Offensive line woes? Could it be? (1 Viewer)

MrVoodoo

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I can't help but watch these games and feel that one of the major reasons why we pass more than run is due to the offensive line's inability to block.

WHAT?!?!

This offensive line that keeps Drew safer than most every QB in the NFL!?!!


Yep

I just don't see them opening up running lanes, no matter how much time they give Drew in the pocket, they don't seem to be doing as much as they could to make holes for Duece and Reggie... I think that is the biggest reason we pass more in the red zone than we run... if we could get them opening up the lanes in the red zone, we might not would have lost last week and we could probably dominate any team in the NFL... I think if we were able to do that SP would call more running plays, but he seems to go with the strengths of the team.

or then again am I just crazy?!?! Did someone drop something into my drink this morning?!
 
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Marlboro Man

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I have never seen an offensive line allow defensive players into the backfield before the running back even gets the handoff like the Saints line. They have got to be the worst run blocking line in football.
 

SaintJ

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I wouldn't call it a "woe"; my own take is that they're already well-coached and smart, but they're not classic maulers, and the tricky techniques of run-blocking actually take more time to co-ordinate than pass blocking.

Moreover, we don't have classic maulers up front, and Faine is strictly a finesse blocker who can get overwhelmed at the point of attack, which is why the Browns wanted to replace him. Outside the 10, you can compensate, but inside the 5 where the DL is manning up on all your OL, he's on his own. In addition, none of our TEs is that classic blocking road-grader TE some teams like to have at least one of on the roster (see Hall, Lamont).

It's not like we haven't been able to run at all inside the 5, but our success hasn't been what we'd like it to be.

As far as throwing, again, all the TE are journeymen, and we haven't thus far been able to run that fade pattern that we've watched the league's other 31 teams run for years. I'm hoping the Brees-to-Colston becomes as common a highlight as "this year's Viking QB-to-Carter" was in the 90s, but nothing so far.

Here's to our fine coaching staff figuring this out over the last six weeks, starting Sunday.
 

St. David

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They only thing I would like to see changes on the line is to have Holland on the line but I don't see a reason to bench Neisbed or Evans.
 

Rugger

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Totally disagree. I used to think the same thing. I thought our line was good against the pass, but poor against the run, but what is Deuce's YPC right now? I think he is around 4.

I watched the NFL network and Marshal was breaking down film on Reggie. The holes were there, but he kept looking for the outside run. last game he started hitting the hole beter and was chewing up yards.

I don't think they are a great run blocking olines, but they are making hole. Also remember the amount of turn around this oline has had this offseason. All five of them are either rookies or first year starters at their position. What they are doing is no short of amazing right now.
 

SaintJ

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I have never seen an offensive line allow defensive players into the backfield before the running back even gets the handoff like the Saints line. They have got to be the worst run blocking line in football.
*sigh*

Once again getting out my spray can of Hyperbole-B-Gone.....

NFL yards per carry; this is the company we keep. Not great, but I am willing to opine that this number will get better, based on our early force-feeding of Bush and his learning curve:

28 Chicago 3.5
29 New Orleans 3.4
30 Baltimore 3.4
31 Cleveland 3.3
32 Arizona 2.9

TDs are a little more interesting, rendered more relevant because this started as a red zone discussion (I left in YPC just for fun):

7 Denver 4.5 9
Tennessee 4.3 9
NY Jets 3.6 9
Indianapolis 3.9 9
Cincinnati 4.0 9
Detroit 4.0 9
13 Philadelphia 4.9 8
Washington 4.4 8
New Orleans 3.4 8

16 San Francisco 4.8 7
NY Giants 4.7 7
Chicago 3.5 7
Baltimore 3.4 7
20 Atlanta 5.6 6

I thought the Atlanta TD rank was pretty interesting, given their league-leading YPC and YPG totals; I think if you dumped all of Vick's rushing totals into their passing yardage, where it belongs if you want to link "rushing attack" versus "passing attack", you'd get a better picture of how the really run the ball.

FWIW, we are 26th in YPG.

Room for improvement? Absolutely? Mandatory to get more effective for us to be truly great? Absolutely. "Worst" in either the long- or short-term? Spare me.

Like Junior told Tony, next time come heavy or don't come at all.
 

Pure Energy

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I can't help but watch these games and feel that one of the major reasons why we pass more than run is due to the offensive line's inability to block.
Right now the average is 385 Pass to 276 rushing attempts so basically a 60/40 pass to rush ratio.

Let's try a 5 Why Analysis. In order to perform, you ask Why 5 times and you should have the root cause to the problem.

