Salary Cap ‘Hell’ has Come and Gone for the New Orleans Saints (1 Viewer)

[Formermember]

Except they aren't "facts."

No one took personal shots at you either.

I'm looking at the division. Julio Jones is the best singular talent but the Falcons are not even close as a WR group. The Panthers 2nd best WR is Ted Ginn, who Snead caught 250 more yards than last year. The Bucs have Mike Evans and an old Vincent Jackson (who managed all of 600 yards last year).

The fact that you can't even bring yourself to admit that our 3-deep WR group is the best in the division means I'm not dealing with someone who's willing to concede the obvious.

Yes, you did. Fact is we have a better QB1. Period. Other than that, we will discuss after Sunday and week after week. BTW, you didn't mention their running backs???

 

[guillermo]

I don't expect the saints to be players for star players in free agency. Available cap should be used on building depth by bringing over average players who are signing their second contract.

Big contracts are for cornerstone players, and those you draft and develop. They are just too expensive to acquire.

Let's see how are cap structure is per unit:

Quarterbacks, right now with Drew's new contract we are right on budget. We are not overspending and actually we can save if Grayson wins the backup job.

Runners, I think we are overspending with the salaries of Ingram and Spiller. We are losing CJ's contract but we need a reliable speedy option from the backfield.

Receivers, we are underspending. We only have one bid contract in Fleener's (a bad one in my opinion) but we will need 2 or 3 high ones in the future. We will need to bite the bullet, pick a couple of contracts to give and let another go, with a reliable substitute already on the roster.

Offensive line, we are there with two big contracts, we may have another o very the market for a right tackle and we will have to live with market value guards.

Defensive line. Right now we are a little underspending. Cam's contract is high but Kruger and Fairley have reasonable ones. Here we will need to save because I can see more spending in Rankins and a drafted pass rusher who is not yet on roster.

Linebackers, we are fine here with no big numbers and the need to develop a young playmaker who should be a building block.

Defensive backs, we are underspending here, Byrd's salary is not justifiable and we need to build depth at cornerback. We can't rely on unexperience. Breaux is a sure bet for a big contract and I am curious on the money for Vaccaro's second deal (to me, it should be above average, but not top money). Here we have to earmark money to buy experience.

Special teams. I love Morestead but I think his salary is to high for a guy with such a few touches. I hope we can keep it long term with less salary. I'll sign him for 5 years but for less money.

The way I see it, it would be stupid to use the money we have trying to find the easy solution, the way we did with Jairus Byrd and tried to do with Josh Norman.

I just want for our team to learn the lesson and continue having "dead salary guy" as one of the top earners on the team.

 

[BoNcHiE]

I'm also skeptical about the Saints salary cap problems being over. Isn't it true that the Saints currently lead the league in dead money for 2017? And if we cut Byrd in the offseason that adds another 8 million in dead money.

Byrd could add to it. I'm rooting for otherwise though.

Yes, we lead the league in dead money for 2017, but that's because we made several cuts that usually come after the season. Other teams won't make their moves until later.

I'm looking at the lineup of players with the possibility of dead money left on the roster (of any substantial amount, i.e. 2+m).

Strief has 2.2m possible dead, but I'd bet he plays in 2017 at least as a backup and retires in 2018. He's still a good starter this year.

That's really it. Ellerbe probably is gone, but his contract voids without playing 80% of the snaps (he also has almost no dead money anyway).

Unlike past years, I'm struggling to find 5-6 guys who are going to get cut and stack up dead money. It's really Byrd or nothing.

 

[Formermember]

If we stop rolling the dice on big money FA's, I think we're fine.

We need to do it like Fairley, Hightower, Wilson, Robertson. Sign them cheap, evaluate them for a year, then make a decision on re-signing them.

Mr Benson, go back to bed. j/k

 

[BoNcHiE]

Yes, you did.

Saying that you are sandbagging is not a "personal shot."

Fact is we have a better QB1. Period. Other than that, we will discuss after Sunday and week after week. BTW, you didn't mention their running backs???

Nah, I'm not gonna waste my time with someone who thinks it's a fact that every position on the team needs upgrading except Brees. It's pointless. We are just too far apart.

 

[bobad]

Mr Benson, go back to bed. j/k

Is this the old "Benson is a tightwad" meme resurfacing?

 

[BoNcHiE]

How could we have been in salary cap hell when our record speaks that we have always had a full deck to work with?

What kind of talent could we honestly bring in with $26m that would have given us a better record?

/sarcasmoff

Maybe ask the Browns, Titans, Raiders, 49ers, Jaguars, Redskins, Dolphins, Buccaneers, Eagles, and Giants.

That's the top 10 teams in available cap space last season. All finished with losing records.

Dead money sucks (although it's more complicated then people make it out to be). But let's not pretend cap space = success either. Big spending in FA hasn't done jack crap for us the past 5-6 years.

