NFL's flawed obsession w/ Taysom Hill types: theringer article (1 Viewer)

[Summed7]

The NFL’s Search for the Next Taysom Hill Is Fundamentally Flawed

Teams around the league have become obsessed with finding Taysom Hill types. But they don’t seem to understand what makes the Saints playmaker so valuable—or how to replicate his impact.

www.theringer.com

Good read. Not the most flattering take on his future as our starting QB, but def shows an appreciation for how unique of a weapon he is.

 

[sainthood]

Hill's value is based on efficiency of production in limited attempts. It would be incorrect to assume this efficiency could be extended to full time action from both a physical exertion perspective or coaching. His special teams, receiving, blocking, running, and limited passing (most effective in the threat of passing but not actually passing) are noted in the yards per route run stat in this article. The Saints get all this production across the game, but also have other players producing. You have to think about the stuffed runs, dropped catches, incomplete passes, interceptions, fumbles, missed tackles or blocks that never happen because the sample is so small because Taysom is not over-used. Coach Payton puts his players in the best position to make plays. This is maximized by not over-using them.

 

[jasonsw]

It's hard to find a player like Taysom Hill. What he does requires several things. Being an uber talented athlete, a special kind of physique, being extremely fast, an endless work ethic, a coach that know how to use said player correctly and a special humility to achieve at various roles which might not be your preferred one.

Someone like Tebow could have been a special football player but his ego wouldn't allow him to be anything other than a starting QB

 

[No2DC]

Thanks for the post. I think most of know his flaws and what he has to do to make it a starting QB if it's possible. He is a very unique weapon, nevertheless.

 

[Scorpius the Allfather]

The only issue I have with that article is minor but when Brees got hurt we scaled back Hill's touches so it wasn't business as usual with him like it claimed.

 

[Que Que 6]

It's hard to find a player like Taysom Hill. What he does requires several things. Being an uber talented athlete, a special kind of physique, being extremely fast, an endless work ethic, a coach that know how to use said player correctly and a special humility to achieve at various roles which might not be your preferred one.

Someone like Tebow could have been a special football player but his ego wouldn't allow him to be anything other than a starting QB

Tebow was a stiff. He ran. But still. A stiff

 

[dutar76]

The problem with jacks-of-all-trades is that they're usually the masters-of-none. Thing is, I don't think Taysom started out as a jack-of-all trades. He just came in flat out being able to football. That combined with his elite athletic ability, build, and speed allowed him to get on the field (due to injuries IIRC) on special teams. That gave Sean Payton the spark that got his mental combustion going. For the first time in what seemed like a while, SP really seemed 110% locked in and engaged exploring the possibilities with his new found toy / weapon.

But... like all weapons being forged, Taysom needed some refining, honing, and sharpening. So Payton put his position coaches to work doing just that. Not dumping the entirety of any position on him, just dosing him with specific techniques, responsibilities, and reads for specific plays that were designed especially for him by Coach P. Over time, with more and more success, more and more plays were added to the Taysom playbook. And Taysom was spoon-fed what he needed for those additional plays, until eventually... He had mastered quite a bit of what a RB, TE, WR, and FB needs to know.

Taysom's athleticism and S/W/S are fits for all the positions he has been asked to play. But what I think helped more than anything was his role as a QB, since a signal caller needs to have at least a "good" understanding of all the skill positions' roles and responsibilities. Still, to master even some of the actual "technical" nuances of all those positions shows Taysom's football IQ and ability to learn and retain a LOT of information. And even more impressive is his ability to process it all and put it to use on the field.

Regardless of his atheltic traits and mental processing... to absorb all that? Taysom had to be hungry. That's WAY more on his plate than any other player over the course of a few short years. This tells me two things. Taysom's work ethic has to be off the charts... And that Payton struck gold with his motivation plan for the player. The carrot? "Do all this and I will give you everything you need to become an NFL quarterback."

In the end, being a QB has helped Taysom become the player he is at all those other positions. What intrigues me is what playing all those other position may have done to prepare Taysom to become a QB.

