For the win, 4th and 2 off a timeout (1 Viewer)

[Saint Kamara]

Yep. I think they said his range is like 46 yards.

No way that's his range, especially indoors.

Hell Venateri's range was still 50-52 yards before the injury.

 

[SigFreudianSlip]

No way that's his range, especially indoors.

Hell Venateri's range was still 50-52 yards before the injury.

Idk. That’s just what they said on the telecast.

 

[Saint Kamara]

Or, I don't know, TACKLE him!

Oh wait, Marcus doesn't know how to tackle and the coaches are fine with that.

[sigh]

Yeah so Allen's play call is to put a rookie on the best TE in football with Marcus Williams as tackling support behind him.

Jesus Christ help us all.

 

[SaintStephen1]

I agree above with the post about DA trying to win the game on that 4th and two. I called today and offered to fly to New Orleans and train Payton and Allen on how to close out a game on defense when the opposition has a long way to go with few TOs. The key is to rush only two guys and drop six across in the short zones with three behind them. The opposing QB won’t find anybody open and will have to dump shirt passes eating up the clock. The mistake the Saints keep making is that every player sent in pass rush means one less in coverage. If the rushers don’t get there the QB has areas he can throw into. You’re better off dropping all 11 into coverage than rushing four or more if they don’t affect the QB. Had the Saints done that against Niners in 2011 and in Minnesota in 2017 and again yesterday. They would have won all those games.

 

[syracuse saint]

I re-watched the game last night. I paid special attention to the 4th and 2 play. It makes me want to throw up for a couple of reasons. One reason is that we should have called a TO right after the Niners called theirs and lined up. We would have had a chance to see their formation and been ready for what we were seeing, because clearly we were not. If you have the stomach to re-watch the game and review that play, watch it in slow motion and watch how long it took for the safeties to enter the picture despite being 15-20 yards down field. We must have been playing 2 deep safeties on that play because there was no help in sight and #43 Williams took forever to streak in to make contact. I am not sure what we were thinking on that play. Were we playing to give up the first and hope time ran out before they could attempt a field goal? Head scratcher

 

[TenTwo]

Everybody saying we blitzed on the 4th and 2, but when I rewound it I only remember seeing us rush 4. Who was the blitzer?

 

[SaintsFanatic]

Davis blitzed

 

[syracuse saint]

Davis blitzed

Davis rushed. I don't think we blitzed though. I know this is a technicality, but blitzing means sending more guys than they have blockers. We rushed 5, counting Davis and they had 5 blockers, which makes even less sense when you have 2 deep safeties that have no impact on any play less than 40 yards, other than to make a tackle 30 yards downfield. So, unless you get a sack, which we didn't, we took 7 of our 11 defenders out of the play by playing 2 deep safeties and rushing 5, which means 4 guys were assigned to 5 offensive possible targets in the 1 yard to 30 yard range.

 

[SammyDaLoon]

Dennis Allen is to blame for the 4th & 2 play!!!

Simple as that.

He shoudv’e put a more athletic & VETERAN CB on Kittle. BB with the Patriots does this all the time with pass catching Tight Ends. Butttt nooooo DA has other ideas? ??‍

 

[zeketombar]

We don't have much speed on the back end of our defense. LAR, Houston, SF - those teams have guys that can fly and they kicked our buttocks. None of our remaining opponents have wheels like that and then in the playoffs, it's SF and maybe Minnesota that could give this secondary issues again. I agree that we played poorly but a lot of it is the matchup and that won't be fixed this season. I guess if we are looking to SB, good thing it will be played on grass if we get there. I agree that the scheming and technique left something to be desired Sunday as well.

 

[zeketombar]

Davis rushed. I don't think we blitzed though. I know this is a technicality, but blitzing means sending more guys than they have blockers. We rushed 5, counting Davis and they had 5 blockers, which makes even less sense when you have 2 deep safeties that have no impact on any play less than 40 yards, other than to make a tackle 30 yards downfield. So, unless you get a sack, which we didn't, we took 7 of our 11 defenders out of the play by playing 2 deep safeties and rushing 5, which means 4 guys were assigned to 5 offensive possible targets in the 1 yard to 30 yard range.

This is a very good description. It's maddening that Kittle is STILL running, with this kind of "safety help."

 

[efil4stnias]

If it were me I would have bracketed him. One guy would have been responsible for inside move (unlikely) and another waiting to jump the out route. Would have put money on the out route because if time/distance/and field position.

ok with who??? bracketed with who?

Go look at the stack and tell me who would be responsible for who in that formation and how. Because the two up WR are there to clear out the underneath. And if you tell your players to sit on the under/out route....that leaves those two WR free just past the line.

 

[efil4stnias]

Dennis Allen is to blame for the 4th & 2 play!!!

Simple as that.

He shoudv’e put a more athletic & VETERAN CB on Kittle. BB with the Patriots does this all the time with pass catching Tight Ends. Butttt nooooo DA has other ideas? ??‍

who? What veteran gets the call?

did you even see the formation? He was in a stack...designed specifically to let him operate in SPACE ( avoid the jam at LOS )

 

[syracuse saint]

ok with who??? bracketed with who?

Go look at the stack and tell me who would be responsible for who in that formation and how. Because the two up WR are there to clear out the underneath. And if you tell your players to sit on the under/out route....that leaves those two WR free just past the line.

who? What veteran gets the call?

did you even see the formation? He was in a stack...designed specifically to let him operate in SPACE ( avoid the jam at LOS )

There is a proper defense to defend a triple stack set. Rushing your middle LB with a 2 deep safety package would be the worst choice. It would have helped to have your MLB undercut the LB route and had one of those 2 safeties that were 30 yards downfield to factor into the play. We had 4 defenders guarding 5 offensive players that Jimmy G could choose from. We should have used our final time out to discuss what would be best once we saw their formation. Does this answer your questions?

 

[SaintsFanatic]

I went back and looked at the game film...we rush 3 DL, blitz Davis and it seems like it's man coverage with 2 deep safeties...

I'm no expert but wouldn't some type of cover 3, or cover 1 with some underneath LB zone be a better fit for this situation?

Maybe i'm just being results oriented because TWO guys had a shot at the ball carrier and both whiffed, so i think they deserve more of the blame than the defensive call. It's pretty bad that neither guy could make a play. CGJ just took a bad angle and made poor attempt. Instead of playing it safe, catching up to kittle and tackling the legs, he attempted to make a shoestring tackle to try and keep him from getting 1st down. Rookie mistake.