Great speech by Dr. Benjamin Carson (1 Viewer)

BHM

Can't please 'em all
Gold VIP Contributor
Joined
Mar 16, 2006
Messages
15,217
Reaction score
14,081
Age
55
Location
Lafayette, LA
Offline
One of the more unique speeches delivered at this morning’s National Prayer Breakfast came from Dr. Benjamin S. Carson, a world-renowned pediatric neurosurgeon at Johns Hopkins Hospital. Taking the stage before President Barack Obama’s faith-filled address, Carson spoke for more than 25 minutes, tackling issues ranging from education to personal responsibility.


Kind of long but more than worth the time. He touches on our nation's debt, taxes, eduction, healthcare and political correctness dangers.Some of his more interesting suggestions were medical savings plans that start from birth, a tax plan that follows the religious practice of tithing.




<object width="560" height="315"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/PFb6NU1giRA?version=3&hl=en_US&rel=0"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/PFb6NU1giRA?version=3&hl=en_US&rel=0" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="560" height="315" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true"></embed></object>


 
OP
BHM

BHM

Can't please 'em all
Gold VIP Contributor
Joined
Mar 16, 2006
Messages
15,217
Reaction score
14,081
Age
55
Location
Lafayette, LA
Offline
Short version...






<object width="560" height="315"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/W4e0VZnV9oE?version=3&amp;hl=en_US&amp;rel=0"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/W4e0VZnV9oE?version=3&amp;hl=en_US&amp;rel=0" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="560" height="315" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true"></embed></object>
 

You

SR is my life!
VIP Contributor
Joined
Jun 15, 2010
Messages
14,225
Reaction score
8,400
Location
SE, Louisiana
Offline
Wow. Lots of common sense there.
The health savings accounts are such an obvious free market solution to some of the issues facing health care costs. Obama wants them eliminated.
 
OP
BHM

BHM

Can't please 'em all
Gold VIP Contributor
Joined
Mar 16, 2006
Messages
15,217
Reaction score
14,081
Age
55
Location
Lafayette, LA
Offline
Wow. Lots of common sense there.
The health savings accounts are such an obvious free market solution to some of the issues facing health care costs. Obama wants them eliminated.
I am not really familiar with HSSA plans. I am assuming it is for paying for minor and routine health care only.

When I get some time, I want to find more details on his plans. Who will contribute to the plan from birth until their first job?
 

You

SR is my life!
VIP Contributor
Joined
Jun 15, 2010
Messages
14,225
Reaction score
8,400
Location
SE, Louisiana
Offline
I am not really familiar with HSSA plans. I am assuming it is for paying for minor and routine health care only.

When I get some time, I want to find more details on his plans. Who will contribute to the plan from birth until their first job?
Its basically a medical ira. Pre tax Money is put in and can only be used for medical expenses either minor or major.

It goes well with the consumption tax scheme that I'm always trumpeting. It encourages savings and specifically savings with personal healthcare as priority. If it were done nationwide then we could see less burden on the government to take care of us.
 

MLU

Please respect my decision!
Joined
Apr 28, 1999
Messages
55,202
Reaction score
21,170
Location
Mesa, AZ
Offline
... we could see less burden on the government to take care of us.
Its really hard to respond intelligently and take you seriously when you post **** like this.

I'm a 37 year old man with a family of three. I'm not wealthy, but I do okay. I have had to deal with bumps along the way and me being a guy who doesn't have family to depend upon, I have taken advantage of government programs along the way. I have no problem doing that because I have paid into the system and its there to help if I need it. The government didn't take care of me. I still had to get up and start over again. The government doesn't give a citizen enough help to take care of them unless you're content to live far, far below the poverty line. I'm still waiting to meet the first person who fits that description.

HSA is not the answer. Its definitely an important part and of a lot of peoples solutions, just like IRAs are part of a lot of peoples retirement solutions. You have to have money to put into an HSA before you can take money out and any interest earned is minimal. The nice thing about an HSA is the money rolls over so you can actually save and have a tidy sum eventually, assuming you don't have medical issues that wipe it out.
 

You

SR is my life!
VIP Contributor
Joined
Jun 15, 2010
Messages
14,225
Reaction score
8,400
Location
SE, Louisiana
Offline
Its really hard to respond intelligently and take you seriously when you post **** like this.