1) Why do the Saints pass more than they rush?
A) The Coaches call more pass plays than running plays.

2) Why do the Coaches call more pass plays than running plays?
A) They believe a pass play is a better option than a running play.

3) Why is a pass play a better option than a run play?
A) They need to gain bigger chunks of yardage in shorter period of time.

4) Why do they need to gain bigger chunks of yardage quickly?
A) They're trailing and trying to catch-up.

- - - - We can stop there since that answers the reason for the playcalling; however, just for fun let's go one more- - - - - - -

5) Why are they trailing and playing catch-up?
A) Too many turnovers leading to opponent scoring and lost socring opportunities for Saints.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - End Five Why's - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
So let's check and see if the answer to #4 makes sense.

When AHEAD Bress has passed 125 times for 907 yards and when behind 204 times for 1,764 yards so that makes sense.

You might also want to reconsider the whole Rush to Pass average and consider the bulk of Reggie's 61 receptions as a long handoffs. Why? Because his average reception is 6.7 yds/catch and his average Yards After Catch (YAC) is 6.2 yds/catch; in other words on average when he gets the ball he's only 1.5 feet in front of the line of scrimmage.

So if we move 50 of Reggie's receptions (~80%) to rushes, that would make the ratio 335 passes to 326 rushing attempts so basically a 50/50 pass to rush ratio.

Conclusion: The Offensive Line isn't limiting the play calling.
 

bclemms

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We don't know if our offensive line can run block, they haven't got the chance. If you watched the first Tampa game, the Philly game and the Bengals game you would see they were blowing guys off the line. If you watched the Cleveland, Green Bay and Ravens game you would see they were getting pushed in the backfield. If you watched the pittsburg game, Falcons game and Carolina game you wouldn't see much either way.
 

fr3sh

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Totally disagree. I used to think the same thing. I thought our line was good against the pass, but poor against the run, but what is Deuce's YPC right now? I think he is around 4.

I watched the NFL network and Marshal was breaking down film on Reggie. The holes were there, but he kept looking for the outside run. last game he started hitting the hole beter and was chewing up yards.

I don't think they are a great run blocking olines, but they are making hole. Also remember the amount of turn around this oline has had this offseason. All five of them are either rookies or first year starters at their position. What they are doing is no short of amazing right now.
Exactly!!! J Brown, first year at LT. Nesbit, first year as LG. Jeff Faine, always been a center. J Evans, rookie. J Stinchcomb, always been a RT but this year he is finely healthy and his first year starting.
 

catch22

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I can't help but watch these games and feel that one of the major reasons why we pass more than run is due to the offensive line's inability to block.

WHAT?!?!

This offensive line that keeps Drew safer than most every QB in the NFL!?!!


Yep

I just don't see them opening up running lanes, no matter how much time they give Drew in the pocket, they don't seem to be doing as much as they could to make holes for Duece and Reggie... I think that is the biggest reason we pass more in the red zone than we run... if we could get them opening up the lanes in the red zone, we might not would have lost last week and we could probably dominate any team in the NFL... I think if we were able to do that SP would call more running plays, but he seems to go with the strengths of the team.

or then again am I just crazy?!?! Did someone drop something into my drink this morning?!
I think your totally wrong on your observation. The O line is playing very good, not great but good. Very few sacks this season and they are doing a much better job of run blocking too. I believe this will be a strength of ours of years to come.
 

Danchrism

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4) Why do they need to gain bigger chunks of yardage quickly?
A) They're trailing and trying to catch-up.
Yeah, that big 3-0 deficit we'll be facing after the opening drive = ABANDON SHIP!
 

meily

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They seem to block better on draws and trap plays more so than straight up blocking, just something that needs to be worked on, its most of the O-lines strong point (run blocking) guys like brown and Evans.......well I guess that's only 2 but I guess those other players most notably faine and stinch who will probably be here 4 awhile will just have to get better or get better technique (which those 2 are known to have pretty good technique) but we gotta be better and more dominate at what we do best in the running game.
 

Nevimeister

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It's no secret, we need a run mauling LG

It's interesting that no one seems to have noticed that Frank Gore's gaudy numbers corrolate to the time Larry Allen came back into the lineup, why Chester Taylor can look like an all star running behind Steve Hutchinson, why Pittsburgh's running game has been so good behind Faneca and Kansas City's behind Brian Waters (all LGs)

I would love to draft Justin Blalock in the 1st round. Failing that I'd like to sign Vince Manuwai in free agency. Eric Steinbach is a quality guard but I think our line would be too light pairing a sub 300lb guard with Jeff Faine next to him
 

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