Hard no on that proposed CBA.--J.J Watt (1 Viewer)

[Merl]

I agree and understand that. I’m assuming Loose Canon is playing devils advocate and trying to be funny but really it’s sad that athletes make millions and cry about contracts and not being highest paid and blah blah blah, while the other 99% of America works their butts off to make ends meet, I just don’t have any sympathy for them. If this were the 40’s-70’s where these players worked real jobs during the week and played ball on Sunday barely scraping by I could understand. But hearing a bunch of “rich” people cry over a few more million just aggravates me.

Actually he is being a complete butthole that gets to join my ignore list.

 

[No2DC]

I agree and understand that. I’m assuming Loose Canon is playing devils advocate and trying to be funny but really it’s sad that athletes make millions and cry about contracts and not being highest paid and blah blah blah, while the other 99% of America works their butts off to make ends meet, I just don’t have any sympathy for them. If this were the 40’s-70’s where these players worked real jobs during the week and played ball on Sunday barely scraping by I could understand. But hearing a bunch of “rich” people cry over a few more million just aggravates me.

There is a lot of sacasim in this thread but I think there is a fundamental owners/administrators vs. workers debate going on as well. Some people see the players as "workers" and the nfl as "owners". Yes both sides make dramatically more than the majority of people but it ultimately comes down to who you identify more with. Players or owners.

 

[Trey W.]

There is a lot of sacasim in this thread but I think there is a fundamental owners/administrators vs. workers debate going on as well. Some people see the players as "workers" and the nfl as "owners". Yes both sides make dramatically more than the majority of people but it ultimately comes down to who you identify more with. Players or owners.

serious question cause I don’t know the answer. How much do the owners pay for event staff or do they even pay event staff? Also, I know the state and other entities help pay for new stadiums and renovations but don’t the team owners pay into that also? Not to mention coaches, assistants, security, trainers, equipment, jerseys, cleats, pads, and all the travel and hotel expenses all get paid from somewhere.

Just saying, players aren’t the only thing owners are responsible for paying for with their money.

 

[Taurus]

I agree and understand that. I’m assuming Loose Canon is playing devils advocate and trying to be funny but really it’s sad that athletes make millions and cry about contracts and not being highest paid and blah blah blah, while the other 99% of America works their butts off to make ends meet, I just don’t have any sympathy for them. If this were the 40’s-70’s where these players worked real jobs during the week and played ball on Sunday barely scraping by I could understand. But hearing a bunch of “rich” people cry over a few more million just aggravates me.

Hearing a bunch of even richer people complain about having to pay the less rich ones aggravates me even more.

I hope the players grind 'em for every possible dime, every concession, because you know what? That's how those billionaires made their billions.

 

[sfidc3]

I agree and understand that. I’m assuming Loose Canon is playing devils advocate and trying to be funny but really it’s sad that athletes make millions and cry about contracts and not being highest paid and blah blah blah, while the other 99% of America works their butts off to make ends meet, I just don’t have any sympathy for them. If this were the 40’s-70’s where these players worked real jobs during the week and played ball on Sunday barely scraping by I could understand. But hearing a bunch of “rich” people cry over a few more million just aggravates me.

Man you must really detest NFL owners then, because their level of greed is off the charts worse!!!!!!

BTW, I agree with LC on this but felt he could have expressed himself a bit less harshly....the work you do is very important, just not as popular. And I totally agree with the notion that most cops and teachers are underpaid....

 

[No2DC]

serious question cause I don’t know the answer. How much do the owners pay for event staff or do they even pay event staff? Also, I know the state and other entities help pay for new stadiums and renovations but don’t the team owners pay into that also? Not to mention coaches, assistants, security, trainers, equipment, jerseys, cleats, pads, and all the travel and hotel expenses all get paid from somewhere.

Just saying, players aren’t the only thing owners are responsible for paying for with their money.

I don't know the specifics for each team but I'll point to a couple of knowns. The old model use to be that teams got the state/local government to pay for stadiums but over the past 10+ years more municipalities have rejected the idea of using tax payer money to pay for new stadiums. The one currently being built in La. is owner funded (I believe he is the richest owner[Rams]. The team as to pay for stadium security, etc. but now most companies place bids to get their food and products in the stadium (papa johns, Bud, etc.). Also, all teams actually share league revenue (TV contracts are a huge source of income), so you can be cheap like the Browns owner or spend money like Jerry. You are not operating at a lost, no owner is. To become an NFL owners one of the most exclusive clubs in this country, and buying a franchise is not how these guys made their fortune.
https://www.actionnetwork.com/nfl/nfl-2018-19-revenue

 

[insidejob]

Boy, this thread is a fun read. I'll make sure to read it from the beginning again when I'm looking to have a good time.