I'm a 37 year old man with a family of three. I'm not wealthy, but I do okay. I have had to deal with bumps along the way and me being a guy who doesn't have family to depend upon, I have taken advantage of government programs along the way. I have no problem doing that because I have paid into the system and its there to help if I need it. The government didn't take care of me. I still had to get up and start over again. The government doesn't give a citizen enough help to take care of them unless you're content to live far, far below the poverty line. I'm still waiting to meet the first person who fits that description.

HSA is not the answer. Its definitely an important part and of a lot of peoples solutions, just like IRAs are part of a lot of peoples retirement solutions. You have to have money to put into an HSA before you can take money out and any interest earned is minimal. The nice thing about an HSA is the money rolls over so you can actually save and have a tidy sum eventually, assuming you don't have medical issues that wipe it out.
Your response was indeed less than intelligent, but not because you aren't capable of intelligent responses but because arrogance brought you quickly to the draw and forced you to come to conclusions about something that probably would have been better handled with a question. You are probably the smartest poster on this site. Certainly smarter than me.

Its hard though for you to try to respond intelligently to perceived postings that you imagine to be dumb.
I didn't say hsa's were THE answer.
We will likely always need government involvement in our healthcare needs. Hsa and or any sort of tax free savings accounts are fantastic but the government limits how much can be saved!!!!! Now THAT is idiotic!

Expand HSA's and it can reduce the burden for us to rely on the government to take care of our healthcare needs and mostly from the wealthy who can be pretty darn bratty about what they deserve from government's overly generous medicare system.
 

dtc

VIP Subscribing Member
VIP Contributor
Joined
Dec 26, 2006
Messages
29,428
Reaction score
28,537
Location
Redneck Riviera
Offline
Your response was indeed less than intelligent, but not because you aren't capable of intelligent responses but because arrogance brought you quickly to the draw and forced you to come to conclusions about something that probably would have been better handled with a question. You are probably the smartest poster on this site. Certainly smarter than me.

Its hard though for you to try to respond intelligently to perceived postings that you imagine to be dumb.
I didn't say hsa's were THE answer.
We will likely always need government involvement in our healthcare needs. Hsa and or any sort of tax free savings accounts are fantastic but the government limits how much can be saved!!!!! Now THAT is idiotic!

Expand HSA's and it can reduce the burden for us to rely on the government to take care of our healthcare needs and mostly from the wealthy who can be pretty darn bratty about what they deserve from government's overly generous medicare system.
I like the idea of HSAs and I, too, find the low caps to be silly, but I just don't get your argument.

Poor people can't save enough to make it worthwhile and when they can save, they sure aren't prone to putting it in HSAs with little flexibility and low returns. Worse, even a person making $100k per year who saves $10k per year starting at 30 hasn't saved enough to even make a dent in a major health care cost that comes up at 40 so all an HSA really could be is a deductible coverage device.

Expanding HSAs is ok, but fixing the needs of the bratty rich who demand medicare is as simple as means testing and lifting the contribution caps.
 

JonsDuu

Veteran
Joined
May 19, 2012
Messages
229
Reaction score
173
Offline
I like the idea of HSAs and I, too, find the low caps to be silly, but I just don't get your argument.
The limit is there because this country is divided on who should pay taxes and who shouldn't pay taxes. Remove the cap and you essentially convert medical/dental expenses into tax credit. The higher the limit, the less taxes are paid. And since the HSA is mainly used by higher earner, that means the "rich" are paying less taxes than the "middle".

The health saving account is part of the consumer-driven healthcare philosophy, the other half being the high deductible medical plan -- the first $2-3k come out of your pocket, so you need to be an intelligent consumer. For example, I recently had my annual physical and needed blood work. Under my older plan, I would just go downstair from the doctor office and get the bloodwork done and pay a $50 co-pay. With the high deductible, I have to pay the entire cost of the blood work. And the downstair one costed $1,200. So I picked up the phone and called around, walk a block to another facility, and paid $200 for blood work there. By being a more intelligent consumer, I reduced the cost of the healthcare (doesn't matter if my old plan paid for it, the bloodwork still cost $1,200 -- somebody is paying for it; eg rest of you subscribers).

With the affordable care act, the high deductible plan will become extinct, so there won't be an need for the HSA.

And the affordable care act had to be paid somehow. The HSA are usually chosen by higher income earner, so eliminating HSA would then force these higher income earner to pay taxes to fund obamacare.

