Offensive Efficiency (Possible boring stats and comparison inside) (1 Viewer)

[Alaina]

Yeah not exactly sure how they are handling non-offensive points scored. You should account for them somewhere imo. Maybe subtract it from points allowed. Another thing to consider is end of game (or half) kneeling drives. Not sure if they count them or not. I went ahead and counted it as a drive in my updated numbers.

Edit: Those TDs wouldn't help the offense anyway. Only 1 non-offensive TD. KC has 3. The Rams have 2.

The link accounts for only offensive scores in % of drives ending in a score. I don't know how you'd account for so-called junk drives. The Saints have had quite a few of em this year... not just kneel downs but drives where ball control was the focus and not field position or outright scoring. Saints chewed up a lot of clock in NY, Minny and Cincy, and against the Rams and Redskins. That's more than half of their games where they've had a couple of drives where they weren't even trying to score.

 

[WhoDat_SB44]

The Saints and Chiefs are by far and beyond standouts when compared with offenses of previous eras. The Rams are comparable in their stats with other historic offenses. However, that's kind of where the line cuts off and the offenses start to look similar to offenses of a typical historic offense. I think the 2018 year is an outlier for offense, or maybe even the start of a trend where offense is much more valued past defense. Rules may have changed that, but I don't think rules can account for such a dramatic shift in just 1 years time for 3 teams. Coaching scheme and QB efficiency along with ridiculously stacked offenses of the 3 teams are probably more the culprit of these gaudy numbers put up by the Saints, Chiefs, and Rams.

Yes but then I would argue if u took that 49ers offense with Bill Walsh’s genius offensive mind with a mind of today’s offenses & rules they may be one of the best ever!

Joe Montana, Jerry Rice, John Taylor, Dwight Clark, & Roger Craig were no joke for sure! Craig was before his time in that he was a great receiver out of the backfield. Oh and they had Steve Young backing up Montana as well. They had 2 hall of fame QBs on the same team at the same time! In today’s NFL he would of likely been using them both at the same time cause of Young’s running ability.

 

[Alaina]

Yes but then I would argue if u took that 49ers offense with Bill Walsh’s genius offensive mind with a mind of today’s offenses & rules they may be one of the best ever!

Joe Montana, Jerry Rice, John Taylor, Dwight Clark, & Roger Craig were no joke for sure! Craig was before his time in that he was a great receiver out of the backfield. Oh and they had Steve Young backing up Montana as well. They had 2 hall of fame QBs on the same team at the same time! In today’s NFL he would of likely been using them both at the same time cause of Young’s running ability.

I can't find per drive statistics, but the 84 9ers weren't even the highest scoring team in the league. The Dolphins put up an amazing 32.1 points per game. The 9ers were second with 29.7 which is very impressive in its own right. For example, last years top scoring team was the Rams at 29.9 points per game.

I think the NFL is a league in which one side of the ball may evolve, and the other is forced to catch up. We may be in an evolutionary point right now. Sure, rule changes have some ability to change the dynamic between favoring the pass vs the run on offense, but honestly I don't think rule changes alone have a profound effect on scoring. For example, the 1998 season had 2 teams that were averaging over 30 points per game, with a league wide average of 21.3. By comparison, the 2017 season saw the league wide average at 21.7 ppg.

We also have to account for relative talent available in the league at any given time. If we have a few years worth of weak drafts for defenses, but amazing drafts for offenses, you're going to have a lag that will follow offenses. There's really no way to account for that without some very intensive data analytics that I doubt anybody would want to do around here (at least not for free, lol).

 

[sbadeaux]

Yes but then I would argue if u took that 49ers offense with Bill Walsh’s genius offensive mind with a mind of today’s offenses & rules they may be one of the best ever!

Joe Montana, Jerry Rice, John Taylor, Dwight Clark, & Roger Craig were no joke for sure! Craig was before his time in that he was a great receiver out of the backfield. Oh and they had Steve Young backing up Montana as well. They had 2 hall of fame QBs on the same team at the same time! In today’s NFL he would of likely been using them both at the same time cause of Young’s running ability.

What you have to remember is as time passes as with anything things become more complex. I’m not sure that exact system would work as well today as it did then. There are certainly Teams that run avariation of the offense but there is no team that runs anything that resembles the exact West Coast offense that we remember the 49ers running. Defenses are much more complex players are bigger they are faster and they are stronger. Other than rice you take some of their receivers and they may not have been as affective today given the fact that player types have changed over time

 

[WhoDat_SB44]

I can't find per drive statistics, but the 84 9ers weren't even the highest scoring team in the league. The Dolphins put up an amazing 32.1 points per game. The 9ers were second with 29.7 which is very impressive in its own right. For example, last years top scoring team was the Rams at 29.9 points per game.

I think the NFL is a league in which one side of the ball may evolve, and the other is forced to catch up. We may be in an evolutionary point right now. Sure, rule changes have some ability to change the dynamic between favoring the pass vs the run on offense, but honestly I don't think rule changes alone have a profound effect on scoring. For example, the 1998 season had 2 teams that were averaging over 30 points per game, with a league wide average of 21.3. By comparison, the 2017 season saw the league wide average at 21.7 ppg.

We also have to account for relative talent available in the league at any given time. If we have a few years worth of weak drafts for defenses, but amazing drafts for offenses, you're going to have a lag that will follow offenses. There's really no way to account for that without some very intensive data analytics that I doubt anybody would want to do around here (at least not for free, lol).

