Homeowners insurance post-Ian (1 Viewer)

>>Folks will have to come to terms with the fact that if you want to live 5 miles from Lafitte in a $300,000 home, you will have to pay $5000/yr to do so. Not $2500 you did 3 years ago. Those days are gone. I know it probably sounds crass, but unfortunately you can't take this band aid off slow any longer.

Inside or outside the levee protection system? 5 miles north of Lafitte is probably inside the levee. Does it matter?

not for wind.
 
You forgot Michael which was actually a cat 5 when it hit near Panama City 3 years ago.

It absolutely devastated Panama City and Tyndall AFB to the east. Had that been a densely populated area, it would have been incredible, but your point is 100% correct.

We do a ton of work in resolution and restoration. Sally was a little, slow mover that hit us 2 years ago and with covid and supply chain issues the costs were insane. Naples and the area south of Tampa are densely populated with expensive properties and a great deal of very shoddy construction.

Every insurance company in the area is likely to fail leaving the state and the feds to pick up the pieces.

Despite decades in the restoration and construction industry and having worked Opal, Erin, Bonnie, Ivan, Dennis, Georges, Katrina, Ike, and others I can't recall, I have no idea what's going to happen. The market here in Florida was already ready to collapse in no small measure due to the governmental policies of the state. Still, there's no answer to a cat 5 that moves across a densely populated area at a snail's pace.

If there's a God, I hope he's looking out for the people in harms way today.

So my client in Tampa, we spoke over 2 weeks ago about his insurance here and we got to talking about Florida. He said something about lawsuits...that in Florida, if you do not agree with carrier adjustment, you can immediately sue? (Something to that effect) he said that has had a real adverse effect.
 
So my client in Tampa, we spoke over 2 weeks ago about his insurance here and we got to talking about Florida. He said something about lawsuits...that in Florida, if you do not agree with carrier adjustment, you can immediately sue? (Something to that effect) he said that has had a real adverse effect.

There are all sorts of stupid things going on here, but imho the most problematic is that carriers fail to adjust claims fairly from the onset.

In the 28 years I've been doing this, I've seen exactly 2 where the original estimate was sufficient and both of those were 28 years ago.

There are no staff adjusters and the subs who do the work for the adjusting companies are mainly hacks out to make a ton over a short period doing cat work and getting the ball rolling. I understand it, but it sucks and it makes people like me have to beat the living hell out of claims in order to get enough money to do the job the way it should be done. With covid and the craziness of the building boom, Sally was a nightmare and continues to be so. This one is going to make Katrina look like brunch at Commanders on the company tab.

Anyway, carriers have bought policy to restrict the rights of property owners recently so the ability to negotiate claims by contractors skilled and experience in the work has become essentially illegal. That's been replaced by underpaid claims being handled by Public Adjusters/Pirates on assignment of benefit claims which are essentially door to door marketing for law firms who then run up costs by filing redundant motions and driving costs through the roof.

It would all be simpler if the carriers paid the claims reasonably from the jump, but they do not.

On average for Sally, the original claim we've handled has been paid 33% on the opening payment for wind. Our estimates have been paid at a rate of 88%.

What that means is a claim that we see as 500k is usually offered 165k from the carrier and our estimate of 500k is resolved at 440 or so.

You cannot do 450 or 500k in repairs for 150k so the process by which the claim is settled drives up costs drastically. Simply put, to get from 150 to 440 takes us weeks of work and causes delays in the restoration. In the case of Sally which, of course, happened during Covid, the supply chain issues and labor problems escalated costs to the point that even claims we settled for 440 in this example were nowhere near sufficient by the time the jobs were done as a $4 2x4 ended up at $20.
 
We sold our camp in 2021 on Tar Paper Canal just off Bayou Segnette. It became a money pit. Storm after storm, floors, furniture etc.

I can assure you that the lay of the land you remember is simply not there. Shoot I remember several honey holes between Rigolets/Perot and Barataria that I knew by sight, by 2015 or 16 I would pass up. Partly that I didn't fish for months on end, but part due to visual landmarks were changing (disappearing) .

