I have never been this upset with a coach (1 Viewer)

[1980]

Are you really calling for Haslett??

Go to sleep.

Did I say I wanted Haslett. I just said that what he did against the Bucs in the past worked. Next time before you make a smart comment READ my post.

 

[CargoJon]

A face mask shield would go a long way as well.

The refs actually calling the facemask would have helped too.

Hard to blame the ref's in a 30 point loss, but we may have gained a little momentum rather than punting away on that possession....

 

[Saintsfans27]

I know Payton has more logic than these guys. I know this team is more talented than all the other Saints teams. This is a team with more offensive talent than any team in the league and we showcase this by going against a team that lost 5 starters on defense after giving up 170 yards a game rushing last year. We started running the ball with Deuce in the first quarter and while it was basically 3 yards and a pile of dust it was moving the chains. In the 2nd quarter I don't think Deuce got a single carry and our offense stopped moving. In the 3rd quarter we started with two quick runs to Deuce and then hurry to the line and make a stupid throw to the flat. It was open but we rushed the play and as a result rushed the throw. The game ended here because after the Colts went up 14 we totally abandoned the run and they just came after us. That is what that defense is built for. Even down 14 we should have run the ball but instead hit the panic button and let all hell break loose.

Can't say there is much to argue with here except the fact that we did not go deep either. Where was the threat supposed to be? We made some good plays that kind of mixed it up a little in the 1st half, but once we started getting off the field quickly, it was OVER.

 

[RebSaint]

I think Payton tried way too many 3-4 wr sets and ran too many short/immediate pass routes, which played right into the Colts hands; they tackled well and swarmed to the football.

I think we would have been much better served running larger sets with 2 wrs, a fullback, and more tight ends--both to protect Brees a little more; and I didn't see the Saints stretch the field enough as we should.

Then again, the other side of the argument is that the o-line didn't provide enough protection for Brees to go deep; the only hope was to dink and dunk it, chew the clock and keep the Colts' offense OFF the field--problem was, the Colts were expecting it.

Keeping the fullback in the game, more TE's would have helped with pass protection and maybe provided the opportunity for a big play downfield.

I haven't checked the stats yet, but I don't think Brees even tried to throw the ball deep once.

 

[bclemms]

Oh and one last thing. I think we will roll over teams this year. I think we are a good team and will win a lot of games. We will win the division but until we can learn to run the ball against teams like the Colts and Bears then we are not going to win a championship.

Payton will admit he went away from the run too soon, he will admit he didn't run Deuce enough but when will he learn from it?

Come on Payton, I have faith in you and know you are a better coach.

 

[llama]

One cube.

 

[Brees2Bush]

I got the following from the Chargers forum. It seems to be pretty accurate.

http://forums.chargers.com/showthread.php?t=44536&page=5

Also, notice how the Saints couldn't really put any pressure on Peyton all night and he frequently had 8+ seconds to wait for his WR to get open?

We know how to pressure the QB. We are one of the best at doing it. Sacks, knockdowns, and forcing out of the pocket.

The Chargers would crush Indy in the RCA Dome again. We did it two years ago with a lesser team than we have now. We almost did it the year before that too, save for some blown special teams on our part.

Peyton has only lost 3 times in the past 29 home games now. A 26-3 home record since the 2004 season and including playoffs. Those 3 losses? Jacksonville, Chargers, Pittsburgh.

What's the common denominator of those 3? A 3-4 defense that can stop the run, decent (but not necessarily great) pass defense, and lots of pressure on the QB.

The Saints got destroyed because they couldn't do any of those three. They couldn't stop the run, they have a sucking pass defense, and they couldn't pressure Manning.

If you thought our secondary isn't as good as some, the Saints' secondary is downright atrocious.

Dr. Z. of SI said that he thought the Saints would beat us in the Super Bowl this year as part of his prediction.

How is a Saints team that gives up 2000+ rushing yards every season (125+ per game) going to stop a Chargers team with the best RB in the league and one of the best in history?

Tonight's game versus the Colts is a preview of what would happen to New Orleans if we faced them in the Super Bowl.

