Last Dance... ESPN (1 Viewer)

Eeyore

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That is a part that I am dumbfounded about. Why did MJ care so much about what other people think or say??? A lot of the media stuff, especially after his dad was killed was just cruel. Why wasn’t MJ strong enough to blow that off??? MJ had a million positives in his life, but he seems to dwell on & be bothered by stupid negativity.

This series is very complicated. I kept thinking the Kobe Bryant “Last Dance” series will be much less stressful to watch.

One part about MJ’s history that I liked that was pretty funny & enlightening was when he was just starting out & his Nike contract. MJ did not even want to be bothered with Nike. However, MJ’s mom said, “Michael, you have to at least meet with them & hear what they have to say.” Nike ends up offering MJ a ton of $$$. MJ’s dad says, “WHAT!!!??? He hasn’t even hardly done anything yet!!!???”

MJ was blessed with some awesome parents.👍
The stuff about his dad and his gambling was ridiculous in Chicago. Sports radio ran with that all day and it was on the spirts segment of the nightly news every day. I couldn't imagine having to deal with the media openly speculating that my gambling got my dad killed.
 

gpupil

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i love jordan, as a player, but this documentary series does absolutely nothing for me to respect him.
I felt this way listening to his HOF induction speech. I couldn't believe how petty and bitter he sounded on what should have been a wonderful moment for him.
He's still my favorite player of all time, but no where near that level of respect as a person.
 

SaintsFanInLA

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That is a part that I am dumbfounded about. Why did MJ care so much about what other people think or say??? A lot of the media stuff, especially after his dad was killed was just cruel. Why wasn’t MJ strong enough to blow that off??? MJ had a million positives in his life, but he seems to dwell on & be bothered by stupid negativity.

This series is very complicated. I kept thinking the Kobe Bryant “Last Dance” series will be much less stressful to watch.

One part about MJ’s history that I liked that was pretty funny & enlightening was when he was just starting out & his Nike contract. MJ did not even want to be bothered with Nike. However, MJ’s mom said, “Michael, you have to at least meet with them & hear what they have to say.” Nike ends up offering MJ a ton of $$$. MJ’s dad says, “WHAT!!!??? He hasn’t even hardly done anything yet!!!???”

MJ was blessed with some awesome parents.👍
If you can't tell, Jordan is completely driven by his insecurities. I think that most greats are. From the relationship he had early on with his brother competing for their father's attention, it just seemed like he was always just a little insecure. Satisfied people are rarely, if ever, great. The need to prove yourself to others probably motivates a great deal of people. What did MJ's father say, "If you wanna motivate Michael to do something, tell him he can't do it."

The fact that MJ would make up slights to motivate himself to greatness, speaks to insecurity to me. But he utilized it perfectly, IMHO.

Right now if out of 100 people, 90 people line up and compliment you and and 10 people insult you, more than likely, you would concentrate on the 10 insults. You might be grateful for the compliments but the insults might get under your skin and stick to the front of your mind.

That may be a gross over simplification but this man had the adoration of the entire world, which makes the negative stuff THAT much more stark in comparison.

And I am not saying these things to be harshly critical of MJ because he still remains my favorite athlete of all time. And this is from a die-hard Saints fan of over 40 years. To me, when I saw him play, I thought he was better at this than anybody has ever been in anything else in sports. He is my GOAT of GOATs.
 

LuvNOLA

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If you can't tell, Jordan is completely driven by his insecurities. I think that most greats are. From the relationship he had early on with his brother competing for their father's attention, it just seemed like he was always just a little insecure. Satisfied people are rarely, if ever, great. The need to prove yourself to others probably motivates a great deal of people. What did MJ's father say, "If you wanna motivate Michael to do something, tell him he can't do it."

The fact that MJ would make up slights to motivate himself to greatness, speaks to insecurity to me. But he utilized it perfectly, IMHO.

