Star Wars 9 rise of sky walker [Spoilers] (2 Viewers)

[Torgo]

I just happened to rewatch it yesterday
Though there are definitely some uneven spots, it’s certainly enjoyable- unless, of course, you’re written your own fanfic and that was not what you wrote

Yet another of the canned responses used to defend the movie from its critics. I won't re-hash my complaints about TLJ. You can find them earlier in this thread. However, I find it interesting that the handbook for defending the movie is basically about attacking those that didn't like it rather than basing their argument on the flick's actual merit.

 

[guidomerkinsrules]

Yet another of the canned responses used to defend the movie from its critics. I won't re-hash my complaints about TLJ. You can find them earlier in this thread. However, I find it interesting that the handbook for defending the movie is basically about attacking those that didn't like it rather than basing their argument on the flick's actual merit.

Incorrect
I said nothing about incels or fanbois

 

[UncleTrvlingJim]

Oh, I think this time we'll come to some sort of mutual understanding on TLJ. I can just feel it.

 

[Taurus]

Oh, I think this time we'll come to some sort of mutual understanding on TLJ. I can just feel it.

There are people who hate Luke Skywalker and love them some Mary-Sue's, TLJ would be right up their alley.

Since it's a subjective opinion, they're certainly entitled to it.

 

[UncleTrvlingJim]

I liked TLJ, but I did have issues with it. I think Sun Wukong highlighted an issue that rings true for me... there are a lot of unearned moments. It feels like this trilogy is rushing the characters along without building up relationships. At the end of TFA, Leia gives Rey a hug while passing by Chewie after Han dies (seriously, what's up with that, Leia just met Rey, why would she go to her instead of her now dead ex-husband's best friend?) Yoda gives a line to Luke about students surpassing their masters - but it certainly never felt like Luke was Rey's master. Rey starts to build some chemistry with Finn and then they're separated for the whole second movie. Poe has some moments with Leia in TLJ that didn't seem to exist in the first movie, which is fine, but it's another character relationship that we have to keep track of, and hasn't had time to build yet. And so on... in the trailer here, 3PO says he wants to have on last look at his friends (which I admit tugs at my heart strings b/c he's talking to us really), did he have any meaningful moments with those characters in the previous two movies?

I feel like a lot of the criticism of the TLJ missed the mark for me b/c I liked the decisions made (to have Rey be nobody, to have Snoke unceremoniously killed, to have a disillusioned Luke who overcomes that and defeats Kylo in the most Jedi way). However, I feel like the trilogy is not developing character relationships deeply enough to make me care about them - which is a shame, b/c I actually like the new big 3. Poe, Finn and Rey are pretty interesting individually and I think the actors are doing a good job.

 

[Torgo]

Incorrect
I said nothing about incels or fanbois

Aren't they the ones who write fanfic?

 

[St. Geezy]

I hated TLJ when I watched it at the theatre, twice. It just felt like a goofy Star Wars parody and did not make sense with the lore.

I will say though that it gets better the more you watch it. In the end however, I fear it will feel like a filler episode once this new movie drops.

My biggest beef with this trilogy overall is it just feels like a random add-on rather than a part of an established connected saga. Events of the past haven’t had enough of an effect on the present as of yet.

 

[guidomerkinsrules]

I liked TLJ, but I did have issues with it. I think Sun Wukong highlighted an issue that rings true for me... there are a lot of unearned moments. It feels like this trilogy is rushing the characters along without building up relationships. At the end of TFA, Leia gives Rey a hug while passing by Chewie after Han dies (seriously, what's up with that, Leia just met Rey, why would she go to her instead of her now dead ex-husband's best friend?) Yoda gives a line to Luke about students surpassing their masters - but it certainly never felt like Luke was Rey's master. Rey starts to build some chemistry with Finn and then they're separated for the whole second movie. Poe has some moments with Leia in TLJ that didn't seem to exist in the first movie, which is fine, but it's another character relationship that we have to keep track of, and hasn't had time to build yet. And so on... in the trailer here, 3PO says he wants to have on last look at his friends (which I admit tugs at my heart strings b/c he's talking to us really), did he have any meaningful moments with those characters in the previous two movies?

I feel like a lot of the criticism of the TLJ missed the mark for me b/c I liked the decisions made (to have Rey be nobody, to have Snoke unceremoniously killed, to have a disillusioned Luke who overcomes that and defeats Kylo in the most Jedi way). However, I feel like the trilogy is not developing character relationships deeply enough to make me care about them - which is a shame, b/c I actually like the new big 3. Poe, Finn and Rey are pretty interesting individually and I think the actors are doing a good job.