Yes but they also had one of the best defenses at that time, so they didn’t need to score a ton of points like today. They were hardly ever down by two touchdowns, so they didn’t have to throw it a ton. The offense was way different then as well. Fullback Tom Rathman finished his NFL career with 2,020 rushing yards, 320 receptions for 2,684 yards with a total of 34 touchdowns. You barely see too many fullbacks much less any doing anything close to those kind of numbers.

You didn’t see teams lined up in shotgun throwing it almost every down, so you can’t compare the offenses or defenses of yester year to the advances in offense & the rules today. If Ronnie Lott played today he probably wouldn’t had been as good cause he use to abuse receivers going over the middle. With the way he hit, he would get flagged or ejected every game if he played the same way he did back then.

Ask any old school QB like Young, Marino, or Elway and I bet they would say I could only imagine how many yards & TDs I would of thrown for in today’s game. If Mahomes stays healthy and has a HoF career he will shatter all records cause he got to play the his whole career in this current way of offensive football.

 

[Bartyboy]

Another point I might add to Saints great Offensive stats is TOP.
Saints are over 33 minutes and their clock eating 8 minute drives are wearing out defenses.
Even that 8:30 minute drive with no score went a long way to helping Saints win.

 

[Alaina]

Yes but they also had one of the best defenses at that time, so they didn’t need to score a ton of points like today. They were hardly ever down by two touchdowns, so they didn’t have to throw it a ton. The offense was way different then as well. Fullback Tom Rathman finished his NFL career with 2,020 rushing yards, 320 receptions for 2,684 yards with a total of 34 touchdowns. You barely see too many fullbacks much less any doing anything close to those kind of numbers.

You didn’t see teams lined up in shotgun throwing it almost every down, so you can’t compare the offenses or defenses of yester year to the advances in offense & the rules today. If Ronnie Lott played today he probably wouldn’t had been as good cause he use to abuse receivers going over the middle. With the way he hit, he would get flagged or ejected every game if he played the same way he did back then.

Ask any old school QB like Young, Marino, or Elway and I bet they would say I could only imagine how many yards & TDs I would of thrown for in today’s game. If Mahomes stays healthy and has a HoF career he will shatter all records cause he got to play the his whole career in this current way of offensive football.

What I'm saying though, is that even if Mahomes stays healthy, chances are that defenses will adapt. They'll draft players for defense with specific talents to counter his style of play, at least minimally. There are always spikes in offensive production and then declines. The 2017 season in terms of PPG is very comparable with even some seasons in the 80's.

Rule dynamics and evolution of the playbook may change whether offenses favor the run vs the pass, but the production they give out is not significantly different just because of rule change that favors the pass. Even though Ronnie Lott was able to destroy WR's in the middle of the field, offenses back then still had the ability to put up 30 points a game... they were just doing it in different ways. Offensive and defensive planning also depends on the talent pool that's in the NFL on any given season. Not to mention a very unpredictable variable, injuries, plays a role in the productivity of offenses or defenses as a whole.

Perhaps you see QB's lined up in the shotgun more often now because throwing technique has improved since then. Or maybe blitzing schemes are more effective today vs 30 years ago. There's a number of variables that could explain the differences of offenses today vs offenses 30 years ago.

 

[Alaina]

Another point I might add to Saints great Offensive stats is TOP.
Saints are over 33 minutes and their clock eating 8 minute drives are wearing out defenses.
Even that 8:30 minute drive with no score went a long way to helping Saints win.

Also, the Saints own TOP per drive at 3:12 average drive time. Next best is the Titans at 3:02 which is a pretty considerable difference. It's possible that such a high mark can be owed to the fact that they've had numerous drives where their desire is to eat as much clock as possible. They also have the best starting field position in the league by starting at their own 32.8 yard line, which works to their favor. I don't know how they manage to do that because their return average is not all that good. Perhaps it's the fact that opposing offenses have failed to convert a 4th down against the Saints 8 times this year, which is more than any team in the league.

 

[lapaz]

The Saints and Chiefs are by far and beyond standouts when compared with offenses of previous eras. The Rams are comparable in their stats with other historic offenses. However, that's kind of where the line cuts off and the offenses start to look similar to offenses of a typical historic offense. I think the 2018 year is an outlier for offense, or maybe even the start of a trend where offense is much more valued past defense. Rules may have changed that, but I don't think rules can account for such a dramatic shift in just 1 years time for 3 teams. Coaching scheme and QB efficiency along with ridiculously stacked offenses of the 3 teams are probably more the culprit of these gaudy numbers put up by the Saints, Chiefs, and Rams.

I'm jealous of the Rams and Chiefs because they have young QBs, so they could conceivably keep this up for 15 more years. We have about 3 to 5 years left at best, unless we can find someone to mostly fill Brees' shoes.

 

[Stalwart385]

I'm jealous of the Rams and Chiefs because they have young QBs, so they could conceivably keep this up for 15 more years. We have about 3 to 5 years left at best, unless we can find someone to mostly fill Brees' shoes.

Without looking at the numbers, since 2006 I'd bet we've had the best offense in NFL history over any team in a similar span. It will take a lot of consistency and luck to match what the Saints have put up. Maybe a changing of the guard but certainly not jealousy to me.