Ex-Astros P Mike Fiers says Astros used center-field camera to steal signs (Update: MLB issues punishment) MERGED (8 Viewers)

tenordas

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Now some clown Illinois Congressman wants Congress to step in and take over the whole situation.

I'm not defending the Astros at all. They cheated and the parties involved were punished as they should be. However, why do these clowns in Congress feel entitled to run every business in the country? They need to buzz off. This is a free enterprise country. Government does NOT need to be dictating how MLB runs its business, even if they run it badly. That's for the American people to do as consumers.
 

Saint Jack

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Now some clown Illinois Congressman wants Congress to step in and take over the whole situation.

I'm not defending the Astros at all. They cheated and the parties involved were punished as they should be. However, why do these clowns in Congress feel entitled to run every business in the country? They need to buzz off. This is a free enterprise country. Government does NOT need to be dictating how MLB runs its business, even if they run it badly. That's for the American people to do as consumers.
Because now that gambling is legalized, there needs to be no room for error.
 

BuddyDeesGhost

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No proof Rose ever bet against the Reds. Plenty of proof he bet on the Reds. Rose was the most competitive, ahole, SOB on the planet. I actually believe that man couldn't bet on himself to lose. He didn't think he could lose.

If everyone is doing this level of technology sign stealing, does that make it ok? Sure everyone was doing roids, wasn't OK, but players basically didn't get punished like it seems Astros players will not be punished.

I played low level college baseball. I can tell you it is a huge advantage knowing if an off-speed or fastball is coming. Yes baseball is hard when doing something correct 25% of the time gets you millions, but to say it is just an "edge" to know if an off speed or fastball is coming is a huge understatement.


Ultimately, in the big picture, at least for the next 5 years. The Astros are really not getting punished at all IMO. They have an amazingly talented team. No players are going to get punished. IMO, Managers and GM's have the least short term effect on the outcome of games versus any other sport. Plus the Astros will most likely just hire another great manager and GM. Those 4 draft picks won't hurt for at least 5 years because we all know most young baseball talent doesn't even make the bigs for 4-5 years.

Count your lucky stars. If camera sign stealing is no big deal to you, don't sweat it. It got you a WS. If it was fair and square in your mind, why is this even bothering you?
Well I'll tell you up front why it's bothering me. The stros have always been my favorite team since the mid-70's. Saw a game in the astrodome and I was hooked. I stuck with them through about 45 years of futility till they finally broke the curse. I hate to see the 2017 championship marred by something as commonly practiced as sign-stealing, even if they "used technology" to do it.

For the life of me, I also can't see how this highly complicated system could work. Or why it would be necessary. You played baseball - you tell me. How would they deal with a contingency like sign rotation with such a system? How would they deal with a change of pitchers?

If Hinch himself had not confessed then I would say the entire sign stealing system sounds so convoluted, then their only crime is stupidity. Sure I understand an on field person (ie: baserunner, base coach, etc.) could interpret and signal a nuanced sign to a batter, but to call it in from center field and relay it using a trash can? Seems like something the three stooges would do?

Of course, were other managers were even more stupid because they couldn't figure out what was going on or how to take advantage of it. Then those managers should be fired as well.

I'm also bothered since the majority of people here can't seem to see the logical comparisons between this and bountygate.

I hope you're right that they will continue to be competitive, but something tells me Jim Crane made his profits and is ready to put the team up for sale. As for the GM, I can't for the life of me figure out why Ludnow was flat out fired, I Crane wasn't ready to hang it up?

Pete Rose - First he said he didn't. Then he said he did. Then he said he didn't again. But I agree with you that as a PLAYER, he could and would never had bet against himself. He is certainly among the top 3 players of all time and will probably get into the hall eventually - but only posthumously. I think there's generally more concern about what he did while he was manager of the Reds. Especially when his gambling habit got him in hot water with the mob.
 
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kcirdor

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I do not remember even starting this thread... then the dates on the OP and Tweets don't make sense...
 

superchuck500

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I do not remember even starting this thread... then the dates on the OP and Tweets don't make sense...
Sorry, I was trying to clean it up and made a mistake and merged it with an old Nascar thread that you started. You can't delete the OP and your thread was older so you moved to the top.

So I just stuck the Astros OP content (that I had actually posted) on your post.

I was going to IM you about it but never got around to it.
 
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kcirdor

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Ok.. Just making sure I didn't do some drunk posting one night.
 

Optimus Prime

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.......According to people at all levels throughout the sport — players, clubhouse staff members, scouts and executives — the idea that the Astros employed nefarious methods was an open secret.

“The whole industry knows they’ve been cheating their a---- off for three or four years,” said an executive from a team that faced the Astros in the playoffs during that span. “Everybody knew it.”

Like most of the people interviewed for this story, the executive spoke on the condition of anonymity to defy an MLB request that personnel from other teams refrain from speaking freely about the Astros.

He estimated “10 to 12” teams had complained to MLB about the Astros over the years. An executive from another team agreed with that number.........

 

Optimus Prime

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Could there be any backlash to MLB itself if people have been complaining about this for years and they did nothing?
 

superchuck500

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.......According to people at all levels throughout the sport — players, clubhouse staff members, scouts and executives — the idea that the Astros employed nefarious methods was an open secret.

“The whole industry knows they’ve been cheating their a---- off for three or four years,” said an executive from a team that faced the Astros in the playoffs during that span. “Everybody knew it.”

Like most of the people interviewed for this story, the executive spoke on the condition of anonymity to defy an MLB request that personnel from other teams refrain from speaking freely about the Astros.

He estimated “10 to 12” teams had complained to MLB about the Astros over the years. An executive from another team agreed with that number.........

Just getting to this article. It's a great read.


 

Optimus Prime

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Good opinion piece
=================

Given the severity of the Houston Astros’ cheating scandal, it would be almost impossible for the coverup to do any more damage to the game of baseball. But the Astros and Major League Baseball Commissioner Rob Manfred are giving it their best shot.

The Astros have been unrepentant and sorry only that they got caught, if that. Oh, sure, owner Jim Crane fired general manager Jeff Luhnow and manager A.J. Hinch, but that now appears to be a move made to deflect any blame away from him.

In the Astros’ embarrassing news conference on the first day of spring training, Crane insisted he bore no responsibility for the scandal and at one point actually said, “Our opinion is that it didn’t affect the outcome of the game.” Fifty-five seconds later, he said he did not say those words..........

 

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