.

I don't remember him ever failing from jumping over on 4th and inches. Why get rid of a play that works? When they stop him a few times I am sure Payton will reasess.

 

[DCTransplant]

You would be correct.

He's never done that in the middle of the field, only in goal line situations. So to the OP, this is the only time he done this for a first down. Otherwise it's always been for a TD.

I did wonder how he would be with that type of play with his thumb. Seemed confident.

I've seen him do it on 4th and short in the middle of the field before, but of course it's more often goal line. It always works, and I still hate it. I've wondered the same thing every time he's done it in non-goal line, but this is the first time I heard it questioned by the broadcasters.

I can buy the argument that he's giving himself up similar to sliding, but not 100% sure that applies since every other 'giving up' scenario I can think of involves the ball continuing to move forward.

Regardless, I hate it. I expect him to get creamed every time, and I especially worry about a fumble when it's not a goal line scenario. For some reason, Tom Brady can always get 2 yards on a QB sneak the conventional way... If you're gonna put Drew out there to take a shot, I just think that's the better way.