Screw the politics - it's time to bench under performers (1 Viewer)

[El Caliente]

Fleener has another 2 weeks before I go all in on my assumption that he is our next big dead money contract.

 

[DaveXA]

Heard this all last year about Spiller 2.....

The difference is Spiller was injured last year. Fleener isn't. Fleener has done well playing with other teams, and there's no reason he can't here.

He looks uncomfortable out there, and I think that stems from a lack of confidence and playing time with Brees. Brees was off target with him a few times with the passes coming in too high. But I think part of that is Fleener's routes didn't look crisp.

For some players it takes time to not only learn a system, but get comfortable with it. If he's still looking like this after the bye week, then I would consider going a different direction, but right now is entirely too soon.

 

[MSUSousaphone]

......hmmmm......so many pages in.......make remark about the OP or sift through all these pages...........option one!

So essentially we would have say our entire defense this game from the last one even though that would be horrible logic because they did great this game and then next game we can bench our entire offense for laying eggs all over NYC this week.

Send out McCown and release the practice squadders!

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk

 

[Freshcakes]

Fleener is slower than I expected. At least he can block better than graham.

He has average hands and doesn't learn the playbook well.
Hmmmm. Sounds about right for our recent signings.

What a waste. We could've had Olivier Vernon, or even josh Norman if not for wasting
Money on this clown.

 

[BCK30]

The one thing I'll give Fleener is at least he's available...the other big fish at TE available during free agency was Ladarius Green and he's not even playing right now.

 

[Freshcakes]

Its somewhat comical when you consider the STs unit for this team this year.

1. We ditched both kickers invited to camp and went with a rookie week one.
2. Benched our primary PR and KR after week 1 after a dismal preseason of fumbles.
3. Even our LS Dresher committed a penalty
4. Morestead is a stud still

What a start!

 

[rsmith2783]

......hmmmm......so many pages in.......make remark about the OP or sift through all these pages...........option one!

So essentially we would have say our entire defense this game from the last one even though that would be horrible logic because they did great this game and then next game we can bench our entire offense for laying eggs all over NYC this week.

Send out McCown and release the practice squadders!

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk

Your sarcasm has failed.

 

[rockthedox]

Where was all of this talk last week? Cadet and Fleener were the same players then but Cooks and Snead were featured. We went with a different game plan this week. I'm looking more at playcalling or Snead/Cooks/Thomas not getting open.

Things change. This isnt the same offense we ran 5-10 years ago. Last week Fleener was essentially a decoy and that worked well. We don't NEED a JG type of TE to be explosive.

Let Fleener learn the playbook while running dummy routes and throw to him a few times a game. Same with Coleman. He's good for a catch or two. Cadet will drop as many as he catches. I'm not sure why we aren't featuring Ingram like David Johnson or Leveon Bell. He's an above average pass catcher and probably best on the team right now. I'd also like to see Lasco given a shot with some of the Cadet/Hightower carries. I think he'll take that roll by the end of the season.

 

[rsmith2783]

Where was all of this talk last week? Cadet and Fleener were the same players then but Cooks and Snead were featured. We went with a different game plan this week. I'm looking more at playcalling or Snead/Cooks/Thomas not getting open.

Things change. This isnt the same offense we ran 5-10 years ago. Last week Fleener was essentially a decoy and that worked well. We don't NEED a JG type of TE to be explosive.

Let Fleener learn the playbook while running dummy routes and throw to him a few times a game. Same with Coleman. He's good for a catch or two. Cadet will drop as many as he catches. I'm not sure why we aren't featuring Ingram like David Johnson or Leveon Bell. He's an above average pass catcher and probably best on the team right now. I'd also like to see Lasco given a shot with some of the Cadet/Hightower carries. I think he'll take that roll by the end of the season.

I think we're taking this playbook thing out of context. Learning the playbook has nothing to do with catching the ball.

At the very best, I can say that a sign of not knowing the playbook for a WR is running the wrong route.
If Fleener makes those catches, no one wouldn't say anything about a playbook.

As far as using Fleener as a decoy, that only works if the person you are using can actually make a play or not.

At one point during the game, I saw Kunn motion out of the backfield and lineup as a WR. The CB lined up to defend him, but kept his eyes towards the middle of the field. He paid no attention to Kunn whatsoever.

In 06 we used Reggie as a decoy, but Reggie commanded attention because he could make a play when the ball was in his hands.

You mention featuring Ingram like Bell or Johnson, but let me ask you this: If you were the opposing DC, who would you fear motioning out of the backfield; Bell or Ingram? Heck, even Spiller or Ingram?

Our offense is going to struggle because we do not have the identity yet. We don't quite have all the weapons to be explosive, and we don't have the personnel to be effective as a ball control offense.

 

[Da Living Saint]

The difference is Spiller was injured last year. Fleener isn't. Fleener has done well playing with other teams, and there's no reason he can't here.

He looks uncomfortable out there, and I think that stems from a lack of confidence and playing time with Brees. Brees was off target with him a few times with the passes coming in too high. But I think part of that is Fleener's routes didn't look crisp.

For some players it takes time to not only learn a system, but get comfortable with it. If he's still looking like this after the bye week, then I would consider going a different direction, but right now is entirely too soon.

I disagree with this post almost entirely. Fleener was average with Indy and the same issues that he had there are the same issues we've seen in two games here. He runs lazy routes and he has sketchy hands. He couldn't assert himself over the decidedly average Dwayne Allen in Indy. I have a hard time believing that he has trouble with the playbook seeing as how he went to Stanford. I will give him sort of the benefit of the doubt since this is essentially the first time he's played with a QB who wasn't Andrew Luck.

However, it's been 3-4 months now that he's been playing/practicing with Brees. He should have this figured out by now. Let's not pretend that the amount of money they gave him doesn't play a part in the perception of him. If he was playing on a Josh Hill-style deal it'd be no big deal. He's got 3 catches in 2 games in a TE friendly offense and he's making $7 million. It's not acceptable.

All that being said, him having bad hands and being a little lazy in his route running isn't a new phenomenon. It was said when we signed him by lots of observers that it was an issue for him in Indy. Yet we signed him to a big contract and expected differently. It's an issue of talent evaluation and it's why our last few big FA moves have failed. We see the talents players have, but not their weaknesses and if we do see them we assume they'll be papered over somehow, but when a guy's job is to catch the football and he has trouble catching the football, there's no real good reason to pay him $7 million dollars a year.

and BlackAdder while I agree with you a lot of the time, this idea you have that we're forcing the ball to him is sort of ridiculous. We all know Brees spreads the ball around and throws to the open guy. I don't think Brees or Payton is thinking "Man we better get Fleener the ball this play since he's making a ton of money."

He's essentially the only TE we have right now and he was open a few times. The ball needed to go his way.

 

[Zztop]

Its somewhat comical when you consider the STs unit for this team this year.

1. We ditched both kickers invited to camp and went with a rookie week one.
2. Benched our primary PR and KR after week 1 after a dismal preseason of fumbles.
3. Even our LS Dresher committed a penalty
4. Morestead is a stud still

What a start!

The saints have the most inept, mediocre special teams coach in the nfl

 

[Cjjr72984]

Fleener has another 2 weeks before I go all in on my assumption that he is our next big dead money contract.

Agreed. Not being familiar with the offense is one thing. Dropping key passes when you're being paid all that money is another.