Right now if out of 100 people, 90 people line up and compliment you and and 10 people insult you, more than likely, you would concentrate on the 10 insults. You might be grateful for the compliments but the insults might get under your skin and stick to the front of your mind.

That may be a gross over simplification but this man had the adoration of the entire world, which makes the negative stuff THAT much more stark in comparison.

And I am not saying these things to be harshly critical of MJ because he still remains my favorite athlete of all time. And this is from a die-hard Saints fan of over 40 years. To me, when I saw him play, I thought he was better at this than anybody has ever been in anything else in sports. He is my GOAT of GOATs.
VERY well said & thank you for taking the time to explain & post that.👍

I was listening to Terry Francona speak tonight on SVP’s show, about MJ as a baseball player. What a dichotomy! Unbelievable! MJ’s MLB teammates loved MJ, he was very hardworking & chill......nothing like he was with his NBA teammates.

I never knew shirt about MJ. But when I saw him speak at Kobe Bryant’s Celebration Of Life, and tears were running down his face, and snot was running out of his nose, in front of millions of people, worldwide, I had all the respect in the world for the guy.
 

guidomerkinsrules

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If you can't tell, Jordan is completely driven by his insecurities. I think that most greats are. From the relationship he had early on with his brother competing for their father's attention, it just seemed like he was always just a little insecure. Satisfied people are rarely, if ever, great. The need to prove yourself to others probably motivates a great deal of people. What did MJ's father say, "If you wanna motivate Michael to do something, tell him he can't do it."

The fact that MJ would make up slights to motivate himself to greatness, speaks to insecurity to me. But he utilized it perfectly, IMHO.

Right now if out of 100 people, 90 people line up and compliment you and and 10 people insult you, more than likely, you would concentrate on the 10 insults. You might be grateful for the compliments but the insults might get under your skin and stick to the front of your mind.

That may be a gross over simplification but this man had the adoration of the entire world, which makes the negative stuff THAT much more stark in comparison.

And I am not saying these things to be harshly critical of MJ because he still remains my favorite athlete of all time. And this is from a die-hard Saints fan of over 40 years. To me, when I saw him play, I thought he was better at this than anybody has ever been in anything else in sports. He is my GOAT of GOATs.
No, I think you are spot on
No one gets close to that level without being obsessive (and excessive)
Add once-in-a-lifetime ability/talent and you’re in rarified air that almost no one can relate to
 
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efil4stnias

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i love jordan, as a player, but this documentary series does absolutely nothing for me to respect him.
in what way do you mean "respect"?

I think SaintFaninLA hit on it...his desire to be the best at his trade. I cant think of anyone in my 49 years that had THAT much drive, and if he felt it lacking, would manufacture it to spark the engine. He was absolutely driven. From day 1 arriving as a rookie.

at the very least, you should respect that aspect of MJ as a person.
 

gavinj

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No, I think you are spot on
No one gets close to that level without being obsessive (and excessive)
Add once-in-a-lifetime ability/talent and you’re in rarified air that almost no one can relate to
Exactly, there’s a reason Michael Jordan is Michael Jordan and Derrick Coleman is Derrick Coleman. And it’s got very little to do with a difference in god-given talent.
 

zeetes

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in what way do you mean "respect"?

I think SaintFaninLA hit on it...his desire to be the best at his trade. I cant think of anyone in my 49 years that had THAT much drive, and if he felt it lacking, would manufacture it to spark the engine. He was absolutely driven. From day 1 arriving as a rookie.

at the very least, you should respect that aspect of MJ as a person.
he just comes off as a pompous arse. doesn't mean i didn't respect as a player, just a person.
 

msusaintsfan

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I go to church with Danny Ainge’s nephew. He said that Danny Ainge story isn’t the half of it. The very first time they met was on that golf course, and since then they have been best friends. Whenever MJ goes to Boston or Utah (or when Ainge goes to Charlotte) they get together for 18 holes. Ainge has won more money off of MJ than he cares to admit, but they get along very well, and MJ has been at each of Ainge’s kids weddings (and vice verse).
Funny you mention this. I have a buddy and he was in the PGM program at Mississippi State. Well when MJ was playing baseball in Birmingham, he was doing his internship at the golf course Jordan would play at.

