Here's a wildy speculative OP about Condi for VP... (1 Viewer)

[Shawn]

Taking Condi as VP seems like McCain's best option for taking voters from Clinton and Obama.

OK, here's a beef I have with some of your posts, and a handful of other posters on this board lately.

Let me preface this by saying I'm genuinely asking this, and I'm not trying to call you out or anything. I might be completely off base in this instance--in fact I think it's likely that I am.

Do you really believe what you posted above? I'd be happy to discuss why I don't agree with you, and I think counterpoints have already been made on this thread. But I just find it hard to believe you agree with that sentiment, and as such, it really calls into question (in my mind) the intent of your post.

If I was a Democrat, I'd be jumping for joy of McCain named Condi as his running mate. It's not the worst choice, but it immediately allies him with some of the most tainted members of the Bush administration. I think it would be a disastrous move for him.

Do you really believe that would be a good choice for McCain?

 

[Sabine]

McCain is already on thin ice with the Pro-lifers Conservatives for his support of embryonic stem cell research. Adding a mildly Pro-Choice candidate won't make him more popular with conservatives.

I agree with you that it won't make him more popular with conservatives, but where are they going to go? Clinton and Obama are more liberal Pro-Choice candidates. IMHO, the conservatives that would just stay home would be outnumbered by those McCain could pull from Clinton and Obama. Again IMHO, there are quite a few who are more excited about having an African American or female in the White House than they actually are about Clinton or Obama's position on issues. By adding the slightly Pro-Choice Rice, I think McCain would gain more than he would lose, and he only needs a little to tip some big states his direction.

 

[Pure Energy]

I agree with you that it won't make him more popular with conservatives, but where are they going to go? Clinton and Obama are more liberal Pro-Choice candidates. IMHO, the conservatives that would just stay home would be outnumbered by those McCain could pull from Clinton and Obama. Again IMHO, there are quite a few who are more excited about having an African American or female in the White House than they actually are about Clinton or Obama's position on issues. By adding the slightly Pro-Choice Rice, I think McCain would gain more than he would lose, and he only needs a little to tip some big states his direction.

From a political perspective your logic is sound; Conservatives would have no where to turn except McCain (his mother stated, "[SIZE=-1]Yes, I think holding their nose they’re going to have to take him[/SIZE]"). And McCain doesn't kowtow to the conservative base so he could make such a move. Although I'm not sure about the number of cross-over voters he would net, I can't dismiss out of hand that he would not get a lift from voters who are excited about electing a woman and/or African American.

 

[Sabine]

OK, here's a beef I have with some of your posts, and a handful of other posters on this board lately.

Let me preface this by saying I'm genuinely asking this, and I'm not trying to call you out or anything. I might be completely off base in this instance--in fact I think it's likely that I am.

Do you really believe what you posted above? I'd be happy to discuss why I don't agree with you, and I think counterpoints have already been made on this thread. But I just find it hard to believe you agree with that sentiment, and as such, it really calls into question (in my mind) the intent of your post.

If I was a Democrat, I'd be jumping for joy of McCain named Condi as his running mate. It's not the worst choice, but it immediately allies him with some of the most tainted members of the Bush administration. I think it would be a disastrous move for him.

Do you really believe that would be a good choice for McCain?

I am glad you asked this. Yes, I do think it would be a good move for McCain for a number of reasons. I'll address some, but first let me get my unashamedly and most selfish reasons out of the way first. I would like to see the GOP move away from some of the grip that I think is damaging to the party, namely the religious right. I'm an atheist and I'm Pro-Choice. Choice is nonnegotiable for me, but I don't agree with all of the Dem's platform either. The Dems too have been hijacked by special interests with whom I don't align, but they've got me on the nonnegotiables. So, in that respect, I think bringing Rice on as VP is a good move for McCain and the GOP. It tells the religious right that they are no longer setting the agenda. I give him some credit for already taking that stance. I suspect such a shift in the GOP may not sit well with some of the members here for whom I have a great deal of respect. But like I said, it was my own selfish reasons...

The statical advantages seem apparent to me. (I'm guessing that is more closely related to what concerned you about my post?) Regardless of how much you and I or anyone else here want this to be a perfect world, it's just not. I would love to have a government that is so representative of the people that gender, race, religion, sexual orientation, and age don't influence voters at all. We are not there yet, not even close to being there. Race and gender are playing a large role in this election process whether we like it or not. Age is an issue. Religion is an issue. Some will not even seriously consider a candidate because of one of those elements, while others are engaging in quasi-affirmative action on the voter level. Thinking those forces are not in play runs contrary to the stats. I think Rice as McCain's VP would pull votes from both Clinton and Obama. I'm not the only one. We've discussed this here at my office among mostly Dems, some GOP, some IND, and many who are involved in varying degrees with politics. Of the 20+/- that discussed this, all here thought it was a net positive for McCain. Some Dems were/are more than a little concerned about this happening. I should probably add that no one in the discussion (to my knowledge) is big church goer, so that could easily be skewing the results.

Lastly, any time you have any concerns about the content or intent of one of my posts and don't wish to discuss it in an open forum, please don't hesitate to PM me. The door is always open, and I would be happy to discuss any concerns you may have.

