Starbucks at it again (1 Viewer)

Optimus Prime

Subscribing Member
VIP Subscribing Member
VIP Contributor
Joined
Jul 18, 1998
Messages
8,435
Reaction score
9,217
Offline
Sticky Post
This has actually happened to me before

Also pre pandemic I'm in a fast food place - place my order and I'm waiting, waiting, waiting

Others (Read: White) placed their orders after me yet get their food before me, and it was like 3 or 4 people

I say something. They say they "forgot" about my order, they make it and I get my food

As I'm sitting down eating (Angrily) the SAME EXACT THING happens to another black guy who comes in

Coincidence????
========================

SAN FRANCISCO (KGO) -- Different treatment because of the color of your skin, that's what a Black San Francisco man said happened to him at a San Jose Starbucks. Now the company is apologizing and retraining staff.

"Come straight up to me points to the door and says I need you outside. And at that moment, man, it's embarrassing. It's irritating. Humiliating. Why me?," said Bryce Ward exclusively to ABC7 News.

Starbucks is now apologizing to Ward after he was told to step outside of the coffee shop on Mckee Road in San Jose while he waited for his order to be made.

He said he remained inside the store after two women left, by his logic the store was no longer at capacity.

Ward provided a receipt to ABC7 News showing he was at the store and made the purchase March 15 at approximately 9:30 a.m.

Ward said a manager told him the store was at capacity per Santa Clara County's COVID restrictions so he had to leave.

He said other customers were allowed into the store and he believes he was targeted because he's Black...............

EXCLUSIVE: Starbucks apologizes to Black San Francisco man over alleged incident of discrimination at San Jose store - ABC7 San Francisco (abc7news.com)


 
Last edited:

livefromDC

Subscribing Member
VIP Subscribing Member
Joined
May 12, 2006
Messages
10,052
Reaction score
17,176
Age
42
Location
Atlanta, GA
Offline
I think it depends on motives. If we're doing it in good fun and we "get" each other, it's fine. If it's done with the intent of being mean, or to make one self feel better, then it's not a good thing.

Of course, zeetes knows what's up. :9:
I disagree. Motives alone cant be used. I think it depends on how the other person feels about it. If it's done in good fun and the other person doesn't like it, it's still not okay.
 
Joined
Jun 2, 2004
Messages
4,366
Reaction score
4,496
Location
Ocean Springs, Ms
Offline
A think a white guy assuming to know how black people should feel or approach possible racism is unfair. Your question, "is it unfair to assume racism if it isn't overt" gives the impression that racism that isn't overt is less common than overt racism. I would contend that the most common type of racism people encounter today is more discreet. So why would it be unfair to assume racism if it isn't overt?

Do you think overt racism is still more prevalent than discreet forms of it?
I'm not assuming what anyone should feel, I'm literally asking you what you feel and what you think about it. I'm looking at it from a perspective of common human emotion that we all have and asking you, as a black person, if that common emotion inherently triggers thoughts of racism when dealing with a white person and asking you if you think that's fair. Your answer is yes, you think that it's fair to assume that someone is being racist even if it's not being openly displayed. So then, would you also agree that it's fair for me, as a white person having a disagreement with a black person, to feel like that black person thinks that I am racially motivated in the disagreement?
 

DaveXA

I love the Lord!
Staff member
Super Moderator
Joined
Sep 6, 2001
Messages
35,683
Reaction score
23,757
Age
50
Location
Vienna, VA via Lafayette
Offline
I disagree. Motives alone cant be used. I think it depends on how the other person feels about it. If it's done in good fun and the other person doesn't like it, it's still not okay.
Of course, I'm talking about both sides having the same understanding. If the other person doesn't like it, of course it's wrong. I thought that was obvious.

When I say in good fun, it means fun for both. I even said "if we 'get' each other" in my post.
 

tomwaits

Frontier Psychiatrist
Joined
Aug 1, 2002
Messages
16,337
Reaction score
6,230
Age
45
Location
Pflugerville, TX
Offline
I wonder if microaggressions will still be a complaint after the economy crashes.

