N/S DeSean Jackson shares Anti-Semitic quotes attributed to Hitler on Instagram (1 Viewer)

Both are in tough situations, but they're not necessarily equally tough. That said, I do think those poor of all backgrounds have enough in common to pull together and have their interests represented in public forums. I dunno, just throwing that out there for thought
sure
and the easiest way for the 1% to horde is to pit 25% against 15%
and then to distract the 59% with that battle
 
At the risk of going just a bit astray, I think an example to illustrate how a poor white individual might have a different experience than a poor minority could be that they might not receive the same treatment from LEOs, or teachers, or other people who are in authority and prejudiced and can get away with it to some degree. I don’t know how true or widespread it is today, but it makes sense to me that this could be the case.

Both are in tough situations, but they're not necessarily equally tough. That said, I do think those poor of all backgrounds have enough in common to pull together and have their interests represented in public forums. I dunno, just throwing that out there for thought
Agree. One side has it better than the other, but not necessarily as good as you might think.

Either way, there's still a hierarchy and the greatest concession has to flow from the top to the bottom.

But it's not something you literally have to concede; not anything tangible that has to be physically given away. Initially it's mental.

It's something you have to concede in your mind (and heart). But conceding feels like you're "losing." So people resist. Deny there's anything to concede in the first place.

I suppose denying it exists feels better than acknowledging the imbalance and not wanting to do anything about it.
 
Agree. One side has it better than the other, but not necessarily as good as you might think.

Either way, there's still a hierarchy and the greatest concession has to flow from the top to the bottom.

But it's not something you literally have to concede; not anything tangible that has to be physically given away. Initially it's mental.

It's something you have to concede in your mind (and heart). But conceding feels like you're "losing." So people resist. Deny there's anything to concede in the first place.

I suppose denying it exists feels better than acknowledging the imbalance and not wanting to do anything about it.

Yeah, that makes sense. Well said. And certianly those with power aren't going to concede or share that power easily. Those who have their minds made up arent going to concede easily or willingly. Strong willed people are tough nuts to crack.
 
I am curious how that worked. This isn’t a “gotcha” question. I’d honestly like to hear the reasoning. It seems counterintuitive as slave owners owned slaves to have workers that they could abuse, work to death, control completely and who would not be able to escape. Poor whites, that could have been the workers, lost opportunities for jobs. Not every white person was a land owner. I’m not sure how they benefited from slavery. The people that benefit from racial tension are our ruling class. Get to the polls and vote for our guy or “these people are going to punish you. “

I would argue that the powers that be foment racism as a wedge to drive people apart who should be more natural allies. On the Right you have the “they’re taking your jobs” crew or the fears of increased diversity as demographics change. Trump pushes this constantly and you see it on the Twitter sphere as righties push the idea that “they” are coming for you. The Left uses “whiteness” to describe every issue that pops up. Is every cop related death based on racism? Could it be we are doing an inadequate job selecting and training police? Nah it’s whiteness. What if it’s a black police officer? It’s internalized whiteness. Whitensss, like the Force, surrounds us and binds us. There’s no escape. You’re either racist of anti racist. Most likely racist until proven otherwise. It takes away any sense of agency from minorities and dashes hopes it can be better. Is that a reason we are seeing a spike in suicide among black children? White people being special (even in a bad way) and all powerful is basically what Richard Spencer types believe.

One reason I do not buy into the “whiteness” arguments is because they paint everything with a broad brush and have often been developed by white people from wealthy families who are projecting their life experience onto every white person in the USA. White people do not tend to be monolithic and divide themselves into categories based on economic class, religion, region of birth and so on. I have far more in common with my black and Hispanic neighbors than I do Bill Gates or some scion of wealth at Harvard. Are we the exact same? Of course not. I don’t pretend to know what it’s like to be black or Hispanic. At the same time my neighbors don’t know what it’s like to use a wheelchair. But we essentially want the same things in life. Good schools for the kids, a good place to live, access to medical care and jobs etc. Our commonalities get lost in this discourse and I can’t help but feel that is by design. We can work together to improve the country and fight against inequality but we’d rather drive this wedge and make each other the enemy and ensure nothing gets done. Again.

There is undeniably racial problems in this country and racism does continue to be an issue. It’s good to ask tough questions. To get people to be more introspective about their feelings or actions. To be more proactive in fighting racism and supporting minority efforts and organizations. However, I don’t think labeling every white person as a benefactor of white supremacy is helpful or accurate. Studies have shown that teaching white privilege not only doesn’t work but is counter productive. It doesn’t help the struggle of black Americans it only makes people dislike white people. That’s why you can have well-off white kids mocking a white homeless guy for not taking advantage of his white privilege.