 

[El Caliente]

I'm also skeptical about the Saints salary cap problems being over. Isn't it true that the Saints currently lead the league in dead money for 2017? And if we cut Byrd in the offseason that adds another 8 million in dead money.

Yes, we lead the league, and like Bonchi says, we aren't done. While we hope Byrd improves, if he doesn't he will be cut. But then you also have to consider, we didn't count on cutting, Gillet, Browner, Spiller, etc. we counted on them being here for a while. That said, we might be looking at cuts like those happening again this offseason. We can't say it will happen, or it wont, but If I am a betting man, I would bet our dead cap jumping another $6M+.

 

[Formermember]

Is this the old "Benson is a tightwad" meme resurfacing?

that's it. good get.

 

[BoNcHiE]

Yes, we lead the league, and like Bonchi says, we aren't done. While we hope Byrd improves, if he doesn't he will be cut. But then you also have to consider, we didn't count on cutting, Gillet, Browner, Spiller, etc. we counted on them being here for a while. That said, we might be looking at cuts like those happening again this offseason. We can't say it will happen, or it wont, but If I am a betting man, I would bet our dead cap jumping another $6M+.

If it does, that's still less dead money then the Patriots and Panthers carried last year. I hope Byrd stays, because we need a good safety, but it'll all depend on how he does this year. Maybe he'll take a pay cut if he's decent this year.

And when you have all your major talent already under contract through 2017 + 30m in cap space to spend (I'm counting Ellerbe's contract being voided), dead money isn't going to be an excuse in 2017. Win or go home.

 

[El Caliente]

Maybe ask the Browns, Titans, Raiders, 49ers, Jaguars, Redskins, Dolphins, Buccaneers, Eagles, and Giants.

That's the top 10 teams in available cap space last season. All finished with losing records.

Dead money sucks (although it's more complicated then people make it out to be). But let's not pretend cap space = success either. Big spending in FA hasn't done jack crap for us the past 5-6 years.

What if I just ask
2015
Bengals (1)
Packers (2)
Broncos (3)
Jets (6)
Vikings (7)
Cardinals (10)

2016
Bengals (1)
Packers (5)
Cardinals (6)
Vikes (7)
or Jets (10)
NFL Salary Cap Space | Over The Cap
Those teams made the playoffs last year, and finished with the least dead cap space (that is what we are talking about, dead cap space).

 

[duckjr78]

I don't see it.

We have Brees. We have the best group of WRs we've ever had. We have a top 10 TE. We have good RBs. With Evans back, the OL looks to once again be top 10.

On defense we have as much DL talent as we've had (on paper, but injuries have cost us) since 2009. We have the best LBing Corp we've had since 2009. We have decent safeties. CB is thin, but it's entirely due to injuries, not an inability to sign people.

I'm trying to see this massive lack of talent we have. We are young, but you have to be young at some point before you can grow into a mature team.

The problem with this team is that being so young, they've got to learn to play a full 60 minutes, namely on defense. That's a big monkey on their backs. The talent is there.

I've been banging this drum since training camp. This team will compete for 2 more Super Bowl berths before Brees retires. There is that much talent. These injuries and mistakes don't worry me because this year was always about learning to win, not going deep into the playoffs.

 

[El Caliente]

If it does, that's still less dead money then the Patriots and Panthers carried last year. I hope Byrd stays, because we need a good safety, but it'll all depend on how he does this year. Maybe he'll take a pay cut if he's decent this year.

And when you have all your major already talent under contract through 2017 + 30m in cap space to spend (I'm counting Ellerbe's contract being voided), dead money isn't going to be an excuse in 2017. Win or go home.

Thats what I am eluding to when I say we will have something come up that will cause us to cut somebody (poor production, off field issues, health). We thought we had ample talent signed to nice contracts, and then stuff happened, and we didn't.

But I will hope you are right and we aren't cutting major talent at the end of the year.

 

[BoNcHiE]

What if I just ask
2015
Bengals (1)
Packers (2)
Broncos (3)
Jets (6)
Vikings (7)
Cardinals (10)

2016
Bengals (1)
Packers (5)
Cardinals (6)
Vikes (7)
or Jets (10)
NFL Salary Cap Space | Over The Cap
Those teams made the playoffs last year, and finished with the least dead cap space (that is what we are talking about, dead cap space).

You insinuated we'd of had a better record had we went on a spending spree. It just doesn't always work out that way. It's worked out the opposite for us the past 4 years.

 

[Formermember]

Saying that you are sandbagging is not a "personal shot."



Nah, I'm not gonna waste my time with someone who thinks it's a fact that every position on the team needs upgrading except Brees. It's pointless. We are just too far apart.

Would you believe me I if told you we had a shot to trade for Greg Olsen with the Bears but PASSED and he went to the Panthers instead. We have a very passive management style. Also the recent FA signings are really more backup type signings. We are not big spenders in FA. The exception of course, was Byrd and letting a more talented safety walk