Anyway, one day Jordan was looking to play guys for money and he had no takers so my buddy said he would play him , but was a college kid with no money. Jordan spotted him the money, and my buddy ended up taking his money, lol.
 
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sfidc3

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Exactly, there’s a reason Michael Jordan is Michael Jordan and Derrick Coleman is Derrick Coleman. And it’s got very little to do with a difference in god-given talent.
Great point. Most of the great players back then were driven, and downright mean at times....it may make me not like some of the things they did but my respect for them never really wavered....
 
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efil4stnias

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he just comes off as a pompous arse. doesn't mean i didn't respect as a player, just a person.

But would you not agree that "pompous" feel has more to do with your interpretation of his abilities and personal drive than his actual behavior off on/off the court?

I mean, dude didnt drink, smoked cigars later in life...dedicated his entire world to basketball/baseball/basketball. Was all in to achieve what very few strive to achieve. And then did it.

Sure, with that greatness comes some traits that some may consider "pompous", but when you look at the man as a whole, you dont see that as the guiding character trait. Its minimal and secondary to the things that stand out.

imo.

lol
 

zeetes

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But would you not agree that "pompous" feel has more to do with your interpretation of his abilities and personal drive than his actual behavior off on/off the court?

I mean, dude didnt drink, smoked cigars later in life...dedicated his entire world to basketball/baseball/basketball. Was all in to achieve what very few strive to achieve. And then did it.

Sure, with that greatness comes some traits that some may consider "pompous", but when you look at the man as a whole, you dont see that as the guiding character trait. Its minimal and secondary to the things that stand out.

imo.

lol
i dunno. when he was a player, his personality was perfect for the game.

i just think its time for him to lighten up lol
 

msusaintsfan

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Ok my to favorite players of all time are Jordan and Bird. Love the Celtics and Bulls.

Want to piss off a Rockets fan? Tell them if Jordan didn't retire the Bulls would have won 8 in a row, lol.

As a fan, back in the day I was beyond pissed they dismantled the team. Thinking that let's go ahead and dismantle one of the greatest teams ever for the future when the Bulls could possibly have won two more championships was beyond dumb......how has that worked out for the Bulls since then? not good.

I am enjoying the series but every time I look at Krause I wanna force choke him through the TV.

My Junior year of college was the last season of the Bulls dynasty. one of my roommates came to me on Thursday and asked me to drive to Chicago for the weekend because he had an interview for an internship at a Landscape architecture firm for the summer. I didn't have classes on Friday so I said sure.

Well we were able to take in a Cubbies day game and it just so happened to be the Bulls final regular season home game. The firm he got the internship with had a private booth at the United Center. The guy asked if we wanted to go to the game, my buddy was not a big basketball fan was like no, we are cool, I don't think I ever slapped someone in the back of the head faster in my life.

Turned out they were the ones who designed and managed Jordan's Chicago area home and during the summer my buddy worked at his house several times. MJ had his own little driving range (net) and putting green. He said they would find his personalized golf balls in gardens all over the backyard. He grabbed me 8 of them. I will have to dig them out and take a picture of them.
 

gavinj

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Want to piss off a Rockets fan? Tell them if Jordan didn't retire the Bulls would have won 8 in a row, lol.
Even when Jordan wasn’t retired, the Bulls went 10-12 against the Rockets. I was at a few of those games. The Rockets were a bad matchup for them.
 

msusaintsfan

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Even when Jordan wasn’t retired, the Bulls went 10-12 against the Rockets. I was at a few of those games. The Rockets were a bad matchup for them.
True, but that would have motivated Jordan in the Finals above all else against the Rockets.

Plus living in Houston for 17 years I loved messing with my neighbors who would lose their ever loving minds when I would bring this up, lol.
 

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