It is just weird to me how the ideas of class playing any role in society has completely vanished from our national conversations. We’re just expected to believe even the poorest of the poor of white people have the same experiences and opportunities as trust fund kids and they don’t face discrimination from the elites.

I think you just need to access certain information so you see how white supremacy trickles down. All those profits from slavery had to go somewhere. Those wealthy slave owners didnt just bury their money in the ground. Now certainly you have lots of poor majority in middle america even today, but as a whole, the majority gained massive benefits from the entire white supremacy program.

Case in point, the industry of the north was financed by slavery in the south through the US treasury. The US government heavily subsidized northern industry to get it started. That money didn't just fall from the sky.

Fast forward to the 1930s, 40s, 50s, and 60s. The suburbanization of American that created it's modern "white" middle class was a repeat. The US government heavily subsidized home and small business ownership, but with an explicit policy to exclude 99% of African Americans thanks to southern Democrats who wanted to preserve the "southern way of life." You see the affects of that in 2020. None of that has ever been corrected.

Long story short, you didn't have to own slaves in order to benefit from it.
 
And this is exactly why I said the term to be used needs to stay as white supremacy. You use the term "racism" and it implies some kind of 1-to-1 relationship with equal consequences. Which we all know isn't true.

This is exactly why you have people trying to equate Desean Jackson's tweet should be met with the same response as what institutional white supremacy has done to African Americans. It's just not the same thing. One is just an annoying use of words, while the other involves ACTIONS that result in people dying, being locked up far longer than they should, or being locked in urban ghettos for generations.

And what I got from Desean's tweet is what I'd expect of someone representing a bottom caste. Something positive about a downtrodden group of people even if it comes from someone like Hitler. And bear in mind, Hitler and his eventual political party is no friend to African people. The first "nazi genocide" with concentration camps didn't happen to Jews, but to people in Namibia that hardly anyone knows about (still fighting for reparations). And Desean probably also doesn't know about.



Let's stop trying to treat things as if everybody has the same level of power. Desean's tweet is the same as a 50 lb man punching prime Mike Tyson. And white supremacy is the exact opposite. Seems unfair but that's just reality. Doesn't make what Desean posted correct, but there should be some level of "I understand" and shouldn't expect African Americans to rush and rebuke what he posted the same as the George Floyd response.

You do realize that Jews have been killed, enslaved, discriminated against, been the victims of forced removals, terrible myths and distorted conspiracy theories saying their eternally guilty of killing Jesus, blood libels, forced to live in ghettos all over central and Eastern Europe for centuries separate from Christian populations, forcibly removed and kicked out of their homelands numerous times dating back to Biblical times and late Bronze Ages. Antisemitism is a plague and a curse that's been corrupting minds, perceptions, and feelings of countless kingdoms, nations, ethnicities, laws, viewed as racially/biologically inferior by radical Social Darwinists or pan-German nationalists, ideologues in the late 19th and 20th centuries.

Most of the grievances that have occured or have been propagated against individual Jews, Jewish communities, culture, their religion long before their was an African slave trade, European and American notions or perceptions of cultural, political, or racial supremacy, before racial profiling, redlining, systemic racial discrimination or police brutality towards African-Americans, Latinos, or other minorities in this country.

In fact, you could say antisemitism is biblical in it's very long persistence, existence. If you believe in that or have any religious inclinations, the Old Testament is chalk full of examples.
 
I hope it's been educational as much as it's been a forum for different points of view concerning race, racism, race relations in America and in professional sports and certain angles can be perceived regarding comments made by different people who get different reactions or responses from their teammates, peers, fellow Americans, and the sports media in general when it comes to controversial remarks regarding standing for the National Anthem, how patriotism is viewed, and how we directly address police brutality, systematic racism or discrimination and how some cry foul or bullshirt when a minority All-Pro Eagles WR is given a proportionally different response or initially hardly any responses.
 
I've long accepted this is not a fixable issue and the reality of the situation is one where attempted mitigation is the best you can hope for. Shaming racist behavior is the best tool we have but it has to be clear examples of racist behavior, not nebulous accusations we see all the time these days. Racist is a term thrown a little too loosely these days, unfortunately.

The reason why you can never eradicate racism is because extreme biases are always going to be apart of human nature. Racism is one of the many extreme bias humans will employ at some point, it might not be a racist bias but it might be another based on extreme criteria, sexism, homo/transphobia, political or religious ideology, etc. Racism is an exteme bias toward someone on the basis of race. To hypothetically eradicate it, you would have to remove humans from the equation that are governing our systems.

So for example, criminal justice, law enforcement. You would need an unbiased entity whose whole purpose would be to interpet the law no matter who is involved. We know thats how the law SHOULD BE. In reality, thats not how it is due to these biases that are always in play at various levels in any human society.