But the most poignant moment was like around 2018. I hadn't run to Grand Isle to fish in almost a decade. We decided to wake early and make the run. It was crazy how wide open things got as we passed Texaco canals. There were parts that I know land was there..gone. it was more open water than I ever remembered.

And all this land loss is adding to the issues we face. It's slowly eroding land and ability to live in places that 25 years ago were perfectly fine.

I grew up fishing the Rigolletes area and moved to FL in the early 80s. I hadn't fished Lake Borgne or Lake Catherine in 30 years until I went with a childhood friend a couple years ago. It was insane. There's so much less land that it's hard to believe. Hell, Fort Pike is so drastically different it's hard to imagine what it was like in 1980.
 
So my client in Tampa, we spoke over 2 weeks ago about his insurance here and we got to talking about Florida. He said something about lawsuits...that in Florida, if you do not agree with carrier adjustment, you can immediately sue? (Something to that effect) he said that has had a real adverse effect.

Many surplus lines insurance companies are having issues where their adjuster comes up with one figure then the insured hires a private adjuster and they fight each other. The carriers are spending alot of money in mediation/suit over these things and it's adversely affecting their margins.

Many have started adding "anti plublic adjuster" forms, but the states' departments of insurance are not allowing it. This is kind of new to LA. It's one reason some surplus lines markets are exiting certain states.

I'm an insurance broker, and one of the carriers I work with did this and LA DOI (department of insurance) nixed it. They immediately ceased all new business in the state. I believe Donelon (LA insurance commissioner) reneged on it and they're about to enter back in.

It's a mess and I don't blame insured's for getting a 2nd opinion. We should all be working to get to fair claims values, especially in 'CAT'astrophe states.

The cherry on top these days is inflation, and the risen cost of building materials. One of our carriers came to meet a couple months ago and estimated 60+ % of their policies' property coverage are undervalued. This complicates the claims process' as well.

On a last note to others, regarding increased prices, most insurance carriers cover themselves and purchase re-insurance to cover 1 major event in 2 years. Unfortunately, LA had 5 major events in 2 years, not including increased Ice events in the North.

This is the stuff we have to deal with if one wants to live in CAT country.
 
Last edited:
There are all sorts of stupid things going on here, but imho the most problematic is that carriers fail to adjust claims fairly from the onset.

In the 28 years I've been doing this, I've seen exactly 2 where the original estimate was sufficient and both of those were 28 years ago.

There are no staff adjusters and the subs who do the work for the adjusting companies are mainly hacks out to make a ton over a short period doing cat work and getting the ball rolling. I understand it, but it sucks and it makes people like me have to beat the living hell out of claims in order to get enough money to do the job the way it should be done. With covid and the craziness of the building boom, Sally was a nightmare and continues to be so. This one is going to make Katrina look like brunch at Commanders on the company tab.

Anyway, carriers have bought policy to restrict the rights of property owners recently so the ability to negotiate claims by contractors skilled and experience in the work has become essentially illegal. That's been replaced by underpaid claims being handled by Public Adjusters/Pirates on assignment of benefit claims which are essentially door to door marketing for law firms who then run up costs by filing redundant motions and driving costs through the roof.

It would all be simpler if the carriers paid the claims reasonably from the jump, but they do not.

On average for Sally, the original claim we've handled has been paid 33% on the opening payment for wind. Our estimates have been paid at a rate of 88%.

What that means is a claim that we see as 500k is usually offered 165k from the carrier and our estimate of 500k is resolved at 440 or so.

You cannot do 450 or 500k in repairs for 150k so the process by which the claim is settled drives up costs drastically. Simply put, to get from 150 to 440 takes us weeks of work and causes delays in the restoration. In the case of Sally which, of course, happened during Covid, the supply chain issues and labor problems escalated costs to the point that even claims we settled for 440 in this example were nowhere near sufficient by the time the jobs were done as a $4 2x4 ended up at $20.


Yes...many many years ago, companies decided to source out the claims to third party adjusting firms. Who hire "en masse" for cat claims - guys from as far as Seattle come down, having NEVER worked a cat claim and understanding the mechanics behind it.

They are given 30-40 losses in a given area, cant find houseing within 100 miles and work 12 hour days and get upset when you call them after 2 weeks to find out what the status of claim report it.