 

[Loose Cannon]

I agree and understand that. I’m assuming Loose Canon is playing devils advocate and trying to be funny but really it’s sad that athletes make millions and cry about contracts and not being highest paid and blah blah blah, while the other 99% of America works their butts off to make ends meet, I just don’t have any sympathy for them. If this were the 40’s-70’s where these players worked real jobs during the week and played ball on Sunday barely scraping by I could understand. But hearing a bunch of “rich” people cry over a few more million just aggravates me.

The point that I'm making is that you are being presumptuous and ignorant in the way you see an NFL player's job. It is an incredibly difficult and stressful full-time job. While some NFL players end up very rich, the majority of them do not make enough in their career to set themselves up for life. For most NFL players the lifetime value of being a football player is lower than the lifetime value of being a police officer or a teacher or a desk worker.

You saying " it’s sad that athletes make millions and cry about contracts and not being highest paid and blah blah blah, while the other 99% of America works their butts off to make ends meet" is the equivalent of me saying something like "it's sad that cops make 70-90k plus significant perks plus overtime plus incredible pensions that 99% of the country doesn't get so that they can walk around getting free food from restaurants and shooting minorities for existing. And on top of that, their little police unions constantly cry about them being underpaid while they make 4x minimum wage with incredible benefits, putting them solidly into the upper middle class and top 5-10% of the country, wealth wise".

Both are ignorant statements. Try to expand your world view a bit.


Further, it's interesting when people complain about the primadonna players making the money they do, but have no issue with the owners hoarding billions of dollars that they "earned" simply by having a rich daddy. At least the players actually work for a living. I wonder why you have no issue with the owners having enormous unearned wealth, but you begrudge the players for their earning power.

 

[Taurus]

The folks who say "They get paid big bucks to play a game" aren't thinking about it like it's the business that it is.

The NFL owners almost all have many businesses they own or run. The team just happens to be one of them. If you have a multimillion-dollar enterprise where only 53 people are responsible for all of your income, where they're the ones who close the deals and generate the revenue, it's no surprise that those 53 are going to drive as hard a bargain compensation-wise as they possibly can. Who'd begrudge them that?

 

[Trey W.]

The point that I'm making is that you are being presumptuous and ignorant in the way you see an NFL player's job. It is an incredibly difficult and stressful full-time job. While some NFL players end up very rich, the majority of them do not make enough in their career to set themselves up for life. For most NFL players the lifetime value of being a football player is lower than the lifetime value of being a police officer or a teacher or a desk worker.

You saying " it’s sad that athletes make millions and cry about contracts and not being highest paid and blah blah blah, while the other 99% of America works their butts off to make ends meet" is the equivalent of me saying something like "it's sad that cops make 70-90k plus significant perks plus overtime plus incredible pensions that 99% of the country doesn't get so that they can walk around getting free food from restaurants and shooting minorities for existing. And on top of that, their little police unions constantly cry about them being underpaid while they make 4x minimum wage with incredible benefits, putting them solidly into the upper middle class and top 5-10% of the country, wealth wise".

Both are ignorant statements. Try to expand your world view a bit.


Further, it's interesting when people complain about the primadonna players making the money they do, but have no issue with the owners hoarding billions of dollars that they "earned" simply by having a rich daddy. At least the players actually work for a living. I wonder why you have no issue with the owners having enormous unearned wealth, but you begrudge the players for their earning power.

You’re being presumptuous by putting words in my mouth. I don’t feel any different about the owners or players. And players make money off of endorsements, advertisements, commercials, etc too. Just because a lot of them are careless with their money or live elaborate lifestyles, that’s not the owners fault. Heck they even have seminars for the incoming rookies telling them this exact same thing, if they don’t listen again it’s not the owners fault. I can’t imagine anyone on this site that couldn’t live comfortably off of a practice squad players salary much less a starters salary.

If a player doesn’t like the way his contract is then he shouldn’t sign it. If the contract is heavily back loaded and he knows he’ll never see that money because of clauses written into the contract just so he can say for a year that he is the “highest paid” player then that’s his fault.

I’m more about the Team than I am individual players. Sure I love having Drew, MT, AK, Davis, Jordan, etc but players come and go, the Team remains. I’ve been critical of Drew’s contracts where he alone was making 20-25% of yearly salary cap. That leaves 75-80% for 52 other players to compete for. And now players like Mahomes are probably about to break into the 40millions. Yes the cap goes up but so does every other new salary.

