EJW Mock Draft "after" Rob Ryan Hiring (1 Viewer)

Money doesn't make sense with Harper a trade. Also his relationship with the coaches and leadership in the locker room make it even more unlikely for a trade. With the way the bush trade was handled, the saints obviously take into consideration what te players want and I seriously doubt Harper wants to go play for Gregg Williams after what he did to the players. If the Titans were to value Harper that much to go after him, then he's obviously a good player, that the saints can't afford to lose.


And finally, in what world does Harper no fit in as Safety in a 3-4? Go back to 2010 and 2011. Harper's sacks and biggest plays were made in various forms of the 3-4. He was moved up into an OLB position to rush the passer and was also solid in covering TE's. Spags never used him in coverage.

I agree with a lot of ELIASJWILLIAMS logic actually. You make good points as well but it's all speculation and he's just using the information available to pick a draft he thinks makes sense logically. Regarding Harper in the 3-4, you could make the argument that GW used him the way he did because he was the best man for that job on our defense at that time. That doesn't necessarily mean that after a round of FA, and the Draft he'll still be the best man for that job. Whilst I don't think Payton is in a hurry to trade him I think if the right offer came in for Harper he'd send him.

Elam for me was the best player on a really good Florida defense last year. Florida's main problems were playing down to the level of their weaker competition and inconsistency on the offensive side of the ball. Their defense was stout and made plays often and a good portion of the time Elam was making those plays one way or another. I wouldn't be disappointed with that pick if he was considered BPA even though the consensus on the board is that D-Line or OLB are more pressing needs.

Of course the logic used here doesn't account for exactly what we'll do in FA so it's an educated shot in the dark, the plan will brighten up a bit after FA starts and we make signings, let some people walk. Most people won't like it but if Bushrod walks for example then it's almost certain that OT shoots to the top of the priority list unless we get an equivalent or better replacement in FA.
 
Why is 'after' in quotation marks in the title? Are you being ironic somehow?
 
Why is 'after' in quotation marks in the title? Are you being ironic somehow?

lol a lot of my logic changed after we hird Ryan compared to my personal choice Grantham. FA aquisitions changed and also my draft logic and going after particular players.

Like Elam. I hadn't projected him in any of our previous drafts. However since signing Rob im picking him. Rob coached his older brother Abe in two previous spots(also having us grabbing him here) We would have some very good insight on him and he fits the mold of the typical SS in Rob Ryans scheme. He can play well in run support but has good ball skills in zone coverage when playing the deep 3rd. He is a tonesetter and forceful hitter and fits the scheme much better than Roman Harper does especially from a coverage standpoint.
 
Ellias J Williams, M Jenkins will never return to be a CB....period.

We entertained this idea in the past, on the count of Spags being the DC, so he will have his zone D in place....

But Spags got canned, and Rob Ryan uses man to man concepts, so Jenkins will never be a CB in his system. He's too slow!

You can make an argument that Jenkins stinks at FS.....but as things stand, that's pretty much the only position where he is serviceable....
 
Ellias J Williams, M Jenkins will never return to be a CB....period.

We entertained this idea in the past, on the count of Spags being the DC, so he will have his zone D in place....

But Spags got canned, and Rob Ryan uses man to man concepts, so Jenkins will never be a CB in his system. He's too slow!

You can make an argument that Jenkins stinks at FS.....but as things stand, that's pretty much the only position where he is serviceable....

Jenkins you are right..this will be the last time i vision myself putting him @ Corner. With IAQ being a restricted FA i like the fact of him breathing down MJ's neck. If MJ wasn't good enough to be a Man corner in 3G's scheme then it won't work in this one. Touche on that.

Addressed it already but i appreciate the contrast.
 
lol a lot of my logic changed after we hird Ryan compared to my personal choice Grantham. FA aquisitions changed and also my draft logic and going after particular players.

Like Elam. I hadn't projected him in any of our previous drafts. However since signing Rob im picking him. Rob coached his older brother Abe in two previous spots(also having us grabbing him here) We would have some very good insight on him and he fits the mold of the typical SS in Rob Ryans scheme. He can play well in run support but has good ball skills in zone coverage when playing the deep 3rd. He is a tonesetter and forceful hitter and fits the scheme much better than Roman Harper does especially from a coverage standpoint.

This more than explains your rationale for the new post but not the quotation marks. They just confused me that's all, because they aren't supposed to be used for emphasis, which is what it seems now like you were doing.

As for LSSpam's original critique of your post, where did he say you weren't allowed to speculate? He questioned the realism of your trades, which seems a legitimate point for discussion, no?
 
This more than explains your rationale for the new post but not the quotation marks. They just confused me that's all, because they aren't supposed to be used for emphasis, which is what it seems now like you were doing.

As for LSSpam's original critique of your post, where did he say you weren't allowed to speculate? He questioned the realism of your trades, which seems a legitimate point for discussion, no?


He questioned the realism when i felt he should have questioned the compensation of the trades which i would gladly adjust.

The colts have a Need@RB on offense. They are in the AFC so if we make a trade with anyone u want to put the guy in a different conference. We traded Reggie and Ricky Williams to the Dolphins. The reason...we don't have to have them bite us in the butt very often.

I may have gotten it wrong with the value of the draft pick(which i don't think a late 4th rounder is a bad price to pay for a RB like ivory with little mileage on him. Perhaps a 5th sounds better?



