MMQB: Sean Payton discusses Drew’s retirement and QB competition for 2021 (3 Viewers)

No2DC

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Nice post. I do think Payton knows this is a definitive moment in his career: defining himself as a great coach without Drew. I really can't think of any coach that has successfully transitioned from a HOF caliber QB to another QB while maintaining the same coaching job.
 

blackadder

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Nice post. I do think Payton knows this is a definitive moment in his career: defining himself as a great coach without Drew. I really can't think of any coach that has successfully transitioned from a HOF caliber QB to another QB while maintaining the same coaching job.
As ever, the ultimate key is in coaching across all three phases and keeping the defense and running game up to snuff. Long stretches of failure to do the latter across the career span of Drew Brees is why there was not another appearance in Super Bowl (or three).

It's extremely unlikely he will ever see the same kind of mastery out of a QB again, so he has to lean on other players and other units. If he tries to do it all with his offense and his playcalling it's going to go sideways.
 

No2DC

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As ever, the ultimate key is in coaching across all three phases and keeping the defense and running game up to snuff. Long stretches of failure to do the latter across the career span of Drew Brees is why there was not another appearance in Super Bowl (or three).

It's extremely unlikely he will ever see the same kind of mastery out of a QB again, so he has to lean on other players and other units. If he tries to do it all with his offense and his playcalling it's going to go sideways.
Exactly, a good running game and top-notch D is the secret to a successful transition. That's why I'm not too big on a rook starting this year, with a playoff roster we just need stability at the QB position. I think both Taysom and Jameis are capable of that.
 

St.Dan

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Started brainstorming names of coaches to myself just to see how each HOF coach went on with their job after their HOF QB retired....yeah, this is intended for my Gen-X or older crowd.....

--Don Shula had Bob Griese for a long time, then a short stint with David Woodley before Marino fell in his lap after the Steelers passed on him earlier in the first round in '83. He wasn't fortunate enough to win another SB with Marino, but I don't think he'd have become the league's all-time winningest coach without a second HOF QB under center.

--Chuck Noll had Terry Bradshaw for a long time, though it's always said it was the Steel Curtain defense that keyed his coaching career. He went through some journeymen QB's the rest of his Steelers career after they passed on Marino (Stoudt, Malone, Brister, some others I can't remember). Never made it back to the big game with 'em.

--Mike Shanahan......hmmm.....two SB rings as a coach at the tail end of Elway's career, then fell off the map without him. Is he a HOF coach with those two rings? Is it enough? :unsure:

--Bill Belichick and Mike McCarthy.....two guys for whose post-(likely) HOF QB days are still being written. Time will tell if they can win even one ring with simply average QBs under center.
 

jasonsw

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To me Payton has proven he can win and be great without Drew. The trick is will he be patient and run with what works or will he get bored with that. If he can learn to exercise patience and make the other trip up first, Payton will elevate to that very top tier of coaches.
 

No2DC

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George Seifert from Montana to Young. Or did he start as head coach the first year with young?
Does he really get credit for that? It was the house that Bill Walsh built and Seifert was the long-time D coordinator if I recall. It's kinda like Barry Switzer in Dallas after Jimmy.
 

Derrick 63

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That said, part of planning ahead for Brees’s departure, from the start, was having potential successors in-house before Brees reached for his coat and started heading for the door. That way, everyone knows what they’re getting themselves into and, as Payton said, there are guys competing for the job who aren’t starting from zero—and are still in New Orleans because it’s where they want to be.
And that is good enough for me. If we draft another QB, fine. If one of the two we have with some game experience can get the job done, fine. A lot of people on SR.com want to make that decision for Coach instead of waiting to see what decision Coach makes. I trust Coach. I don't trust them. Sorry if that rubs people the wrong way.

Whatever they think they see or have seen, what they saw was on TV or from way up in the stands. Coach saw all of that too and he saw some more in countless film sessions and saw some more on the practice field. If he is comfortable with what he has then I'm going to trust his judgement. I would like to see them draft a QB but if you don't understand that depends a lot on one being there that he likes, you haven't paid much attention to Saints draft days the past 15 years.

One thing I am pretty confident of after all these years. Coach knows what he is doing. If the chips fall right he will win games. Period.
 

St.Dan

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George Seifert from Montana to Young. Or did he start as head coach the first year with young?
Bill Walsh retired from coaching after his third SB with Montana. Seifert was promoted and they won their fourth of the 1980s in his first year as coach. A few years later, Walsh went back to the college ranks for a little while, at his old stomping grounds at Stanford.

Closest way to compare them to the other coaches mentioned in the thread is to look at Seifert after the ‘94 SB win with Young. He didn’t fare too well the older Young got, then be left and tried his hand in Carolina, where he didn’t match the same success he and his old boss had in SF.
 