yes all of the issues that you highlight are there
but i think it's unfair to single out TL for that criticism - that's something the whole franchise suffers from - almost all big character developments happen off-screen
Luke becomes a bad*** between 5 & 6
anakin's fall is famously not earned/seen
han's hero turn is hidden so he can come in as the cavalry at the end of 4
Qui-gon and obi wan's relationship is 2d - obi wan and anakin is not much better (Clone Wars cartoon does a MUCH better job with character stuff - Anakin/Ahsoka might be the best relationship in the whole canon)

han & leia is the best earned relationship
r2/c3po & han chewie are taken as givens but really work
luke/leia & luke/han? just soso
anakin/padme is famously the worst of the canon and maybe of all time

admiral akhbar, lando, biggs, tarkin, et al, would all suffer if held to the same standard people are applying to TLJ

 

[UncleTrvlingJim]

yes all of the issues that you highlight are there
but i think it's unfair to single out TL for that criticism - that's something the whole franchise suffers from - almost all big character developments happen off-screen
Luke becomes a bad*** between 5 & 6
anakin's fall is famously not earned/seen
han's hero turn is hidden so he can come in as the cavalry at the end of 4
Qui-gon and obi wan's relationship is 2d - obi wan and anakin is not much better (Clone Wars cartoon does a MUCH better job with character stuff - Anakin/Ahsoka might be the best relationship in the whole canon)

han & leia is the best earned relationship
r2/c3po & han chewie are taken as givens but really work
luke/leia & luke/han? just soso
anakin/padme is famously the worst of the canon and maybe of all time

admiral akhbar, lando, biggs, tarkin, et al, would all suffer if held to the same standard people are applying to TLJ

So, I agree with the prequels, but disagree a bit with the originals. The build up of the relationships seemed a bit more natural. There were hints that Han Solo wasn't all that cynical, rescuing a princess and then blowing up the Death Star together was pretty goo bonding. There's a time jump between ANH and ESB that allows you to believe that the friendships have grown, which is shown by Han going after Luke when Luke is stuck out at night on Hoth. There was palpable chemistry between Ford and Fisher in the first one (and since they were having an affair, it's now obvious why), and you can see how it grows between the two movies. And so on.

Also, I was 8 at the time, so I was probably a lot less demanding.

 

[guidomerkinsrules]

that allows you to believe

and this is kinda my point - finn had his identity shattered and left a fascistic regime and latched onto the next person he found -- if you want to believe that's enough justification, you will if you don't you won't

 

[Cage1]

Also, I was 8 at the time, so I was probably a lot less demanding.

I think this right here is the crux of the entire thing. Most of us saw those first movies when we were kids and had never seen anything like it. They became part of the culture and part of what defined us and we largely wrapped our identities around them, forgiving and forgetting the weak points and inconsistencies and associating the best parts with crafting our very childhoods.

And then we demanded the same emotional effect from the newer ones, but through older more cynical eyes and refused (or were unable to) forgive the flaws.

If we were to watch all of these with fresh, adult eyes, I'll bet we'd think they were all just hollow drivel (except the old ones have outdated special effects, so forget them)

 

[Saint_Ward]

After this one, I really do think Space Balls II: The Quest for More Money will be so much more appropriate.

I still hold out hope that I'll like it. I didn't hate the last one.

 

[Jeff Miller]

Didn't hate the trailer, didn't love it, that is probably bad news for Disney as all it does is prolong fan apathy.

I think it was a mistake to go the nostalgia well yet again, instead of showing us hits at a potential good plot moving forward, which if the rumors are to be believed, they don't have one.

Looks like The Mandalorian is going to be far and away a better show to see. More and more its looking like we need to just end this train wreck of a saga, and then take Star Wars into a different direction.

 

[antipop]

I think this right here is the crux of the entire thing. Most of us saw those first movies when we were kids and had never seen anything like it. They became part of the culture and part of what defined us and we largely wrapped our identities around them, forgiving and forgetting the weak points and inconsistencies and associating the best parts with crafting our very childhoods.

And then we demanded the same emotional effect from the newer ones, but through older more cynical eyes and refused (or were unable to) forgive the flaws.

If we were to watch all of these with fresh, adult eyes, I'll bet we'd think they were all just hollow drivel (except the old ones have outdated special effects, so forget them)

i would be curious to see how the original trilogy was received by the average adult at the time....my parents are definitely not Star Wars fans but they took us to see the movies....i don't think they really cared much either way

that also makes me remember my experiences with bringing my son to see movies like Transformers and even watching the SW prequels with him...i enjoyed them much more because he enjoyed them...i tried to watch them through his eyes instead of the eyes of a cynical 30 something

 

[Cage1]

i would be curious to see how the original trilogy was received by the average adult at the time....my parents are definitely not Star Wars fans but they took us to see the movies....i don't think they really cared much either way

that also makes me remember my experiences with bringing my son to see movies like Transformers and even watching the SW prequels with him...i enjoyed them much more because he enjoyed them...i tried to watch them through his eyes instead of the eyes of a cynical 30 something

I'd be more curious to have an adult who generally likes sci-fi, but somehow has never seen any of them, to sit through all of them and give impressions. Of course that unicorn doesn't exist, so we may never know.