So we can now all go back to walking downstair to get our bloodwork done and pay $50 co-pay and call it affordable healthcare (nevermind the rest of the subscribers need to pick up the remaining $1,150).


Poor people can't save enough to make it worthwhile and when they can save, they sure aren't prone to putting it in HSAs with little flexibility and low returns.
My HSA is managed by JP Morgan and I got full investing options -- I can invest just like a 401(k).

Worse, even a person making $100k per year who saves $10k per year starting at 30 hasn't saved enough to even make a dent in a major health care cost that comes up at 40 so all an HSA really could be is a deductible coverage device.
As for "saving"; that's the wrong viewpoint. Healthcare, like food, are a basic human right. And as such, needs to be paid for. Food get consumed daily, so people have no problem paying daily. Healthcare get consumed infrequently, so people have a problem paying daily. Change the viewpoint on healthcare toward the latter such that one pay daily for healthcare and we would be hurting to pay for it when needed. At least that's how I interpret what the doctor is saying.

As for whether one should need to choose between health and food, well, these needs need to be paid for. Just a question of by whom. I don't have a problem with helping those who can't help themselves. But I do have a problem with helping those who could help themselves, but choose instead to take advantage of me.
 

V Chip

Truth Addict (aww ^&%$ I got a head rush)
VIP Subscribing Member
Gold VIP Contributor
Joined
Aug 14, 2001
Messages
12,939
Reaction score
17,156
Age
53
Location
Close enough to ATL to smell the stink of Falcons
Offline
Kind of long but more than worth the time. He touches on our nation's debt, taxes, eduction, healthcare and political correctness dangers.Some of his more interesting suggestions were medical savings plans that start from birth, a tax plan that follows the religious practice of tithing.
I watched this when you posted it, and again lately now that it's being passed around like some conservative kind bud, and still am not sure what about it is supposed to be so great. I mean, yes we should treat academics as important or more so than athletics, and we should encourage reading and turning off the TV, and we should have HSAs to help with health care costs. But we already have those things, and we basically already knew all of this. So what is the revelation?
 

You

SR is my life!
VIP Contributor
Joined
Jun 15, 2010
Messages
14,225
Reaction score
8,400
Location
SE, Louisiana
Offline
I like the idea of HSAs and I, too, find the low caps to be silly, but I just don't get your argument.

Poor people can't save enough to make it worthwhile and when they can save, they sure aren't prone to putting it in HSAs with little flexibility and low returns. Worse, even a person making $100k per year who saves $10k per year starting at 30 hasn't saved enough to even make a dent in a major health care cost that comes up at 40 so all an HSA really could be is a deductible coverage device.

Expanding HSAs is ok, but fixing the needs of the bratty rich who demand medicare is as simple as means testing and lifting the contribution caps.
Again, its not THE answer. 10k a year would be a huge help for a generally healthy person short and longterm.

I don't know either how poor people would find ways to contribute to an hsa. They'd probably need government assistance.

I'm not sure I agree with means testing medicare. Why should it matter what I earn or have to get gov care? I think the level, and cost of that care is the problem. Old folks have an entitlement mentality and its a monster breathing down our necks as baby boomers enter the hypocritical, ehhh, I mean hypermedical stage of their life. I won't be running for federal office so I can say that.

Again, the hsa is not the answer but a part of the solution. Its the right mindset.
 

dtc

VIP Subscribing Member
VIP Contributor
Joined
Dec 26, 2006
Messages
29,428
Reaction score
28,537
Location
Redneck Riviera
Offline
The limit is there because this country is divided on who should pay taxes and who shouldn't pay taxes. Remove the cap and you essentially convert medical/dental expenses into tax credit. The higher the limit, the less taxes are paid. And since the HSA is mainly used by higher earner, that means the "rich" are paying less taxes than the "middle".

The health saving account is part of the consumer-driven healthcare philosophy, the other half being the high deductible medical plan -- the first $2-3k come out of your pocket, so you need to be an intelligent consumer. For example, I recently had my annual physical and needed blood work. Under my older plan, I would just go downstair from the doctor office and get the bloodwork done and pay a $50 co-pay. With the high deductible, I have to pay the entire cost of the blood work. And the downstair one costed $1,200. So I picked up the phone and called around, walk a block to another facility, and paid $200 for blood work there. By being a more intelligent consumer, I reduced the cost of the healthcare (doesn't matter if my old plan paid for it, the bloodwork still cost $1,200 -- somebody is paying for it; eg rest of you subscribers).