Whodat GT

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To me Payton has proven he can win and be great without Drew. The trick is will he be patient and run with what works or will he get bored with that. If he can learn to exercise patience and make the other trip up first, Payton will elevate to that very top tier of coaches.
In this line of thinking, I think people are getting too hung up on the need to have a franchise QB right away. I appreciate what Payton is saying in this article: the team didn´t revolve around Drew Brees the past two years. The reason I´m optimistic about Winston as a starting QB, and the Saints chances in the next year or so, is that there´s a real possibility that he´ll be a better QB than 2019-2020 Drew Brees. Brees used to carry the franchise, but that wasn´t the case the past two or three years.
 

tarusman28

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Started brainstorming names of coaches to myself just to see how each HOF coach went on with their job after their HOF QB retired....yeah, this is intended for my Gen-X or older crowd.....

--Don Shula had Bob Griese for a long time, then a short stint with David Woodley before Marino fell in his lap after the Steelers passed on him earlier in the first round in '83. He wasn't fortunate enough to win another SB with Marino, but I don't think he'd have become the league's all-time winningest coach without a second HOF QB under center.

--Chuck Noll had Terry Bradshaw for a long time, though it's always said it was the Steel Curtain defense that keyed his coaching career. He went through some journeymen QB's the rest of his Steelers career after they passed on Marino (Stoudt, Malone, Brister, some others I can't remember). Never made it back to the big game with 'em.

--Mike Shanahan......hmmm.....two SB rings as a coach at the tail end of Elway's career, then fell off the map without him. Is he a HOF coach with those two rings? Is it enough? :unsure:

--Bill Belichick and Mike McCarthy.....two guys for whose post-(likely) HOF QB days are still being written. Time will tell if they can win even one ring with simply average QBs under center.
Well Joe Gibbs won three Super Bowls with 3 different quartbacks: Joe Theismann (XVII), Doug Williams (XXII) and Mark Rypien (XXVI). And Bill Parcells also won two Superbowls with two different quarterbacks with the Gaints: Phil Simms (XXI) and Jeff Hostetler (XXV).

I know Doug Williams is the only quarterback that's in the hall of fame.
 

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Well Joe Gibbs won three Super Bowls with 3 different quartbacks: Joe Theismann (XVII), Doug Williams (XXII) and Mark Rypien (XXVI). And Bill Parcells also won two Superbowls with two different quarterbacks with the Gaints: Phil Simms (XXI) and Jeff Hostetler (XXV).

I know Doug Williams is the only quarterback that's in the hall of fame.
Gibbs’ accomplishments in the ‘80s stand alone and apart from the others. Gibbs didn’t have the same QB for an extended period, especially after Theismann’s career ending broken leg. Also, Theismann isn’t in the pro HOF. He’s only in the college HOF.

As for Parcells’ Giants, Hoss was one of Simms’ backups. Stepped in late in 1990 when Simms was injured. Different situation there.
 

tarusman28

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Gibbs’ accomplishments in the ‘80s stand alone and apart from the others. Gibbs didn’t have the same QB for an extended period, especially after Theismann’s career ending broken leg. Also, Theismann isn’t in the pro HOF. He’s only in the college HOF.

As for Parcells’ Giants, Hoss was one of Simms’ backups. Stepped in late in 1990 when Simms was injured. Different situation there.
I don't understand how Gibbs accomplishments in the 80's in the NFL are any different than they are now. The game hasn't changed that much from now.

Ok Theismann wasn't a HOF. Doug Williams is and Mark Rypien replaced him and still took the Redskins to the Superbowl.

The fact that Gibbs and Parcells was successful with backups that came in and not only took their teams to Superbowl but also won them is amazing.

But I understand your question was replacing a HOF quarterback with another HOF.
 

Saint Spud

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In this line of thinking, I think people are getting too hung up on the need to have a franchise QB right away. I appreciate what Payton is saying in this article: the team didn´t revolve around Drew Brees the past two years. The reason I´m optimistic about Winston as a starting QB, and the Saints chances in the next year or so, is that there´s a real possibility that he´ll be a better QB than 2019-2020 Drew Brees. Brees used to carry the franchise, but that wasn´t the case the past two or three years.
Agree. Nick Underhill said it on his podcast yesterday and he’s right: the QB play wasn’t good last year.

Part of that was certainly because Drew was playing hurt, but if you look at it objectively, there is a much higher ceiling for QB play in this offense. The team carried the QB, not the other way around.

That doesn’t guarantee anything. And Jameis may come out and play poorly and the whole thing looks like a failed decision. But I’m betting he comes out and plays really well and we don’t see much of a dropoff in overall QB play, if any.
 

Whodat GT

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Jameis may come out and play poorly and the whole thing looks like a failed decision. But I’m betting he comes out and plays really well and we don’t see much of a dropoff in overall QB play, if any.
I´m sure there will be growing pains, since you can´t expect Winston to play in the same style as Brees, and the offense will have to adjust, but there´s a chance that what the position loses in acurracy and decision making, you make up for with new plays catered to Winston´s skill set... and the return of the long ball. I´m also assuming that Winston can stop being so careless with the ball. If he keeps turning the ball over, all bets are off.
 

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