That’s why I like the idea of heavily incentive based contracts. It’s protects the team when a player doesn’t live up to his end and it rewards the player for doing well.

 

[kizzy821]

100% agree! How many “REAL” jobs (jobs that actually impact people’s lives and not just provide entertainment) out there get paid a small fraction of what these players make and put their lives and health on the line every day (Police, Firefighters, Soldiers, EMS). Even practice squad players make more in a paycheck then these people make in a year.

I’m both a Police Officer and National Guard Soldier with 2 deployments and a 3rd coming up. So I don’t feel bad for these millionaires either.

I love me some firefighters, but the Saints have had more impact on my life than soldiers. Honest-to-goodness.

Just like how football players should know the repercussions of playing the game, so should cops and soldiers. They essentially sign up to kill and be killed. And they knew the pay going in. Therefore they must feel the compensation to kill and be killed is adequate and appropriate.

You'd have to pay me a whole helluva lot more than that to drive around my city with tight pants on, a gun in my waist and sweaty perps in my backseat. You'd have to break the bank in order to get me to fly to another country and shoot people.

But hey, if people want to do it for less, more power to them. By the same token, I don't begrudge football players for feeling they are worth more and fighting to get it.

 

[livefromDC]

Omg, this argument again. Owners DO honor the contract. A contract is an agreement and if the agreement includes an option to terminate the contact at any point for any reason, THATS THE CONTRACT. The 2nd party has the option of negotiating a contract to get as much as they can get. If they want a contract that states they can void the contract if they exceed certain goals, then negotiate it.

The players do try to get as much as they can, fully guaranteed, escalators, Bonuses EVERYTHING but when the team says enough, the player SIGNS THE AGREEMENT and the agreement includes an option to terminate the contract and the player signs it.

I want the players to get as much as they can, but I hate when fans make them out to be victims. They sign it, honor it.

Do you even know if such a void is permissible in the NFL? I've never heard of it being done. Agents aren't stupid if there were other options to holding out if would happen.

 

[Loose Cannon]

You’re being presumptuous by putting words in my mouth. I don’t feel any different about the owners or players. And players make money off of endorsements, advertisements, commercials, etc too. Just because a lot of them are careless with their money or live elaborate lifestyles, that’s not the owners fault. Heck they even have seminars for the incoming rookies telling them this exact same thing, if they don’t listen again it’s not the owners fault. I can’t imagine anyone on this site that couldn’t live comfortably off of a practice squad players salary much less a starters salary.

If a player doesn’t like the way his contract is then he shouldn’t sign it. If the contract is heavily back loaded and he knows he’ll never see that money because of clauses written into the contract just so he can say for a year that he is the “highest paid” player then that’s his fault.

I’m more about the Team than I am individual players. Sure I love having Drew, MT, AK, Davis, Jordan, etc but players come and go, the Team remains. I’ve been critical of Drew’s contracts where he alone was making 20-25% of yearly salary cap. That leaves 75-80% for 52 other players to compete for. And now players like Mahomes are probably about to break into the 40millions. Yes the cap goes up but so does every other new salary.

That’s why I like the idea of heavily incentive based contracts. It’s protects the team when a player doesn’t live up to his end and it rewards the player for doing well.

I hear some of what you're saying and I appreciate the well thought out explanation. Two things I'd say:

- All that "protecting the team" means is "protecting the owner". Why are we protecting the owners' pocketbooks at the expense of the players?

- I'm pretty confident you would not want to work for incentive pay. Most government workers wouldn't. In fact most people in general would never accept such a contract. The ones that do are called salespeople and they're nuts. I feel like you're being a bit hypocritical expecting players to work under a contract that you would never accept in your profession.

 

[Merl]

Do you even know if such a void is permissible in the NFL? I've never heard of it being done. Agents aren't stupid if there were other options to holding out if would happen.

Unless there is an injury or fully guarantee clause for a given year then the team can void a contract at that point.

 

[greg8710]

- No comma after "many (not most)"
- No comma after "find their way"
- No comma after "dummies"
- Forgot the apostrophe in "didn't"
- No comma after "realized the fact"
- "realized the fact his education" should be "realized the fact that his education"
- No comma after "start it all off"
- It's spelled "athlete" not "athelete"
- No comma after "THE PARENTS"

I hope when you were teaching your son things, you encouraged him to learn about grammar and spelling somewhere else. I'd hate for him to be thought of as a dummy.

In his defense, he never said to have had a football scholarship.