Expanding technology to the ball (1 Viewer)

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Someone who’s a little more tech savvy than me might shoot this down or provide more information on it. It seem to me that gps chips have gotten small enough in size that we should be able to somehow incorporate one or more into the ball itself. I know it would take some work to make it so it didn’t effect the flight of the ball either while passing or kicking.
This would all be done to improve placement of the ball and to determine if the ball actually breaks the plane of the goal line. It would also be nice if something could be done with the field to detect the exact location of the ball.
 

Dre

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While we're at it, the ridiculous idea that we're still using chains on the yard markers should be addressed...
I do find it amusing that we use a ref’s purely subjective (and sometimes crude) take on ball spotting, then we take out the chains to perfectly and exactly measure whether or not that subjective spotting grants a team a first down.
 
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So I worked for over 2 years at SMT, and they are the folks that would do this but the ball would need like 20 chips in it(x like 200 balls a weekend) and that is not gonna happen.
 

tinman

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I always thought that a readable bladder materiel would be usable. No additional "parts" & little/no change in balance /weight of the balls. Using permanent goal line readers, & portable units in sideline(possibly overhead) would least be able to give the zebras 1 less thing to watch for. Paying closer attention to contact(ground/personnel) could only help.

I'm not taking bets on implementation anytime soon.
 

BryanD

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I like the fact that tennis uses the cyclop technology for determining on court placement of the ball. There is definitely technology that can be incorporated into the ball with a mesh of sensors/emitters.

It may take a few years to develop and roll out but it should be doable in this day and age.

It’ll definitely cost millions for R&D but that is a drop in the bucket considering the costs of games lost due to not having the best technology available, imho.
 

Ihartsaints

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GPS tracking wouldn't work. The military grade reception only gets you down to a few meters. The civilian band is multiples larger. It's fine for a lot of things especially when you can extrapolate due to roadways and add in cell data, but the accuracy needed for football placement would be impossible.

That said, an RFID system might be possible. I'd guess you'd have to line the bottom of the field with them and then put specifically placed chips in the football to determine it's location and orientation.

That said, you'd still have the issue of when is the player deemed down? That would be the trickier part to sort out. It's likely possible, but at some point in doing it, you no longer are playing football as we know it.
There is what is called differential GPS. Simply put a stationary GPS receiver is placed at a known point in space. For instance at one corner of the field. Since that receiver already knows exactly where it is (you told it where you placed it) it can calculate the error in the received satellite signals. A second receiver that is in motion can use the correction information from the stationary receiver to correct its own received signal. If you are within a reasonable distance of the stationary receiver then accuracies of 1-2 centimeters are routine and 1- 2 mm are technically possible with several stationary receivers.

Even without differential GPS the newest L-Band satellites can provide accuracies of less than a foot.

If you like GPS - You can thank Gladys West who developed the mathematical models at the Naval Surface Warfare Center that are the foundation of GPS science.

1617392353398.png


Dr. Gladys West, Another 'Hidden Figure,’ Inducted Into Air Force Hall Of Fame

"from the mid-1970s through the 1980s, using complex algorithms to account for variations in gravitational, tidal, and other forces that distort Earth’s shape, she programmed an IBM 7030 ‘Stretch’ computer to deliver increasingly refined calculations for an extremely accurate geodetic Earth model, a geoid, optimized for what ultimately became the Global Positioning System (GPS) orbit,” the Air Force Space Command said.

1617393323262.png
 
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UFCSaint

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Someone who’s a little more tech savvy than me might shoot this down or provide more information on it. It seem to me that gps chips have gotten small enough in size that we should be able to somehow incorporate one or more into the ball itself. I know it would take some work to make it so it didn’t effect the flight of the ball either while passing or kicking.
This would all be done to improve placement of the ball and to determine if the ball actually breaks the plane of the goal line. It would also be nice if something could be done with the field to detect the exact location of the ball.
Another tweak, if you can put air pressure sensors on tires to determine the range they are in...why not design one for a football? Some type of strip, lettering, logo, etc that would indicate when it is below/above an acceptable psi.
 