I hate it.

Then they use Exactimate with settings set on God knows what, because that drywall rate...AINT EVEN CLOSE.

As for the low-end estimates- its a disease. No longer relegated to the smaller, regional carriers. State Farm and Allstate have become quite notorious for this practice. But they have the lions share of market and if the LDI presses TOO HARD, they pack up and tell LDI " cool we out" leaving 1000s upon 1000s scrambling to replace 40 years of coverage.

Its a bonafide mess around here as well.
 
Former MS congressman Gene Taylor tried introducing an "All Perils" or "Multiple Perils" policy at the federal level that would allow people to purchase wind and flood coverage through a national program. Don't recall why it died or never made it anywhere.


 
Former MS congressman Gene Taylor tried introducing an "All Perils" or "Multiple Perils" policy at the federal level that would allow people to purchase wind and flood coverage through a national program. Don't recall why it died or never made it anywhere.



because a federal program that doesnt benefit 40 other states wont fly.

And trust me when i say that the modeling right now to produce rates that would keep ANY program "solvent" is not affordable for 80% of the folks it would be designed to help.
So then you would look to offset those rates with some sort of "government" help ( which would be called a Handout in those 40 other states ) and if a cat event happens, who foots the bill for the shortage to satisfy all claim obligations? Taxpayers most likely ( which again, 40 other states would be like NO WAY- Yall need to move)

I dont know how you fix because these storms have become larger, stronger in much shorter amounts of time, causing widespread damage to areas that have been developed that werent 20 years ago ( running out of space around here )
 
Many surplus lines insurance companies are having issues where their adjuster comes up with one figure then the insured hires a private adjuster and they fight each other. The carriers are spending alot of money in mediation/suit over these things and it's adversely affecting their margins.

Many have started adding "anti plublic adjuster" forms, but the states' departments of insurance are not allowing it. This is kind of new to LA. It's one reason some surplus lines markets are exiting certain states.

I'm an insurance broker, and one of the carriers I work with did this and LA DOI (department of insurance) nixed it. They immediately ceased all new business in the state. I believe Donelon (LA insurance commissioner) reneged on it and they're about to enter back in.

It's a mess and I don't blame insured's for getting a 2nd opinion. We should all be working to get to fair claims values, especially in 'CAT'astrophe states.

The cherry on top these days is inflation, and the risen cost of building materials. One of our carriers came to meet a couple months ago and estimated 60+ % of their policies' property coverage are undervalued. This complicates the claims process' as well.

On a last note to others, regarding increased prices, most insurance carriers cover themselves and purchase re-insurance to cover 1 major event in 2 years. Unfortunately, LA had 5 major events in 2 years, not including increased Ice events in the North.

This is the stuff we have to deal with if one wants to live in CAT country.

As an expert witness and restoration contractor, I hate PAs. THey're generally leaches who drive costs, waste time and end up costing the client money, but there are not enough guys like me who can be hired to write the claim, deal with the company and do the work. Toss in covid and material craziness over the past 2 years and it's impossible. Windows have doubled. Roofs, paint, appliances....

We used to do all the work for an agreed scope and it was easy. Now, it's impossible.

The homeowners who hire PAs and then think they can bid the job and get it done cheaper are idiots. Unfortunately, they don't find this out until it's too late.

Anything that sounds too good to be true is.
 
Yes...many many years ago, companies decided to source out the claims to third party adjusting firms. Who hire "en masse" for cat claims - guys from as far as Seattle come down, having NEVER worked a cat claim and understanding the mechanics behind it.

They are given 30-40 losses in a given area, cant find houseing within 100 miles and work 12 hour days and get upset when you call them after 2 weeks to find out what the status of claim report it.

I hate it.

Then they use Exactimate with settings set on God knows what, because that drywall rate...AINT EVEN CLOSE.

As for the low-end estimates- its a disease. No longer relegated to the smaller, regional carriers. State Farm and Allstate have become quite notorious for this practice. But they have the lions share of market and if the LDI presses TOO HARD, they pack up and tell LDI " cool we out" leaving 1000s upon 1000s scrambling to replace 40 years of coverage.

Its a bonafide mess around here as well.

