My Views on Winston and Payton's Shift Yesterday (1 Viewer)

[bobad]

Winston has moxie. I do not buy the narrative of Payton needing to unleash Winston as much as its just Payton managing the game with his play calling and this offense being a little different than what Winston is used to running. The deep ball is there and when executed you see Winston shine and that is part of the offense, its the base of the offense Winston struggles with and that is the intermediate passing game where Payton likes to stay ahead of the sticks (2nd and 5 is better than a 2nd and 10) and as the OP stated he at times struggles to make the right throw on time.

We can win with Winston, we are winning with Winston and he is making some great throws, but he does have to get better at taking what the defense gives him and being ok with that, make the right read and get the ball out of your hand and move on to the next play.

The commentator was calling Heiniecke a gunslinger when Winston was the real gunslinger on the field. Yeah, Winston may be struggling to control his instincts to fling it deep.

 

[Taker597]

It's a process and we should let it play out for better or worse. Then, make a decision in the off season.

 

[Madmarsha]

Which dovetails into a conversation I had with my brother (Sorry, had to...lol). Peoole forget that Jameis had multiple coaches and all offensive Numbskulls in his first 5 years. Nevermind he had a change in philosophy, he had Lovie Smith, a defensive guy with Dirk Koetter lmao. Then Arians come in, and Jameis finally feels that he has a system that will help him.....but it's a crazy arse "No risk it, No busuit" system....that even Brady had to throw the Bird at...and take over the offense.

So, when we try to compare two young men, first 5 years, remember that Brees went from one Hall of Fame Head Coach to another Hall of Fame Head Coach.

Marty Schottenheimer is quoted by other coaches as one of the best football minds in Football. His knowledge in preparing the offense is on par with anyone in the league. He caught hell with Martyball (Defensive tactic of bend, dont break...prevent defense). Still even that is in the hall as a defensive tactic.

Brees had two greats...and only two...his entire career. Jameis had 2 before coming here....teaching him all kinds of nonsense.

Copycat. But surrusly, I think this is a big part of The Jameis Question of what kind of QB he's ultimately going to be we need to keep in mind. Newbie QBs always talk of when the game slows down for them, and we expect Jameis to be past that point since he's not a rookie. There is no doubt Jameis was on his way to being "ruined" with the amount of tutelage he was [not] getting at Tampa Bay. I'm willing to believe we got him in the nick of time. Granted, we don't know for sure yet; but one thing we DO know is that Sean Payton is not a quarterback killer which is why I remain hopeful.

 

[whosyadaddy]

Too many fans want to judge him right now and right now isn't the time. Like another poster said , he hasn't played one down with Michael Thomas or TQS. Our O Line desperately needs to get healthy. Armstead out , McCoy out, Peat banged up. Let him at least be surrounded with our top tier talent before serious evaluations begin. The man had two pro bowlers he threw to in TB, he is doing ok with our group of UDFA's. He is doing way more than ok to be honest, he has career highs in QB Rating, TD-INT, TD per pass all in a new system with far inferior talent than he had in prior years in TB. That is growth in and of itself. He is learning.

The "fixing" of Jameis if you will was never gonna be a flick of the light switch. There are going to be growing pains as with any other growing QB in a new system, and it is going to take time. I am encouraged by what I see from Jameis. I expected small issues with timing , the play with the awkward pass when he should have ran, some bouts with indecision, but that's to be expected and can easily be ironed out and coached out. The problem is a portion of fans wanted him fixed Week 1, that's simply not realistic. Most should have known, like Drew said regarding the situation that it's going to take time

The proper and fair evaluation will be done at year end when he has had some time to develop a chemistry with CGM and TQS, and hopefully his supporting cast along the line gets better. The team as a whole needs to get healthy, that huge list of talent we have on the sideline needs to be on the field

 

[Madmarsha]

Rhythm is the main thing I am missing. Maybe thats the injuries and we will see that rhythm after the bye. Drew made our Oline look better than they actually were for years because he was quick reading the defense and knew where he wanted to go with the ball pre-snap. Maybe Rhythm is something that Winston will develop but right now it's just not on display in the last few games. I did see it in the Green Bay game and that does give me hope.

The conversation was getting far too mature and rational with too many excellent points being made. I had to correct that by inserting a sophomoric .gif.

 

[SaintTupelo]

rewatched the game. On the play where Jameis misthrew the pass to Hogan or could have ran for the five yards for the first down, there was a holding on 75 call. Had either the pass been completed or he ran for the first, they would have moved the ball back 10 yards for a penalty. So in this case, a better throw or run would not have mattered.

 

[SigFreudianSlip]

Good stuff... the Fanboy vs Hater stuff is getting tiresome... Thanks for the levity.

Yep. A great post. He’s definitely somewhere in the middle of where the haters and fanboys put him.

 

[SaintStephen1]

I tell you what I love. Haven’t heard Jameis make any excuses for his bad plays including being stepped on which caused yesterday’s int.

 

[DavidM]

rewatched the game. On the play where Jameis misthrew the pass to Hogan or could have ran for the five yards for the first down, there was a holding on 75 call. Had either the pass been completed or he ran for the first, they would have moved the ball back 10 yards for a penalty. So in this case, a better throw or run would not have mattered.

It matters because if the Saints had made the play to pick up the first, WFT would have accepted the penalty and they would have replayed 3rd down. Because of the failed conversion, WFT declined the penalty and it was 4th down.

 

[sfidc3]

I tell you what I love. Haven’t heard Jameis make any excuses for his bad plays including being stepped on which caused yesterday’s int.

And I don't think you will, I think he has matured and turned into a true leader. I hope he continues to improve and think he will....need to get our offensive (and D) players back.....

 

[Saintshizzle]

And I don't think you will, I think he has matured and turned into a true leader. I hope he continues to improve and think he will....need to get our offensive (and D) players back.....

He has been very obsequious, far more than we could ever imagined. Bodes well for his relationship with Sean and our success, as a whole.

 

[boutte]

I see progress with Jameis. Each week is a building block. He’s been asked to do a lot and handled the transition with more class than I’ve seen in some time. He’s humble, he has a tremendous work ethic and undeniable arm talent.

Right now we are Sean Payton’s team but somewhere along the way this will become Jameis’s team. The only question is time.

Couldn't agree more. I was appalled when we signed him. I had a really bad impression of him both as a player and a person. Seeing him put in the work and do what he was asked without complaint while working on a bargain basement contract character and a desire to be the best QB he can be.

He's also a very likable guy, humble and funny.

Hope he does well and earns a big payday.

 

[No2DC]

It matters because if the Saints had made the play to pick up the first, WFT would have accepted the penalty and they would have replayed 3rd down. Because of the failed conversion, WFT declined the penalty and it was 4th down.

With an extra 10 yards against us, right?

 

[DavidM]

With an extra 10 yards against us, right?

Yes.

 

[the-commish]

Of course, HE made some bonehead decisons last week as coach so I'm not sure who gets on him verbally when that happen.

I dare say, if not for P:ayton's decision to attempt a long (~58 yard) FG with the Saints ahead by 2 scores, and with half the 4th quarter gone, instead of punting, possibly planting the Giants inside their own 10 yard line... that decision led to the team giving up what should have been an insurmountable lead.

In other words, Sean Payton lost that game.