This is why this is such a nuanced issue because you're dealing with humans that are inherently deeply flawed that are trying to govern entire systems that arent supposed to show bias and treat everyone equally down the middle.
 
I think you just need to access certain information so you see how white supremacy trickles down. All those profits from slavery had to go somewhere. Those wealthy slave owners didnt just bury their money in the ground.

No they didn’t just bury it in the ground. They P'Oed it away by seceding from the Union, creating their own currency, spending today’s equivalent of 100 billion dollars fighting a stupid war, borrowing hundreds of millions from foreign countries, and dealing with the resulting 9000% inflation rate, before having most of their property and land seized.

You aren’t talking about people who were savvy investors and wise money managers. They were aristocratic airheads.
 
I don’t think anyone was saying this. Jewish people who mistreat black people should be held accountable though, just like black people who mistreat Jewish People should be held accountable.
I think that’s my exact point about DeSean Jackson and actually that’s a lot of people’s points in here. I agree with you totally
 
You do realize that Jews have been killed, enslaved, discriminated against, been the victims of forced removals, terrible myths and distorted conspiracy theories saying their eternally guilty of killing Jesus, blood libels, forced to live in ghettos all over central and Eastern Europe for centuries separate from Christian populations, forcibly removed and kicked out of their homelands numerous times dating back to Biblical times and late Bronze Ages. Antisemitism is a plague and a curse that's been corrupting minds, perceptions, and feelings of countless kingdoms, nations, ethnicities, laws, viewed as racially/biologically inferior by radical Social Darwinists or pan-German nationalists, ideologues in the late 19th and 20th centuries.

Tell me about when Jews were forced to live in ghettos outside of Nazi occupation. Or when Jews were kicked out of their "homelands" outside of supposedly biblical times.

I don't know about this. I want to learn.

Also, about reparations.

Most of the grievances that have occurred or have been propagated against individual Jews, Jewish communities, culture, their religion long before their was an African slave trade, European and American notions or perceptions of cultural, political, or racial supremacy, before racial profiling, redlining, systemic racial discrimination or police brutality towards African-Americans, Latinos, or other minorities in this country.

In fact, you could say antisemitism is biblical in it's very long persistence, existence. If you believe in that or have any religious inclinations, the Old Testament is chalk full of examples.

And yet Jews in America were able to heavily participate in racial profiling, redlining, systemic racial discrimination, and police brutality towards African-Americans, Latinos, or other minorities in this country. Especially African Americans,

See Aaron Lopez and Judah P Benjamin. For a people that were so persecuting worldwide, how could that be??
 
Okay, the ancient Roman's displaced most of the entire Jewish population in Palestine after the first Roman Jewish wars from 66-74 CE, and then after the Bar Kopka revolt from 132-135 CE where Roman Emperor Hadrian forbade Jewish circumcision, prohibited the teaching of Hebrew religious textbooks like the Torah all throughout the Roman Empire. This began what many historians, classicists, Jewish historians where Jewish people were spread out throughout the entire known world for next 2,000 years until 1947 with the founding of Israel.

Then the Roman Catholic Church, used or distorted some supposedly critical remarks made towards Jews or Judaism to create dogmas or tenets that the ancient Jews were guilty of diocide and for this eternally cursed. Late antiquity Christian scholars who promoted this dogma were St. Augustine and St. Jerome. Jews were periodically forced to leave, relocate, sometimes at a moment's notice, to other regions of Europe if a new rule or king didn't like them or decided to evict them due to local hostility or hatred from commoners or lords in the region.

In the early 13th century, King Edward I banned all Jews from his domains and it remained criminal offense to be a Jew or practicing Judaiam in England for the next 350 years until Oliver Cromwell invited them back after the English Civil War and England was a short-lived republic.

It was also,in England where allegedly the blood libel myths against Jews began in the 12th century where lurid, despicably lies were spread accusing Jews kidnapped Christian children, took them to hidden, subterranean lairs, drained their blood and used it on their matzah bread in their own religious rituals.

Ghetto is a Dutch word, so for centuries Jews were forced to live in them in their own homes, communities like second-class citizens in modern-day Holland, Germany, Czech Republic, Slovenia, Rome, France. The Dutch were the original founders of New York (New Netherlands), and Harlem was originally the colony's ghetto for Jewish colonists. This policy remained in effect for decades even after Dutch lost control of New Netherlands to English without firing a shot in IIRC 1664. Most European Jews who lived in large, metropolitan cities were legally forced to live in ghettos and wear an official insignia signifying their status until late 18th/early 19th centuries.