Additionally, from the same person:

Even worse is that the Saints couldn't key on stopping the pass because the Colts were running them all over the field with Addai.

The Saints went back to giving up 125+ rushing yards per game like they always do. Actually, it was more than 160 yards, including 118 by Addai.

Meanwhile the Saints barely got 100 yards rushing, and none of their rushers even reached 40 yards. Deuce McAlister and Reggie Bush both held to less than 40 yards!


You stop the run, then you can tee off on them when they pass. The Saints couldn't stop the run, so they couldn't focus on stopping the Colts passing game.

The Saints didn't even score an offensive TD!

Game Over.

 

[blackadder]

Oh and one last thing. I think we will roll over teams this year. I think we are a good team and will win a lot of games. We will win the division but until we can learn to run the ball against teams like the Colts and Bears then we are not going to win a championship.

Payton will admit he went away from the run too soon, he will admit he didn't run Deuce enough but when will he learn from it?

Come on Payton, I have faith in you and know you are a better coach.

I'm really disturbed about the fact that going back to last season we have two consecutive really poorly coached games and two games where our O-line got abused, our receivers couldn't get open and our defense got rolled.

Really really disappointed by Payton throwing in the towel in the 3rd qtr and not going for 4th and inches.

Bad taste in my mouth I haven't had since Haslett was here.

 

[Brees2Bush]

I'm really disturbed about the fact that going back to last season we have two consecutive really poorly coached games and two games where our O-line got abused, our receivers couldn't get open and our defense got rolled.

Really really disappointed by Payton throwing in the towel in the 3rd qtr and not going for 4th and inches.

Bad taste in my mouth I haven't had since Haslett was here.

Being a fan of both Drew Brees and Reggie Bush (look at my username), I'll admit this is about as bad as I've seen both of them play in the NFL. Maybe even going back to their college years.

The only other time I've seen Drew play this badly was during his 2003 season with the Chargers when he got pulled in the middle of a game in favor of Doug Flutie.

 

[StChadwick]

David admitted after the game that he has to improve and expects to, but I dont think he cost us the game. It should have never came down to him 3 times if our offense was able to get anything done? We know our defense becomes dead by the end of the 3rd quarter-imagine if our offense scores just 3 points? Defense never had a chance.

I really thought Smith and Grant would have pressured Payton some, but not really (a little more at the end but not close at being enough). We couldnt stop the run up the middle from the outset-again didnt expect that. Lastly, never would I have expected 34 unanswered points to end the game. If we would have ran more with Deuce, I dont know if we would have won, but we wouldnt have lost by 31 for sure. Besides losing at the time, whats the point of bypassing the run-to pass where Brees is having an all time lowest rating? Maybe Payton just wanted to improve Brees' numbers, knowing how low they were and knowing he couldnt beat this team tonight?

If I had told ya'll here before the game our offense would have scored 3 points, with limited yardage on the verge of breaking a record the whole game, ya'll would have thought our defense giving up 41 would have been conservative.

Its a bad sign when saints posters were telling us before the game here to not live and die with the outcome of this game. I dont think any of us REALLY expected to win. This is just one game and we will probably make the playoffs/win the South, but you would think, sooner or later we will be able to beat a good AFC team?

 

[tenordas]

OK, I was pretty upset, too, but "never been this upset with a coach"?
The two things that pop into my head are: how old are you and how long have you been a Saints fan? LOL.
Come on, I've been WAY more upset with Carl Smith, Mike Ditka, Jim Haslett, and Rick Venturi than I was tonight at Payton. Not to say I wasn't unhappy, I was. I wanted more pounding up the middle instead of all those screen passes going for naught (especially as Reggie dropped so many of them), but I give the Colts "D" full credit. They jammed the run except about twice all night. That might not have continued had Coach continued to pound it at them, I don't know, they might have worn down, but I'm willing to say their defense just man-handled our offense, particularly the O line and the WRs, so while I was unhappy with the general play calling tontight, I've been WAY more unhappy with other coaches who lost games by their play calling when we were outplaying the opponents.

 

[jerryrip]

Don't get me wrong because I like Payton, I love what he has done.

Now that I have got that out of the way........

