Fred Thomas?? (1 Viewer)

[SaintJ]

What's interesting is that it wasn't just this year, we've been quietly a consistent top 10 pass D for years. Even during Venturi's D

Perhaps in some alternate universe; I simply must start watching those Stargate SG-1 reruns.

These are the NFL pass defense rankings by

year -- YPG/YPA/Rating

2005 -- 3rd/26th/27th

2004 -- 27th/26th/20th

2003 -- 8th/14th/13th

2002 -- 27th/27th/16th

The other factors in opp. QB rating are TD% and INT%, and I don't think they add as much as yards per game and yards per attempt, since a 2 yard TD pass counts more than a 50-yard bomb to the 1-yard-line, and INTs are, to some extent, a defensive style risk/reward decision. I will say that we had 20 INTs in 2002, which is the only reason such a bad defense would jump 11 slots from YPG/YPA.

They were actually decent in 2003, but we started that year 4-8 and trailed big in a bunch of games, and in 2005, we were pretty much always behind by a bunch, and nobody bothered to throw on us, but when they did, they were awful effective. We were helpless in pass defense in 2002 and 2004, just helpless. Freddy T. played OK, and Ambrose had one death-rattle year with us, but our safeties were always slow, and when Sammy left, they couldn't create TOs either.

Based on what I think I see when I watch the games and what I think the stats back up, this team is markedly more consistent and effective on pass D this year, despite losing Harper early and having Freddy miss a few games, without any astonishing top-tier pass rushers or LBs gifted in coverage. It's just a solid team effort, and I lay every ounce of it on three things this coaching staff has that the previous one couldn't find if you left it on the meeting room podium: an ability to scheme, an ability to get players in the best position to maximize their strengths, and an ability to get the players to buy into the package heart and soul.

 

[Domeination]

I have a feeling that at some point in the season, maybe even in the playoffs, we're all going to be glad we still have Fred Thomas. He's clearly got a gimpy hammy, which has limited his speed and effectiveness. On the other hand, he's tough as nails and provides great run support and I believe could still be effective in pass D in nickle and dime packages. With the way injuries can crop up (didn't Deloach get injured in the second half yesterday?), we're going to need Fred to get healthy. Somewhere down the line, he's going to make another critical play for us. In the offseason, sure, we need to draft DBs and possibly acquire one or two DBs through free agency. But we still need FT on the Saints this season.

 

[SuperSaintJohn69]

He was toasted in the Green Bay game by Jennings. Toasted in the browns game (75 yard TD was called back because of a tacky holding call that everyone on this board admitted we got lucky on). He gave up 10 passes to Carolina. He was beat bad by Joey Galloway both times we played the bucs this year. McNabb picked on him all game and he gave up several big pass plays in the 2nd half. Baltimore exclusively passed to his side of the field when we played them. McNair passed on him the entire time. He didn't play the Pittsburgh game. He was killed in the Bengals game.

There ya go. He has been consistently beat all year long. Does the Safety deserve some blame. Probably. But its clear he is hurt and does not have the Athletic ability to play the position well at this point in time.

I don't really care what other CB's are getting burnt this year. I don't need to make excuses for why a player is bad. I fell into that with brooks for far to long. What I see is what I judge.

that's the way I saw it. What's it take to admit that this guy is past his prime. idk

 

[Loose Cannon]

that's the way I saw it. What's it take to admit that this guy is past his prime. idk

That's the way you saw it?

Even though bclemms just gave you hard evidence that the way "you saw it" is not based in reality whatsoever?

OK.

 

[BoNcHiE]

That's the way you saw it?

Even though bclemms just gave you hard evidence that the way "you saw it" is not based in reality whatsoever?

OK.

What? That Thomas consistently gets burned once or twice a game for a TD and gives up at least 80-90 yards to his man every week?

Sorry if I don't find those numbers flattering.

 

[Loose Cannon]

The Cleveland game Charlie Frye completed 6 passes for 60 yards to his WR's.

The Green Bay game Farve and Driver put up nice numbers, most of which came against Mike Mckenzie. Greg Jennings also had a nice 22 yard TD catch against MM. Thomas all but shut down his side of the field.

The 1st Atlanta game Thomas played outstanding. MM had a good game but did get beat deep by Ashley Lelie.

Week 4 Thomas held Steve Smith under 100 yards and much of this was in man coverage and Smith lined up opposite Thomas nearly the entire game.

Week 5 Galloway had a nice TD in the back of the endzone against Thomas early in the game but the coverage was good. Thank god Galloway dropped the pass at the end of the game when he was running wide open after beating MM or we would have lost that game. Thomas played very good that game.