I can understand other teams wanting their very own Taysom. But he's a special case. A special athlete, in a unique situation, fostered by a coach and staff that have dedicated a lot of time and energy into turning him into what he is and what he may become. It's not as simple as finding an athlete and designing some plays for him. If it was, the league would be full of Taysoms... Heck the league would have ALWAYS been full of Taysoms.

 

[guidomerkinsrules]

Hill's value is based on efficiency of production in limited attempts. It would be incorrect to assume this efficiency could be extended to full time action from both a physical exertion perspective or coaching. His special teams, receiving, blocking, running, and limited passing (most effective in the threat of passing but not actually passing) are noted in the yards per route run stat in this article. The Saints get all this production across the game, but also have other players producing. You have to think about the stuffed runs, dropped catches, incomplete passes, interceptions, fumbles, missed tackles or blocks that never happen because the sample is so small because Taysom is not over-used. Coach Payton puts his players in the best position to make plays. This is maximized by not over-using them.

while it may be true about his value (not quite sure)
it is ALSO incorrect to assume that an increase in snaps would lead to a decrease in production
eg while there is some perceived wisdom in limiting AK snaps will keep production high, it seems like it doesn't effect MT at all - you're going to get maximum production regardless
we don't yet know of Taysom has a production ceiling

 

[guidomerkinsrules]

It's hard to find a player like Taysom Hill. What he does requires several things. Being an uber talented athlete, a special kind of physique, being extremely fast, an endless work ethic, a coach that know how to use said player correctly and a special humility to achieve at various roles which might not be your preferred one.

Someone like Tebow could have been a special football player but his ego wouldn't allow him to be anything other than a starting QB

and it should be pointed out that when we picked up Taysom Hill we weren't getting TAYSOM HILL
Taysom happened because our ST coach was like, can i borrow your fast as **** QB for a few plays?
the Stevens pick will show us if it's possible to shortcut the Taysom discovery process of not

 

[saint_drago]

and it should be pointed out that when we picked up Taysom Hill we weren't getting TAYSOM HILL
Taysom happened because our ST coach was like, can i borrow your fast as **** QB for a few plays?
the Stevens pick will show us if it's possible to shortcut the Taysom discovery process of not

Exactly. Really good point. This was something that happened organically. It's not practical to think that you can simply bring in an athletic QB and boom, you have the next Taysom Hill.

 

[WxM]

My biggest problem with the article is that the writer uses mostly college stats to "prove" that Hill isn't an NFL QB. That's a very small portion of the picture. It's more about traits. Our staff thinks he has the traits. As Payton has said, it's natural for outsiders to be skeptical since we haven't seen thousands of practice snaps, but the writer isn't merely skeptical. He's already decided that Hill isn't a QB.

My other main problem is that he backs up his argument with the fact that Hill wasn't even second string. Well, if you're going to play him in the other facets of the game, you really can't do that. You have to make him third string, or at least have another backup.

 

[SWAMP_THING]

The Saints Put Taysom Hill in Too Many Dangerous Situations for Him to Be Their QB of the Future

https://www.thebiglead.com/posts/saints-taysom-hill-qb-of-the-future-01e8c988n0c8

People/bloggers just cannot force themselves to think Sean Payton can possibly take unconventional routes and that he's obviously lying to everyone including Taysom Hill

 

[SWAMP_THING]

The NFL’s Search for the Next Taysom Hill Is Fundamentally Flawed

Teams around the league have become obsessed with finding Taysom Hill types. But they don’t seem to understand what makes the Saints playmaker so valuable—or how to replicate his impact.

www.theringer.com

Good read. Not the most flattering take on his future as our starting QB, but def shows an appreciation for how unique of a weapon he is.

That blogger also thinks Taysom has not been promoted to #2 ..laugh is on him!

 

[SWAMP_THING]

All I know as far as Taysom Hill playing a Mike Vick type of QB role in the league, spells F E A R./.anyone can tell, because the amount of effort they put forth trying to convince everyone T Hill has no shot at all///well too bad keep pushing it Payton, most of WHODAT nation has your back!

 

[Alan12]

There is only one Taysom Hill, period.