Trading Roman Harper to the Titans also makes logical sense from my view. They have a need@ safety and 3G was just brought on board there. He fits the 4-3 scheme as a SS and extra blitzing LB in passing situations better than he fits it in a 3-4. Again we trade him to the AFC so he doesn't come back to bite us.


LSS was questioning my logic and preceeded to bash me as though i was being this senseless kid drawing up trades in la la land, when in reality they were well thought out i just may be a bit off on the compensation.


I don't mind contrast as i take feedback into consideration. I started out with us getting a 4th for roman and a 3rd for Ivory. Ive changed it every time ive mentioned it and tried to make it as realistic as possible each time. I don't always project trades and this time i did.

Next time ill lower my asking price and alter my draft to show it.

If you were to make a trade what value do u see us getting for Harper/Ivory?


Right now im @ a 5th rounder for both???



As far as the quotations i was to call attention to the point that it was AFTER hiring rob ryan. All of my previous draft were predicated on us hiring Rob Grantham. Sorry to confuse...
 
If you were to make a trade what value do u see us getting for Harper/Ivory?


Right now im @ a 5th rounder for both???

Zero. We will/would get no picks for either player in all likelihood.

Roman Harper, especially, if we're showing a willingness to move on from him no team has any incentive whatsoever to trade anything for him. Due to his salary and our cap situation he either factors into our plans next season or we are cutting him. In which case why would anyone give up anything for him?

For Ivory, the only way anyone gives anything up for him is if we slap a 2nd round tender which, again, we're unlikely to do because of our cap situation.

The likely outcome for both is Roman Harper restructures and is in the team next year and Ivory gets the lowest tender and either signs with someone else for no compensation or plays out next year on the low tender. If we don't restructure Harpers deal the NFL will correctly assume we'll end up cutting him outright. Maybe we gamble on trying to give Ivory a 2nd round tender in the hopes we can get anything for him, if we really had exclusive rights I do think we could get a 5th or 6th, but most teams again would (probably correctly) assume we wouldn't go into the season with him on a 2nd round tender given our cap constraints and just wait us out on it. We'd be scared he'd sign the tender and just play the year out and hit the market the next (if I were him and got appx. 2 million dollar tender I'd take it in a heart beat.)
 
Zero. We will/would get no picks for either player in all likelihood.

Roman Harper, especially, if we're showing a willingness to move on from him no team has any incentive whatsoever to trade anything for him. Due to his salary and our cap situation he either factors into our plans next season or we are cutting him. In which case why would anyone give up anything for him?

For Ivory, the only way anyone gives anything up for him is if we slap a 2nd round tender which, again, we're unlikely to do because of our cap situation.

The likely outcome for both is Roman Harper restructures and is in the team next year and Ivory gets the lowest tender and either signs with someone else for no compensation or plays out next year on the low tender. If we don't restructure Harpers deal the NFL will correctly assume we'll end up cutting him outright. Maybe we gamble on trying to give Ivory a 2nd round tender in the hopes we can get anything for him, if we really had exclusive rights I do think we could get a 5th or 6th, but most teams again would (probably correctly) assume we wouldn't go into the season with him on a 2nd round tender given our cap constraints and just wait us out on it. We'd be scared he'd sign the tender and just play the year out and hit the market the next (if I were him and got appx. 2 million dollar tender I'd take it in a heart beat.)


My thinking with Ivory is that if we Tender him with a 2nd rounder we risk a division rival like the Falcons picking him up. I guess im asking after cuts and restructuring would it make much sense to Tender Ivory with a 1st rounder to ward of any unwanted suitors and then sign and trade him?

I don't see him back next year. I think its pointless to have 5 rb's. You end up with someone being disgruntled because they aren't getting touches. Kills the rhythm for the other RB's


My reason for trading Harper is get at least 1 new starting safety. Harper still has value..especially in the 46 packages that Rob might run.


The next draft i do will probably have a scenario with Jenkins/Harper duo but we will draft a SS like Cooper Taylor late.

IF harper isn't traded then i don't see him being outright cut. I see a restructure more than anything..though im not sure about the **cant restructure in back to back years** rule that some have pointed out.
 
It's possible, it's just without a 2nd rounder tender there is no point. He's an UDFA. Unless he gets a 2nd or 1st round tender no one has to give us anything if they sign him. We only get right to match with any other tender level. 2nd round tender is probably about $2 million dollars.

Given our cap situation, are you willing to pay our 4th/5th RB $2 million I stead of grabbing someone at the rookie minimum of 365k or whatever it is at the moment? Probably not, and everyone else in the NFL knows that.

So again, why would someone do a sign and trade with us? We're to likely to tender him at a 2nd round level and so if anyone wants him, all they have to do is go out and sign him.
 
It's possible, it's just without a 2nd rounder tender there is no point. He's an UDFA. Unless he gets a 2nd or 1st round tender no one has to give us anything if they sign him. We only get right to match with any other tender level. 2nd round tender is probably about $2 million dollars.

Given our cap situation, are you willing to pay our 4th/5th RB $2 million I stead of grabbing someone at the rookie minimum of 365k or whatever it is at the moment? Probably not, and everyone else in the NFL knows that.

So again, why would someone do a sign and trade with us? We're to likely to tender him at a 2nd round level and so if anyone wants him, all they have to do is go out and sign him.

Gotcha..well for all intents and purposes ill probably stay away from making trades in my next mock.


I do however hope that Ivory lands us an extra pick in this draft. To get ANY value from a guy that we brought in as an UDFA is a win on our part. Doesn't matter if its a 5th or 6th its more than we payed to get him.

If someone wanted to give up a 2nd for him id be estatic
 

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