Rand Paul headed to Canada for hernia surgery (1 Viewer)

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DavidM

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I suppose it’s hypocritical for a slave to eat food from their master because that’s condoning slavery.

Look, Unfortunately, for you, it’s not at all hypocritical what Paul did.
He paid for a service with a great Doctor. Sure, he used tax payer roads to get there, etc...

It changes nothing. The man routinely does free medical charity work, as did his father who also refused and returned his government pension.

I’d love to see Bernie Sanders do any of that. Instead, his violent democratic rhetoric caused a democrat to give Paul years of physical and mental agony.

Congrats
 

N.O.Bronco

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How bout the much less regulated lazik surgeries. Prices are advertised and they continue to drop. Completely oppsosite of other regulated insured surgeries and health care.
I’ll start by mentioning once again this will be yet another conversation you are trying to start with me while having abandoned our past ones. Climate Change and our discussion on China being the most recent examples.

And while based on past interactions I have serious doubts on the sincerity of this point, I'll go ahead and bite anyways because this incidentally is a good way to illustrate the underlying reasoning for what I said.

So lets start with a simple thought experiment by comparing two types of surgeries so maybe you catch on as well, your example, Lasik, and lets just pick stopping internal bleeding after a car crash.

What are some notable differences in the decision-making process for these two services?

The obvious one is duress. It's hard to make informed decisions under duress. Another obvious differing factor is level of knowledge, you or I are not doctors, and even if we were we would not have the tools to make an informed decision about what needs to be done to repair our bodies after a car wreck. A third differing factor is agency. If I am being escorted from the scene of an accident I am not in a place to make a value judgement about price, doctor rating, or hospital preference, in fact, that option isn't even an option if you are escorted in an ambulance.

Long story longer, the presumption in economics when it comes to decision-making is that they will follow the rational decision-making model. I.E. decisions are made with symmetrical information(both the buyer and seller are relatively equally informed and knowledgeable about the product/service they are selling/buying), the person is of sound, stable mind(not being coerced, in a panic etc.), and that the good or service and the buyer will have the time and capacity to follow an ordered, rational,decision-making process that works through and analyzes the pro's and con's of alternatives against one another. There is also the presumption that the goods and services you are deciding on are relatively elastic and non-critical.

All of those things are things that are often not capable of being fully satisfied in a lot of healthcare. Which leads to market failures. Is that shortness of breath a temporary issue or a sign of something much deeper? Is this particular pill the only thing that can keep you alive? Are there even any other qualified specialty doctors within 100 miles? I am concussed and bleeding in the back of an ambulance, what to do?

But this isn't one size fits all, there are plenty of places in the healthcare space where normal market forces can reasonably operate. Which is pretty much in areas of elective and cosmetic products and services. But these distinctions are often things I find libertarians and people like yourself look over and you just can't if you want to make an informed decision or opinion about healthcare economics. Because it is a bad assumption borne out by the results that the market for a life changing drug or decisions made under duress and/or poor information is going to end up operating efficiently and effectively like a normal market for something like Lasik or tennis shoes. Which is why no system has managed to work without a lot of subsidization, regulation, and intervention.





TLDR version:

Markets almost always require a rational-decision making process to function properly and much of the healthcare space lacks that. Lasik and other cosmetic surgeries are the exception to that.
 
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N.O.Bronco

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No offense, but even I"m not reading all that.
No offense, but it's not meant for you.

Onthurday asked a question about Lasik and healthcare pricing, the answer is not a simple one to give.

If it's not something that interests you, that is fine. But I made a good faith effort to explain the reasoning for what he challenged me with.
 

Goatman Saint

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Saint_Ward

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No offense, but it's not meant for you.

Onthurday asked a question about Lasik and healthcare pricing, the answer is not a simple one to give.

If it's not something that interests you, that is fine. But I made a good faith effort to explain the reasoning for what he challenged me with.
It was a joke. That if I won't read it, he won't either.
 

N.O.Bronco

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It was a joke. That if I won't read it, he won't either.
Sorry, I honestly thought you were just kind of being a dick haha, It's still sort of earlyish, my bad.

....But you are probably right. Still, I did want to illustrate where I was coming from and as anyone knows brevity is not a skill I posses.

Though I did create a TLDR edit since that is a lot, even by my standards.
 
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crosswatt

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I suppose it’s hypocritical for a slave to eat food from their master because that’s condoning slavery.
Slaves didn't have a choice in the matter, as they were the equivlent of livestock, and would be forced to consume enough food to perform their required tasks.

Look, Unfortunately, for you, it’s not at all hypocritical what Paul did.
It is hypocritical.
He paid for a service with a great Doctor.
Paul isn't paying, he is using the government to force his neighbor to pay.

Sure, he used tax payer roads to get there, etc...
He also used a practice outside of the country that has greatly benefited from universal health care, the very thing that he rails against. That is the very definition of hypocrisy.

It changes nothing. The man routinely does free medical charity work, as did his father who also refused and returned his government pension.
Good for them. Has literally zero to do with whether or not he acted in a hypocritical fashion. Which he did.

I’d love to see Bernie Sanders do any of that.
Sanders isn't a doctor, so he can't. Which was a really stupid comparison choice, when there are medical professionals on the democratic side in both houses of congress.
Instead, his violent democratic rhetoric caused a democrat to give Paul years of physical and mental agony.
Congrats
.
The assault was over a longstanding disagreement, not politically motivated.
 
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