With the affordable care act, the high deductible plan will become extinct, so there won't be an need for the HSA.

And the affordable care act had to be paid somehow. The HSA are usually chosen by higher income earner, so eliminating HSA would then force these higher income earner to pay taxes to fund obamacare.

So we can now all go back to walking downstair to get our bloodwork done and pay $50 co-pay and call it affordable healthcare (nevermind the rest of the subscribers need to pick up the remaining $1,150).




My HSA is managed by JP Morgan and I got full investing options -- I can invest just like a 401(k).



As for "saving"; that's the wrong viewpoint. Healthcare, like food, are a basic human right. And as such, needs to be paid for. Food get consumed daily, so people have no problem paying daily. Healthcare get consumed infrequently, so people have a problem paying daily. Change the viewpoint on healthcare toward the latter such that one pay daily for healthcare and we would be hurting to pay for it when needed. At least that's how I interpret what the doctor is saying.

As for whether one should need to choose between health and food, well, these needs need to be paid for. Just a question of by whom. I don't have a problem with helping those who can't help themselves. But I do have a problem with helping those who could help themselves, but choose instead to take advantage of me.
Yeah, well what needs to change is the difference in price between the $200 blood work and the $1200 blood work and with health reform that mandated pricing be disclosed we'd all be better off. Still, the cost of one heart attack is more than the average American can save in 10 years. And then some.

Also, what you think of as a high deductible plan is what I think of as a low deductible, but I get your point and agree. Pricing clarity is one of the most important things we can do to add some actual market sense to this mess.

Why can you go to the doctor and be told you need surgery and even with a week of phone calls you can't possibly figure out what it's going to cost.

Nobody knows. Nobody knows all the various bills that will come. It's a freaking mess.
 

dtc

VIP Subscribing Member
VIP Contributor
Joined
Dec 26, 2006
Messages
29,428
Reaction score
28,537
Location
Redneck Riviera
Offline
Again, its not THE answer. 10k a year would be a huge help for a generally healthy person short and longterm.

I don't know either how poor people would find ways to contribute to an hsa. They'd probably need government assistance.

I'm not sure I agree with means testing medicare. Why should it matter what I earn or have to get gov care? I think the level, and cost of that care is the problem. Old folks have an entitlement mentality and its a monster breathing down our necks as baby boomers enter the hypocritical, ehhh, I mean hypermedical stage of their life. I won't be running for federal office so I can say that.

Again, the hsa is not the answer but a part of the solution. Its the right mindset.
Well, if you're 65 and you've got SS to live off of and a $1500 per month pension you might need free health care. If you're 65 and you've got $20mil in the bank you don't need my tax dollars to pay for your viagra or blood pressure pills.
 

saintfan-n-alex

Super Forum Fanatic
Joined
Feb 16, 2005
Messages
9,847
Reaction score
3,371
Offline
I have a HSA and used it to pay for medical expenses /meds till deductible was met - didn't have to use any of my weekly paycheck for any medical expenses thus was able to pay all other bills - I'm far from wealthy or a high earner

Not sure where the HSA is for wealthy but in my case and other employees at this job and last one (was able to maintain HSA and second employer contributes to the same HSA ) none were high earners
 

dtc

VIP Subscribing Member
VIP Contributor
Joined
Dec 26, 2006
Messages
29,428
Reaction score
28,537
Location
Redneck Riviera
Offline
I have a HSA and used it to pay for medical expenses /meds till deductible was met - didn't have to use any of my weekly paycheck for any medical expenses thus was able to pay all other bills - I'm far from wealthy or a high earner

Not sure where the HSA is for wealthy but in my case and other employees at this job and last one (was able to maintain HSA and second employer contributes to the same HSA ) none were high earners
Just from experience with my wife, I can tell you that the max you put in over 4 or 5 years won't cover the out of pocket expenses on a true high-deductible plan for breast cancer.

AFLAC is a far better investment than an HSA, FYI.
 

Create an account or login to comment

You must be a member in order to leave a comment

Create account

Create an account on our community. It's easy!

Log in

Already have an account? Log in here.

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 1)

 

New Orleans Saints Twitter Feed

 

Headlines

Top Bottom