 

[TPS]

>>I doubt Condi would attract voters away from Obama, but she'd quite possibly attract voters away from Hillary.

Why would anyone vote for Rice? She seems reasonably intelligent, but it ends there. She's been nothing but a diplomatic yesman for this Administration, and what does that do for her resume? All it does is get a few racist and sexist individuals to put a notch in their hidden lipstick cases IMHO.

TPS

 

[Saint by the Bay]

>>I doubt Condi would attract voters away from Obama, but she'd quite possibly attract voters away from Hillary.

Why would anyone vote for Rice? She seems reasonably intelligent, but it ends there. She's been nothing but a diplomatic yesman for this Administration, and what does that do for her resume? All it does is get a few racist and sexist individuals to put a notch in their hidden lipstick cases IMHO.

TPS

She's also pro choice and pro Affirmative Action. The small town Christian angry white vote the Republicans have cultivated over the last 40 years would run for the hills with her on a Republican ticket.

A McCain - Rice ticket would be an Epic Fail.

 

[Shawn]

She's also pro choice and pro Affirmative Action. The small town Christian angry white vote the Republicans have cultivated over the last 40 years would run for the hills with her on a Republican ticket.

A McCain - Rice ticket would be an Epic Fail.

Agreed.

To Condi's credit and discredit, her gender seems to have little bearing on how people feel about her, both good and bad. Neither does her race.

But she was intimately tied to the Bush administration, and was a pivotal player in the administrations decision to go to war. She carries an incredible amount of baggage, just like any player in the current administration would.

She's got the scarlet letter, except with the small percentage of folks who wholeheartedly support everything this administration has done.

Just imagine the questions that would be posed to her about her shoe-shopping spree during the days after Katrina.

Selecting her would be catastrophic, IMHO.

But for anyone who enjoys chaos and train wrecks, you should wish for a Clinton/Obama vs. McCain/Rice contest. Oh, what a mess that would be.

 

[DavidM]

But she was intimately tied to the Bush administration, and was a pivotal player in the administrations decision to go to war. She carries an incredible amount of baggage, just like any player in the current administration would.

She's got the scarlet letter, except with the small percentage of folks who wholeheartedly support everything this administration has done.

Agreed.

Once the Dem nomination is over and general campaigning begins, it's going to be interesting to see how McCain, with undivided attention, acquits himself in the eyes of the general electorate on Iraq and the economy. The war is unpopular with a majority of Americans and the economy is a top concern for most voters. I think McCain is in for a tough fight on those two issues. As it relates to the former point, I think you're exactly right in that Rice would be a difficult sell.

 

[1yearOlder]

I respectfully disagree, it's this text:



It looks very race driven to me.

Point taken , but it's not very friendly to hardened racists or
incorrigible misogynists either . ( pun ? )

As far as the - Repubs. could attack Clinton or Obama with far less restaint - comment , this is accepted perversion .

 

[Inkspot47]

She's also pro choice and pro Affirmative Action. The small town Christian angry white vote the Republicans have cultivated over the last 40 years would run for the hills with her on a Republican ticket.

A McCain - Rice ticket would be an Epic Fail.

IMO, she is very popular among the, as you put it "small town christian angry white vote". She is VERY pro-American and that trumps all the minor issues that so many on the left, not meaning you particularly, think drive the republican party.

 

[CitySaint]

Will the question of his opponent being Hillary or Obama affect his vp decision in a major way? I think McCain needs to get someone who will mobilize conservatives to get out there and vote. There is alot of enthusiasm on the dem side and it looks like the dems will turn out in larger numbers than usual. The guy can't afford repubs not turning out. He needs someone who can light a spark I guess, or maybe a Karl Rove who can get people moving on bs issues again.

 

[HouDat]

>>I doubt Condi would attract voters away from Obama, but she'd quite possibly attract voters away from Hillary.

Why would anyone vote for Rice? She seems reasonably intelligent, but it ends there.

My thinking here is that people who are interested in voting for a woman for high office, but not in voting for that woman (Ms. Clinton), might be interested in casting a vote for another woman (well, one on the ticket, anyway). Also, Rice could sway at least a small portion of black voters to cross the aisle. And that small portion could tip the balance in favor of the McCain ticket.

At any rate, it's been discussed repeatedly here and elsewhere, but Ms. Clinton's likability factor isn't exactly through the roof. A female alternative -- and a minority one, at that -- could possibly trump Clinton come election day.

 

[Thorin]

There may be something to it after all...
Political Radar: Dan Senor: Condoleezza Rice Is Pursuing the VP Spot

 

[Rickboy]

Condi Rice is busted goods. McCain would do well to stay far far far away from her...

How about Rick Perry. Texas could use a break from his stupidity.

 

[Richard]

McCain will choose a VP not aligned in a strong way with the Bush administration, for all of the reasons listed previously. Anyone with strong Bush ties diminishes the help he will get from unhappy Democrats who will not vote for the nominee after their candidate loses. Hillary supporters who will not vote for Obama would be handed a reason to vote for him if McCain chooses a Bush crony and the same would be true for Obama supporters should Hillary stage an upset. McCain can win if he breaks cleanly with Bush for his VP choice and most of his top advisors.