A blueprint was made to beat the Colts. It doesn't take great players, it doesn't take great defense and it doesn't take great offense. What it does take is patience, will and determination. We lacked all three tonight.

The teams that beat the Colts last year were the Texans, Cowboys, Jags and Titans. Only one of these teams made the playoffs and we killed them.

The way to beat the Colts is to run the ball right between the tackles. There is no other way unless you have a dominant defense and even those have not beat the Colts recently. You have to keep Manning on the sideline, it keeps him out of rythym, keeps the pass rush fresh and gives the defense a chance. Running the ball gets more effective each time you do it. The Colts defense is undersized and when they get tired they lose the advantage of speed. Our offensive line gets to take over and they are forced to come out of the cover 2 to stop it. When they do this then you can pass the ball and take shots deep but until then we are trying to throw into 8 man coverages with a ton of speed.

Every year we circle the shoot out game with the Colts to watch on TV. Every year the Bengals, Chiefs, Vikings and other high powered offenses get run over by Manning and once they get up these teams try to pass more and the ends get to just fly into the backfield and force more mistakes.

You can't get down big to the Colts and if ou do you can't give up on the run.


Payton gets on the podium after the NFCCG and admits and regrets he didn't run Deuce enough and run him more. Deuce only got 6 carries against the Bears and now Deuce might get 10 against the Colts. I like the West Coast offense but when teams dare you to run you have to accept the dare sometimes.

Freeney and Mathis combined weigh about as much as Shanle and Fujita. They have no DT's and they don't play 8 in the box. Could you imagine if Shanle and Fujita were our ends and Grant and Smith were our DT's? That is what you have with the Colts.

I'm sick right now and this is a rant but until Payton can learn from his mistakes then nothing will change. We will roll over bad teams and when it comes to a team that you have to run the ball to beat we will fall short......way short.

Crucify me if you want.

I agree. We were totally outcoached tonight. Reminded me of last year's NFC Championship game. Same lackluster performance, same getting away from the running game, same pressure on Brees. Deja vu all over again.

 

[Brees2Bush]

David admitted after the game that he has to improve and expects to, but I dont think he cost us the game. It should have never came down to him 3 times if our offense was able to get anything done? We know our defense becomes dead by the end of the 3rd quarter-imagine if our offense scores just 3 points? Defense never had a chance.

I really thought Smith and Grant would have pressured Payton some, but not really (a little more at the end but not close at being enough). We couldnt stop the run up the middle from the outset-again didnt expect that. Lastly, never would I have expected 31 unanswered points to end the game. If we would have ran more with Deuce, I dont know if we would have won, but we wouldnt have lost by 34 for sure. Besides losing at the time, whats the point of bypassing the run-to pass where Brees is having an all time lowest rating? Maybe Payton just wanted to improve Brees' numbers, knowing how low they were and knowing he couldnt beat this team tonight?

If I had told ya'll here before the game our offense would have scored 3 points, with limited yardage on the verge of breaking a record the whole game, ya'll would have thought our defense giving up 41 would have been conservative.

Its a bad sign when saints posters were telling us before the game here to not live and die with the outcome of this game. I dont think any of us REALLY expected to win. This is just one game and we will probably make the playoffs/win the South, but you would think, sooner or later we will be able to beat a good AFC team?

I'm a defensive minded person by nature when it comes to the NFL. The really good AFC teams have something in common: run defense.

Patriots, Ravens, Steelers, Chargers to name a few. Even the Colts in the postseason.

Defense wins championships. Namely run defense.

The Colts won the Super Bowl with the worst rated run defense in the NFL granted, but that was regular season. When the playoffs hit, their run defense became like the Great Wall of China. They held Larry Johnson, #2 rusher in the league, to just 32 yards in the postseason. They held the Ravens to less than 80 yards and Jamal Lewis to just 53 yards. They held the Patriots to just 93 yards. Only the Bears managed to gain over 100 yards on them in the postseason, but other factors (like Rex Grossman) offset that to help.

Think the Colts would have pulled it out if their run defense hadn't magically solidified in the postseason for 3 out of 4 games? Nope.