Week 6 The Eagles had the #1 passing attack in the NFL coming into the game and we limited McNabb to 247 yards passing, season low at that time. Reggie Brown had a long play when he got between Thomas and Bullocks in a zone defense and he broke the tackles of our entire freaking defense to take it to the house. After that Thomas shut down his side of the field and our corners only allowed 7 catches for 81 yards to the WR's.

Week 7 we had a bye

Week 8 Thomas gave up a few 5-10 yard passes in front of him but again, we held the WR's of the Ravens to 9 catches for 91 yards.

Week 9 Galloway got his big play on a safety biting against Thomas. Other than that Tampa completed 4 passes to their WR's the entire game.

Week 10 Ok, our secondary looked bad and Rothlisburger torched us but Thomas didn't even play. Our secondary had the worst game of the season.

Week 11: The Bengals game. Yes Carson Palmer and Chad Johnson made our secondary look bad. Again, Thomas was responsible for one of the big plays and the 2 yard slant by Chad Johnson. The 2 yard slant was a perfectly thrown ball in man coverage and even though Thomas was all over CJ it is impossible to beat the perfect throw on a 2 yard slant.

Week 12: We played the Falcons and looked good doing it Craft and MM did a good job limiting Vick under 100 yards passing. Thomas didn't play but again, we were playing Michael Vick.


So exactly what game was it that Thomas was getting killed?

Bonchie, you need to reread this.

 

[BoNcHiE]

Bonchie, you need to reread this.

Which one of those games did he not give up at least 90 yards and a TD? 1?

Don't see the point. He was a great player. Now he doesn't impress me at all.

You can blame the Safety all you want but when Fred isn't within 10 yards of the player that just burnt him something is still wrong. (see CJ and Joey Galloway this year)

 

[LSSpam]

Which one of those games did he not give up at least 90 yards and a TD? 1?

Don't see the point. He was a great player. Now he doesn't impress me at all.

You can blame the Safety all you want but when Fred isn't within 10 yards of the player that just burnt him something is still wrong. (see CJ and Joey Galloway this year)

Week 1, 2, 3, 4 (Steve friggen Smith no less), 8.

 

[BoNcHiE]

Week 1, 2, 3, 4 (Steve friggen Smith no less), 8.

I should of said OR a TD. My mistake. He did get burnt bad in week 1 for a 75 yard TD. Luckily a holding call that had no bearing on the play got it called back.

He was on Driver most of the game in Greenbay (week2). Driver had 153 yards.

I admit that was a snap statement and I was wrong. Sorry.

 

[Super Dad]

Hey guys don't worry Fredie has a thumb injury and will probubly wear a big white cast on one hand. Does anyone else remember what he played like a couple years ago with a cast on one hand. Look out Freddie T and Bellamy are back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[BoNcHiE]

Hey guys don't worry Fredie has a thumb injury and will probubly wear a big white cast on one hand. Does anyone else remember what he played like a couple years ago with a cast on one hand. Look out Freddie T and Bellamy are back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

He was very good then. His thumb didn't keep him from running with his man though. Hes noticeably slower now.

 

[bclemms]

MM is the better of the two corners, he has proven that over the past few weeks but he really limits our defense by only playing one side of the field. Thomas is a solid #2 corner but any #2 corner matched up against a quality #1 WR is a mismatch. Coaches go way out of their way to identify and exploit mismatches, especially in a secondary. So by having MM only playing one side of the field it allows coaches to create a mismatch any time they want because they will always know where Thomas and MM are going to line up. There is a reason that Chad Johnson, Steve Smith, Joey Galloway and all the other #1 WR's are going against Fred Thomas. When you have a #2 corner going against a #1 WR in man coverage and an average pass rush then you should expect a lot bigger numbers than what Fred Thomas has allowed.

 

[IceHot]

Luckily a holding call that had no bearing on the play got it called back.

I never get these statements. Of course Holding has a bearing on the play. Thats why they call it a penalty.

Offensive Interference is also a penalty and has a bearing on plays.

 

[LSSpam]

I should of said OR a TD. My mistake. He did get burnt bad in week 1 for a 75 yard TD. Luckily a holding call that had no bearing on the play got it called back.

He was on Driver most of the game in Greenbay (week2). Driver had 153 yards.

I admit that was a snap statement and I was wrong. Sorry.

90 yards and a TD

Now, i'm no English major but...

 

[BoNcHiE]

Now, i'm no English major but...

Me either, but I know when someone says "they should of said" and what that means.