SweetT

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I also wonder if it is because time for advertisement. Advance technology would remove alot of down time, ill imagine without all the booth reviews, chain gangs, challenges etc, there would be alot of commercials either forced and feel out of place or will be played while watching the game. Advertising plays a big part of american TV and the success of NFL I doubt they want to give that up. BUT That is one thing i enjoy about watching Soccer, it feels more fluid to watch.
With all of the extra time it saves, they wouldn’t have to add more commercials and such. They could enhance the viewer’s experience by showing the many ways Zebra technology impacted plays of the game. It would essentially be free marketing for Zebra stock/services, the distance/penalties would be more transparent, etc. They already do it with next gen showing how fast players are running, air yards, etc. I think all of that stuff is cool. I don’t think refs messing up the game is cool.
 
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There is what is called differential GPS. Simply put a stationary GPS receiver is placed at a known point in space. For instance at one corner of the field. Since that receiver already knows exactly where it is (you told it where you placed it) it can calculate the error in the received satellite signals. A second receiver that is in motion can use the correction information from the stationary receiver to correct its own received signal. If you are within a reasonable distance of the stationary receiver then accuracies of 1-2 centimeters are routine and 1- 2 mm are technically possible with several stationary receivers.

Even without differential GPS the newest L-Band satellites can provide accuracies of less than a foot.

If you like GPS - You can thank Gladys West who developed the mathematical models at the Naval Surface Warfare Center that are the foundation of GPS science.

1617392353398.png


Dr. Gladys West, Another 'Hidden Figure,’ Inducted Into Air Force Hall Of Fame

"from the mid-1970s through the 1980s, using complex algorithms to account for variations in gravitational, tidal, and other forces that distort Earth’s shape, she programmed an IBM 7030 ‘Stretch’ computer to deliver increasingly refined calculations for an extremely accurate geodetic Earth model, a geoid, optimized for what ultimately became the Global Positioning System (GPS) orbit,” the Air Force Space Command said.

1617393323262.png
Women like her and the mathematicians who were instrumental in America’s space program need more recognition for the outstanding work the have done for our country.
 

SuperSaint

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I do find it amusing that we use a ref’s purely subjective (and sometimes crude) take on ball spotting, then we take out the chains to perfectly and exactly measure whether or not that subjective spotting grants a team a first down.
Exactly, they use computer-aided tracking in tennis to determine balls in and out and it's smaller and going faster than a football...
 

platinumvinnyv

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With all of the extra time it saves, they wouldn’t have to add more commercials and such. They could enhance the viewer’s experience by showing the many ways Zebra technology impacted plays of the game. It would essentially be free marketing for Zebra stock/services, the distance/penalties would be more transparent, etc. They already do it with next gen showing how fast players are running, air yards, etc. I think all of that stuff is cool. I don’t think refs messing up the game is cool.
commercials and advertisements are a revenue stream, example tide pays CBS to play their commercials during the game which helps pay for NFL contracts. the more audience and commercials the more revenue atleast how I understand it. I dont think the will want to cut commercial time. I might be wrong
 

SweetT

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commercials and advertisements are a revenue stream, example tide pays CBS to play their commercials during the game which helps pay for NFL contracts. the more audience and commercials the more revenue atleast how I understand it. I dont think the will want to cut commercial time. I might be wrong
They could keep the same allotted time for commercials as now. If using enhanced technology were to cut down time, by removing refs, then the extra time is what I’m referring to. I would say add more commercials (bc the NFL is so darn money hungry), but they would possibly lose viewership, by forcing more commercials. No one really cares to see commercials, but viewers would love to see technological transparency. However, I’m sure that doesn’t fit their agenda.
 

Merl

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commercials and advertisements are a revenue stream, example tide pays CBS to play their commercials during the game which helps pay for NFL contracts. the more audience and commercials the more revenue atleast how I understand it. I dont think the will want to cut commercial time. I might be wrong
Your right about how it works but also the contracts guarantee a certain amount of minutes per game for the commercials.
 

onanygivensunday

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I don't see it ever happening in football because it's not the be all, end all solution.

For example, many times a player with the ball steps out of bounds while the ball itself is still inbounds. Knowing the path of the football through embedded sensors doesn't tell the refs where the ball was at the moment the player stepped out of bounds. That kind of play would still require the judgement of the sideline officials to spot the ball correctly, or near as correctly as humanly possible.
 

dutar76

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A mesh inside the outer layer of the football with a sensor stretching the length of the outer edge of the goal line. Seems simple enough in theory. But that would take major decisions out of the refs hands. Nfl can’t have that.
BINGO
 

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