Starbucks at it again (2 Viewers)

Optimus Prime

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This has actually happened to me before

Also pre pandemic I'm in a fast food place - place my order and I'm waiting, waiting, waiting

Others (Read: White) placed their orders after me yet get their food before me, and it was like 3 or 4 people

I say something. They say they "forgot" about my order, they make it and I get my food

As I'm sitting down eating (Angrily) the SAME EXACT THING happens to another black guy who comes in

Coincidence????
========================

SAN FRANCISCO (KGO) -- Different treatment because of the color of your skin, that's what a Black San Francisco man said happened to him at a San Jose Starbucks. Now the company is apologizing and retraining staff.

"Come straight up to me points to the door and says I need you outside. And at that moment, man, it's embarrassing. It's irritating. Humiliating. Why me?," said Bryce Ward exclusively to ABC7 News.

Starbucks is now apologizing to Ward after he was told to step outside of the coffee shop on Mckee Road in San Jose while he waited for his order to be made.

He said he remained inside the store after two women left, by his logic the store was no longer at capacity.

Ward provided a receipt to ABC7 News showing he was at the store and made the purchase March 15 at approximately 9:30 a.m.

Ward said a manager told him the store was at capacity per Santa Clara County's COVID restrictions so he had to leave.

He said other customers were allowed into the store and he believes he was targeted because he's Black...............

EXCLUSIVE: Starbucks apologizes to Black San Francisco man over alleged incident of discrimination at San Jose store - ABC7 San Francisco (abc7news.com)


 
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DaveXA

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I haven't had any coffee for just over a year now.
I have, but it's a pot of Community Coffee every morning. Thank goodness the stores stock them here now. For a long CC was impossible to find here unless you went to a specialty store and spend about 50% to twice what they are at the bigger supermarkets here.
 

zatsnzapps

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I have, but it's a pot of Community Coffee every morning. Thank goodness the stores stock them here now. For a long CC was impossible to find here unless you went to a specialty store and spend about 50% to twice what they are at the bigger supermarkets here.
I was drinking 2 1/2 16oz cups of coffee each workday in the morning (so, 5 regular cups) and I just decided to try and quit cold turkey while working from home. I thought that would be a few weeks. Oops. :hihi:

I've decided to try and keep going until I return to the office regularly. It sounds like even when we go back to the office later this year that we'll have the ability to work from home part-time.

I have coffee in the house, so it's there if I want it, but I've been doing pretty well without it.
 

SaintJ

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Optimus...nobody forced you to order an iced, Ristretto, 10 shot, venti, with breve, 5 pump vanilla, 7 pump caramel, 4 Splenda, [and] poured, not shaken
And north side of the vineyard.
 

SaintJ

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The key part of microaggressions is the "micro" part
This is an important part of the discussion that should be had, in a good way. Many of us don't understand unconscious bias, of which you should never feel guilty (it's environmentally installed and behaviorally reinforced.

But we also all have a duty to do a little more "standing in the shoes of the other person" because we don't realize the effects of even largely well-meant behavior. Part of the justice and equality we all deep down want to achieve will require us to undo some of this wiring so many of us have.
 
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This is an important part of the discussion that should be had, in a good way. Many of us don't understand unconscious bias, of which you should never feel guilty (it's environmentally installed and behaviorally reinforced.

But we also all have a duty to do a little more "standing in the shoes of the other person" because we don't realize the effects of even largely well-meant behavior. Part of the justice and equality we all deep down want to achieve will require us to undo some of this wiring so many of us have.
I'll be honest, this is the very first time I've heard or seen anyone state that we should never feel guilty for unconscious bias or microaggression.
 

DaveXA

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This is an important part of the discussion that should be had, in a good way. Many of us don't understand unconscious bias, of which you should never feel guilty (it's environmentally installed and behaviorally reinforced.

But we also all have a duty to do a little more "standing in the shoes of the other person" because we don't realize the effects of even largely well-meant behavior. Part of the justice and equality we all deep down want to achieve will require us to undo some of this wiring so many of us have.
What are some examples of microagression? I'm just trying to picture what that looks like.
 
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By us, viewing the story? The only thing I've seen so far in this thread are people doing the opposite. No one here has said it's probably racism.

For the person making the claim? Please see my first comment.
You seemed to be speaking in general terms & not specifically about this story, but yes, it could also apply to this story. You said that it was naive of us to think that black people can't tell the difference between being forgotten about and being discriminated against and I have to disagree. I think it's naive to think that black people don't sometimes confuse the two. I also think that there are some that apply racism without a second thought or much consideration at all. But I don't see that as a black thing, I see it as a human thing. We all sometimes feel personally slighted when something like that happens. Not every time, but it does happen. Having worked in a repair service department for a number of years, I used to see it on almost a daily basis from both sides of the counter and all it usually took to diffuse a situation was a little bit of understanding & compassion. So when I ask, do you think it's unfair to assume racism when it's not overt, that's not meant to be an accusation that everyone is just going around accusing people of racism, but being black and when slighted and when you feel it's personal even when there is no overt evidence, then is racism the first assumption and do you think that's fair?
 
