Refs blew double pass (2 Viewers)

[srcampbell]

An Illegal Forward Pass Penalty is called when a player throws the ball forward once they are past the line of scrimmage. This can be the quarterback or any other player. This penalty can also be called if two forward passes are thrown on one play, even though they are both behind the line of scrimmage.


Number of Yards
There is a 5 yard penalty from the spot of the foul and the offense loses a down in both the NFL and College Football.
Instead of an 8 yard gain, the Bucs should have been penalized 5 yards from Where Brady threw the second pass which was about 7 yards behind the line. That was 20 yards of field position against the Rams. Between not knowing that rule and the early whistle on the Brady fumble pass this was a fiasco for this crew. And it has nothing to do with race!

Firstly, this was very well explained. However, I was taken aback by your last sentence. If the call had nothing to do with race then why include it in your post? There is no need to prove anything. We all understand that a bad call is a bad call.

Edit: Actually, the call was correct.

 

[Saint Kamara]

It's Brady, bruh.

 

[SweetT]

I’m just curious if this is something y’all know from years of watching football and thinking it’s to be expected, or if it’s legitimately part of an official’s job to explain penalty acceptance results to the coaching staff? I would be curious to anyone that has been in the profession at some level.

It’s not like Madden where yards and down are spelled out for you at the click of a button. Maybe they went to the sideline, McVay said, “nah we’ll take 4th” and instead of saying “hey bro you should accept this”, they just said “okay buddy”. I am not meaning to make excuses for the crew if they didn’t do their job. I just am curious to whether this is actually their job.

If not, and even if so really, we should be beating up McVay for not coming out of his seat for the 20 yards of field position. You’d think a guy with a magical football memory like they cite him having would remember a loss of down rule.

There are times when you can see an official talking to a coach bc the coach needs a thorough explanation of what is transpiring during a game. Many times rewatching NFL docu-series (like NFL’s greatest games), they will show an official explaining things to a coach and the microphone sound is amplified. They don’t tell a coach to accept or decline a penalty, but they explain in detail to a coach (if the coach needs explaining), and then the coach decides from there.

 

[LiterOCola]

Brady can't get credit for two pass completions on one play. The ball should have been brought back to where he tried to throw his second pass since the penalty was declined. But if it was accepted, it should have been 5 yards father back and a loss of down.

It was the wrong call even though it was declined.

I’m willing to admit I could be wrong, but I don’t think this is the case.

I’ve been reading the relevant sections, and there’s nothing I could find in the rulebook that states only the first of two forward passes count. It’s enforcing the penalty that cancels the second pass. If the other side declines the penalty, both passes happen.

At least that’s my reading of the rules. I’ll happily admit defeat if a section of the rulebook contradicts me.

 

[GTSaint]

Oh, so maybe this is one QB record that Brady actually will keep.

Most Pass Completions in a Single Play: 2 Tom Brady 11/23/2020

 

[nolaswede]

Can’t remember exactly when it happened, however, when the Rams got called for the first delay of game, there was still 1 second left on the game clock. Goff looked really surprised, and no explanation was given by the commentators.

 

[SaintStephen1]

What is a Illegal Forward Pass Penalty?
An Illegal Forward Pass Penalty is called when a player throws the ball forward once they are past the line of scrimmage. This can be the quarterback or any other player. This penalty can also be called if two forward passes are thrown on one play, even though they are both behind the line of scrimmage.


Number of Yards
There is a 5 yard penalty from the spot of the foul and the offense loses a down in both the NFL and College Football.
This is what I quoted in the original post which I’m now confused on because as one poster points out, the rule book doesn’t indicate loss of down. If that is the case why should a team benefit from throwing a second forward pass? Let’s assume the 2nd completion picked up the first down, then the Bucs would have had a repeat of the 3rd down and would have benefitted from throwing the illegal second pass. It doesn’t make sense that it is not loss of down.

 

[HogsNSaints]

Can’t remember exactly when it happened, however, when the Rams got called for the first delay of game, there was still 1 second left on the game clock. Goff looked really surprised, and no explanation was given by the commentators.

I think the TV clock didn’t match the field clock. I noticed that too on the broadcast but you could see the TB defense jumping at double zeroes to alert the officials.

 

[SaintStephen1]

Firstly, this was very well explained. However, I was taken aback by your last sentence. If the call had nothing to do with race then why include it in your post? There is no need to prove anything. We all understand that a bad call

Because there are posters on here that would have immediately called me racist. It’s been that kind of year.

 

[GTSaint]

What is a Illegal Forward Pass Penalty?
An Illegal Forward Pass Penalty is called when a player throws the ball forward once they are past the line of scrimmage. This can be the quarterback or any other player. This penalty can also be called if two forward passes are thrown on one play, even though they are both behind the line of scrimmage.


Number of Yards
There is a 5 yard penalty from the spot of the foul and the offense loses a down in both the NFL and College Football.
This is what I quoted in the original post which I’m now confused on because as one poster points out, the rule book doesn’t indicate loss of down. If that is the case why should a team benefit from throwing a second forward pass? Let’s assume the 2nd completion picked up the first down, then the Bucs would have had a repeat of the 3rd down and would have benefitted from throwing the illegal second pass. It doesn’t make sense that it is not loss of down.

I agree. For example, 4th and short. Throw a screen pass. If the runner sees he is not going to make the first, throw it to the wide receiver 3 yards down the field. They have to accept the penalty, so you get another chance. Doesn't really make sense.

 

[St. Pike]

If I am not mistaken, the refs blew the whistle before the play was over. I am not sure why they did that. I did not see a quotes rule where the ball is ruled dead at the point of completion. It seems strange the rule book would allow a circumvention of the rules by not having a loss of down as well.

I didn't know it was an all "black" crew until after the game. It seems like a chessy PR move by the NFL.


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[black_floyd]

More like refs blow double arse.

 

[Bill]

I’m willing to admit I could be wrong, but I don’t think this is the case.

I’ve been reading the relevant sections, and there’s nothing I could find in the rulebook that states only the first of two forward passes count. It’s enforcing the penalty that cancels the second pass. If the other side declines the penalty, both passes happen.

At least that’s my reading of the rules. I’ll happily admit defeat if a section of the rulebook contradicts me.

You're obviously right. But the Bucs lost. I don't even care about the rule anymore.
Since the rulebook says they did it right, it's obvious that the only person who got the call wrong was McVay for not knowing that accepting the penalty came with a loss of down.
I guess he just wanted to give Brady the record for the most pass completions on one play.
I'm my 53 years of watching pro football I have never seen or heard of that happening before.

 

[Fanincowboyland]

You're obviously right. But the Bucs lost. I don't even care about the rule anymore.

That's my thought but I think that's because I missed the game.

 

[Merl]

You're obviously right. But the Bucs lost. I don't even care about the rule anymore.
Since the rulebook says they did it right, it's obvious that the only person who got the call wrong was McVay for not knowing that accepting the penalty came with a loss of down.
I guess he just wanted to give Brady the record for the most pass completions on one play.
I'm my 53 years of watching pro football I have never seen or heard of that happening before.

In this case it did not include loss of down.

From the rule book posted on page 2.

Penalties:

(a) For a forward pass from beyond the line: Loss of down a 5 yards from the spot of the pass. See 14-8-2. See S.N. 3 below.

(b) For a second forward pass from behind the line, or for a forward pass that was thrown after the ball was returned behind the line: Loss of 5 yards.

In this play option (b) is the relevant rule. There is no mention of "loss of down". That means the both the officials and McVay made the correct decision.