USAA was the best for decades. Now, they are absolutely the worst. OF the 150 Sally Claims we've taken as contractor, I have 2 left that are not settled. Both simple and both USAA.

Also, xactimate was bought and rolled into a portfolio of businesses that are now essentially controlled by the insurance companies. Where it used to be reliable it's no longer close.

My favorite thing to hear is when some Seattle cat adjuster tells me "Xactimate says this should cost X" because he took a 4 day seminar. For me, it's usually pretty simple to deal with because I can explain it, but the rates they pay cat adjusters is insane. It's really worse than the 9 layers of FEMA contractors doing clean up and demo.
 
As an expert witness and restoration contractor, I hate PAs. THey're generally leaches who drive costs, waste time and end up costing the client money, but there are not enough guys like me who can be hired to write the claim, deal with the company and do the work. Toss in covid and material craziness over the past 2 years and it's impossible. Windows have doubled. Roofs, paint, appliances....

We used to do all the work for an agreed scope and it was easy. Now, it's impossible.

The homeowners who hire PAs and then think they can bid the job and get it done cheaper are idiots. Unfortunately, they don't find this out until it's too late.

Anything that sounds too good to be true is.

lil story on windows- i have a large window contractor who was explaining to me back in 2020- there are like 5 resin mfgs in the world.

One of them happened to be in Lake Charles.

Laura struck. :(

2 others? Russia. LOL
 
lil story on windows- i have a large window contractor who was explaining to me back in 2020- there are like 5 resin mfgs in the world.

One of them happened to be in Lake Charles.

Laura struck. :(

2 others? Russia. LOL

PGT is right in the path of the destruction this time. It's only getting worse.
 
USAA was the best for decades. Now, they are absolutely the worst. OF the 150 Sally Claims we've taken as contractor, I have 2 left that are not settled. Both simple and both USAA.

Also, xactimate was bought and rolled into a portfolio of businesses that are now essentially controlled by the insurance companies. Where it used to be reliable it's no longer close.

My favorite thing to hear is when some Seattle cat adjuster tells me "Xactimate says this should cost X" because he took a 4 day seminar. For me, it's usually pretty simple to deal with because I can explain it, but the rates they pay cat adjusters is insane. It's really worse than the 9 layers of FEMA contractors doing clean up and demo.
As a USAA member I have to agree!!! Their commercials should be considered propaganda, I've all but given up with fighting them over my Ida claim. I've been with them for over 20 years and I never had to make a claim for anything until last year, to say I'm disappointed with them would be an understatement.
 
As a USAA member I have to agree!!! Their commercials should be considered propaganda, I've all but given up with fighting them over my Ida claim. I've been with them for over 20 years and I never had to make a claim for anything until last year, to say I'm disappointed with them would be an understatement.

Sue their arses. Run up the costs they're going to pay as a way to make them atone for the damages they're shirking.

How a company with member satisfaction went from the only company I'd ever recommend to looking up a mile at the dirty underbelly of Allstate is beyond me.

They are really the absolute worst.
 
because a federal program that doesnt benefit 40 other states wont fly.

And trust me when i say that the modeling right now to produce rates that would keep ANY program "solvent" is not affordable for 80% of the folks it would be designed to help.
So then you would look to offset those rates with some sort of "government" help ( which would be called a Handout in those 40 other states ) and if a cat event happens, who foots the bill for the shortage to satisfy all claim obligations? Taxpayers most likely ( which again, 40 other states would be like NO WAY- Yall need to move)

I dont know how you fix because these storms have become larger, stronger in much shorter amounts of time, causing widespread damage to areas that have been developed that werent 20 years ago ( running out of space around here )

I think (memory is failing me) but it seems like Taylor was also pitching it as “all perils” vs just adding wind to the national program. People up north could get additional coverage for blizzards/hard freezes (we have named winter storms now). People in the midwest could get additional tornado coverage. People out west could get better earthquake coverage. Every area of the country faces naturally caused disasters.

🤷🏻‍♂️
 

Create an account or login to comment

You must be a member in order to leave a comment

Create account

Create an account on our community. It's easy!

Log in

Already have an account? Log in here.

Users who are viewing this thread

    Back
    Top Bottom