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What are some examples of microagression? I'm just trying to picture what that looks like.
I was thinking of posting something about this yesterday. When I was a kid, I was always a bit smaller than most of my friends. A lot of them were a bit older as well. Being the smaller guy I grew up with a little bit of a chip on my shoulder, so I always felt like I could never back down from anyone or let anyone push me around or it would continue to happen all my life. One day in high school I started noticing a trend. Every time one of my friends were telling a story or showing an example, they would always turn to me as their prop. I knew it was subconscious, but I felt like me being the smaller guy had to play into it. That's a microaggression. But different than how we handle things today, I handled it myself and started to tell them I wasn't their prop and to use someone else, so it wasn't long before they quit.
 

DaveXA

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I was thinking of posting something about this yesterday. When I was a kid, I was always a bit smaller than most of my friends. A lot of them were a bit older as well. Being the smaller guy I grew up with a little bit of a chip on my shoulder, so I always felt like I could never back down from anyone or let anyone push me around or it would continue to happen all my life. One day in high school I started noticing a trend. Every time one of my friends were telling a story or showing an example, they would always turn to me as their prop. I knew it was subconscious, but I felt like me being the smaller guy had to play into it. That's a microaggression. But different than how we handle things today, I handled it myself and started to tell them I wasn't their prop and to use someone else, so it wasn't long before they quit.
So, kinda like when @zeetes gets ribbed about his, ahem, stature? :hihi:
 

livefromDC

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You seemed to be speaking in general terms & not specifically about this story, but yes, it could also apply to this story. You said that it was naive of us to think that black people can't tell the difference between being forgotten about and being discriminated against and I have to disagree. I think it's naive to think that black people don't sometimes confuse the two. I also think that there are some that apply racism without a second thought or much consideration at all. But I don't see that as a black thing, I see it as a human thing. We all sometimes feel personally slighted when something like that happens. Not every time, but it does happen. Having worked in a repair service department for a number of years, I used to see it on almost a daily basis from both sides of the counter and all it usually took to diffuse a situation was a little bit of understanding & compassion. So when I ask, do you think it's unfair to assume racism when it's not overt, that's not meant to be an accusation that everyone is just going around accusing people of racism, but being black and when slighted and when you feel it's personal even when there is no overt evidence, then is racism the first assumption and do you think that's fair?
A think a white guy assuming to know how black people should feel or approach possible racism is unfair. Your question, "is it unfair to assume racism if it isn't overt" gives the impression that racism that isn't overt is less common than overt racism. I would contend that the most common type of racism people encounter today is more discreet. So why would it be unfair to assume racism if it isn't overt?

Do you think overt racism is still more prevalent than discreet forms of it?
 
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So, kinda like when @zeetes gets ribbed about his, ahem, stature? :hihi:
I think it's a bit different than good-natured ribbing, but I do think that's something that's ingrained in our subconscious as well, to belittle our competitors in order to raise us in the pecking order as the alpha in the group.
 

DaveXA

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I think it's a bit different than good-natured ribbing, but I do think that's something that's ingrained in our subconscious as well, to belittle our competitors in order to raise us in the pecking order as the alpha in the group.
I think it depends on motives. If we're doing it in good fun and we "get" each other, it's fine. If it's done with the intent of being mean, or to make one self feel better, then it's not a good thing.

Of course, zeetes knows what's up. :9:
 

livefromDC

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I was thinking of posting something about this yesterday. When I was a kid, I was always a bit smaller than most of my friends. A lot of them were a bit older as well. Being the smaller guy I grew up with a little bit of a chip on my shoulder, so I always felt like I could never back down from anyone or let anyone push me around or it would continue to happen all my life. One day in high school I started noticing a trend. Every time one of my friends were telling a story or showing an example, they would always turn to me as their prop. I knew it was subconscious, but I felt like me being the smaller guy had to play into it. That's a microaggression. But different than how we handle things today, I handled it myself and started to tell them I wasn't their prop and to use someone else, so it wasn't long before they quit.
I think this is a good example of the form biases can take when discussing racism too. I don't think all police set out to treat Black people differently or people who greet everyone in the office by saying "Good morning" know or even realize what they're doing when they greet the black people in the office by saying "what's up, Girl!" or "What up, bro!" (https://www.blackenterprise.com/27-things-white-people-never-ever-say-black-co-workers/)

Malicious intent doesn't have to be present as your story indicates. But if you never address it, how do discussions take place? I think the correct answer is to have the discussion of the person's feelings and not try to explain why it could not be what the person is feeling. In your situation, your feelings were still important even if your friends intentions weren't malicious.
 
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