The Colts held the Saints to barely 100 yards rushing. Yes, Payton gets some blame for moving away from the run at times, but still, the Colts allowed just 4 yards per rush. Both Deuce and Reggie had 3.8 ypc or less. That's a good evening for their run defense considering what it was last year.

If the Saints want to be on the level of good AFC teams, they need to concentrate on stopping the run. Give up an average of only 90 yards per game. Not the 125+ per game the past few years. And definitely not the 160 yards against the Colts tonight. The Saints allowed an average of 5.5 yards per rush tonight. That's not going to cut it against a good team.

 

[Sackhappysaint]

Don't get me wrong because I like Payton, I love what he has done.

Now that I have got that out of the way........

A blueprint was made to beat the Colts. It doesn't take great players, it doesn't take great defense and it doesn't take great offense. What it does take is patience, will and determination. We lacked all three tonight.

The teams that beat the Colts last year were the Texans, Cowboys, Jags and Titans. Only one of these teams made the playoffs and we killed them.

The way to beat the Colts is to run the ball right between the tackles. There is no other way unless you have a dominant defense and even those have not beat the Colts recently. You have to keep Manning on the sideline, it keeps him out of rythym, keeps the pass rush fresh and gives the defense a chance. Running the ball gets more effective each time you do it. The Colts defense is undersized and when they get tired they lose the advantage of speed. Our offensive line gets to take over and they are forced to come out of the cover 2 to stop it. When they do this then you can pass the ball and take shots deep but until then we are trying to throw into 8 man coverages with a ton of speed.

Every year we circle the shoot out game with the Colts to watch on TV. Every year the Bengals, Chiefs, Vikings and other high powered offenses get run over by Manning and once they get up these teams try to pass more and the ends get to just fly into the backfield and force more mistakes.

You can't get down big to the Colts and if ou do you can't give up on the run.


Payton gets on the podium after the NFCCG and admits and regrets he didn't run Deuce enough and run him more. Deuce only got 6 carries against the Bears and now Deuce might get 10 against the Colts. I like the West Coast offense but when teams dare you to run you have to accept the dare sometimes.

Freeney and Mathis combined weigh about as much as Shanle and Fujita. They have no DT's and they don't play 8 in the box. Could you imagine if Shanle and Fujita were our ends and Grant and Smith were our DT's? That is what you have with the Colts.

I'm sick right now and this is a rant but until Payton can learn from his mistakes then nothing will change. We will roll over bad teams and when it comes to a team that you have to run the ball to beat we will fall short......way short.

Crucify me if you want.

We tried to run, we got stuffed multiple times. Our offensive line feeds off of our ability to pass, they are poor run blockers as a unit. We have to be "cute" with our playcalling because we simply have to be to set up the run. When we can't run against a defense that's committed to defending the pass, it spells huge trouble.

The thing is even when a big hole was there, it caved pretty quickly as our guys couldn't hold their blocks. Duece also had one of those games where he decided he didn't want to run very hard.(yes he does that every now and then, luckily not often, but he does it)

We didn't pound the ball because it wasn't working.

Negativity aside I still believe we have one of the best passing attacks in the league, if not the best, so I have not loss faith in our team.

 

[Brees2Bush]

We tried to run, we got stuffed multiple times. Our offensive line feeds off of our ability to pass, they are poor run blockers as a unit. We have to be "cute" with our playcalling because we simply have to be to set up the run. When we can't run against a defense that's committed to defending the pass, it spells huge trouble.

The thing is even when a big hole was there, it caved pretty quickly as our guys couldn't hold their blocks. Duece also had one of those games where he decided he didn't want to run very hard.(yes he does that every now and then, luckily not often, but he does it)

We didn't pound the ball because it wasn't working.

Negativity aside I still believe we have one of the best passing attacks in the league, if not the best, so I have not loss faith in our team.

The great Vince Lombardi once said:

"You never win a game unless you beat the guy in front of you. The score on the board doesn't mean a thing. That's for the fans. You've got to win the war with the man in front of you. You've got to get your man."

That leads to winning the battle in the trenches (OL and DL).

That leads to "If you can't run, and can't stop the run, you will lose every time."