Most of the edicts, laws agreed from the Lateran Council authorizing papal inquisitions in mid-13th century eventually led Spanish King Ferdinand and Queen Isabella beginning the Spanish Inquisition to root out former Spanish Jews forcibly converted to Catholicism in 1391 called conversoes, secretly began practicing their old faith, later Spanish or French Protestants. These Spanish Jews were tortured, beaten in elaborate, terrible, atrocious ways, burned at the stake at large, public gatherings. The Spanish Inquisition lasted in intervening, terrible intervals until 1836 in Spain and late 1860s in Papal States around Rome.
 
Okay, the ancient Roman's displaced most of the entire Jewish population in Palestine after the first Roman Jewish wars from 66-74 CE, and then after the Bar Kopka revolt from 132-135 CE where Roman Emperor Hadrian forbade Jewish circumcision, prohibited the teaching of Hebrew religious textbooks like the Torah all throughout the Roman Empire. This began what many historians, classicists, Jewish historians where Jewish people were spread out throughout the entire known world for next 2,000 years until 1947 with the founding of Israel.

Then the Roman Catholic Church, used or distorted some supposedly critical remarks made towards Jews or Judaism to create dogmas or tenets that the ancient Jews were guilty of diocide and for this eternally cursed. Late antiquity Christian scholars who promoted this dogma were St. Augustine and St. Jerome. Jews were periodically forced to leave, relocate, sometimes at a moment's notice, to other regions of Europe if a new rule or king didn't like them or decided to evict them due to local hostility or hatred from commoners or lords in the region.

In the early 13th century, King Edward I banned all Jews from his domains and it remained criminal offense to be a Jew or practicing Judaiam in England for the next 350 years until Oliver Cromwell invited them back after the English Civil War and England was a short-lived republic.

It was also,in England where allegedly the blood libel myths against Jews began in the 12th century where lurid, despicably lies were spread accusing Jews kidnapped Christian children, took them to hidden, subterranean lairs, drained their blood and used it on their matzah bread in their own religious rituals.

Ghetto is a Dutch word, so for centuries Jews were forced to live in them in their own homes, communities like second-class citizens in modern-day Holland, Germany, Czech Republic, Slovenia, Rome, France. The Dutch were the original founders of New York (New Netherlands), and Harlem was originally the colony's ghetto for Jewish colonists. This policy remained in effect for decades even after Dutch lost control of New Netherlands to English without firing a shot in IIRC 1664. Most European Jews who lived in large, metropolitan cities were legally forced to live in ghettos and wear an official insignia signifying their status until late 18th/early 19th centuries.

Most of the edicts, laws agreed from the Lateran Council authorizing papal inquisitions in mid-13th century eventually led Spanish King Ferdinand and Queen Isabella beginning the Spanish Inquisition to root out former Spanish Jews forcibly converted to Catholicism in 1391 called conversoes, secretly began practicing their old faith, later Spanish or French Protestants. These Spanish Jews were tortured, beaten in elaborate, terrible, atrocious ways, burned at the stake at large, public gatherings. The Spanish Inquisition lasted in intervening, terrible intervals until 1836 in Spain and late 1860s in Papal States around Rome.

Thanks. And about the "Jewish Emancipation" all across Europe? What did that involve and its lasting affects?

And also the reparations part.
 
There have been no reparations for centuries of systemic discrimination, bigotry, xenophobia towards Jewish communities or individual Jews as a whole, collective effort as far as I'm aware save for new West German government agreeing to some reparations and reimbursements in a treaty with Isreal in mid-1950s and Holocaust survivors, IIRC.

As far as Jewish "Emancipation", they received greater civil liberties, tolerance, freedom of conscience but it was apart of larger political or social movements that occured in Europe over the past 500 years. It began with the Reformation, European Enlightement philosophes like John Stuart Mill, Voltaire, Jean-Jacques Rousseau, Thomas Hobbs, and then the French Revolution and its long-lasting spread of secularism, rationalism, and to a certain extent, European nationalist movements. Their were very few historical movements that I'm aware of that were explicitly or wholly dedicated to Jewish civil rights for Jews living in European or Middle Esst countries, there was no singular Civil Rights movement like the one for African-Americans that began in mid-50s mostly led by and articulated by Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. The circumstances for Jews in many European countries for centuries was radically different because the overall Jewish population differed from country to country. For centuries, most European Jews or Jewish communities were largest in Central and Eastern Europe, particularly Prussia, Austro-Hungarian Empire, Balkans regions, Czarist Russia, modern Poland, Lithuania, Estonia, Latvia, Ukraine, lesser extent Austria, and Northern Italy. Countries like UK or France didn't have as comparably large Jewish populations as in Central or Eastern Europe and over time, some Jews successfully assimilated into native countries culture, religion, national identity for a while at least.
 

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