Yemenis: My child died from malnutrition and cholera due to Saudi/US embargos and bombing.
Americans: These microaggressions are a crime against humanity!
 
Joined
Jun 2, 2004
Messages
4,366
Reaction score
4,496
Location
Ocean Springs, Ms
Offline
I think this is a good example of the form biases can take when discussing racism too. I don't think all police set out to treat Black people differently or people who greet everyone in the office by saying "Good morning" know or even realize what they're doing when they greet the black people in the office by saying "what's up, Girl!" or "What up, bro!" (https://www.blackenterprise.com/27-things-white-people-never-ever-say-black-co-workers/)

Malicious intent doesn't have to be present as your story indicates. But if you never address it, how do discussions take place? I think the correct answer is to have the discussion of the person's feelings and not try to explain why it could not be what the person is feeling. In your situation, your feelings were still important even if your friends intentions weren't malicious.
LOL, then I would be super-offensive because I call people "brother" and say "what's up" all the time to everyone, I've even said the occasional "what up." but that's a cultural thing. Growing up in the 80's, into break-dancing and early rap, most of the people my age that I know uses that sort of jargon. So, would that be considered cultural appropriation now & not acceptable?
 
Joined
Jun 2, 2004
Messages
4,366
Reaction score
4,496
Location
Ocean Springs, Ms
Offline
I wonder if microaggressions will still be a complaint after the economy crashes.

Yemenis: My child died from malnutrition and cholera due to Saudi/US embargos and bombing.
Americans: These microaggressions are a crime against humanity!
It certainly is a big distraction.
 

DaveXA

I love the Lord!
Staff member
Super Moderator
Joined
Sep 6, 2001
Messages
35,683
Reaction score
23,757
Age
50
Location
Vienna, VA via Lafayette
Offline
LOL, then I would be super-offensive because I call people "brother" and say "what's up" all the time to everyone, I've even said the occasional "what up." but that's a cultural thing. Growing up in the 80's, into break-dancing and early rap, most of the people my age that I know uses that sort of jargon. So, would that be considered cultural appropriation now & not acceptable?
Breakdancing is about the only dancing I ever learned. :hihi:
 

livefromDC

Subscribing Member
VIP Subscribing Member
Joined
May 12, 2006
Messages
10,052
Reaction score
17,176
Age
42
Location
Atlanta, GA
Offline
I'm not assuming what anyone should feel, I'm literally asking you what you feel and what you think about it. I'm looking at it from a perspective of common human emotion that we all have and asking you, as a black person, if that common emotion inherently triggers thoughts of racism when dealing with a white person and asking you if you think that's fair. Your answer is yes, you think that it's fair to assume that someone is being racist even if it's not being openly displayed. So then, would you also agree that it's fair for me, as a white person having a disagreement with a black person, to feel like that black person thinks that I am racially motivated in the disagreement?
There's a lot of assumptions being made here. I don't think we all share a perspective of common human emotion because we're all different and shaped by our own experiences. And again, I don't think it's fair for white person to assume to know if a black person's accusation of racism stems from an inability to distinguish between a feeling of mistreatment because of racial prejudice or simply a misunderstanding.

And in regard to this, "Your answer is yes, you think that it's fair to assume that someone is being racist even if it's not being openly displayed." I said no such thing. I said it's naïve for us as bystanders to assume the person can't make the determination for themselves. I haven't said whether I feel their feeling is wrong or not, because I wouldn't know.

Now could you please answer my question. Do you think overt racism is still more prevalent than discreet forms of it?
 
OP
Optimus Prime

Optimus Prime

Subscribing Member
VIP Subscribing Member
VIP Contributor
Joined
Jul 18, 1998
Messages
8,435
Reaction score
9,217
Offline
Now could you please answer my question. Do you think overt racism is still more prevalent than discreet forms of it?
I'd compare it to gun violence in a way - the assault rifle mass shootings are the big 'flashy' overt violence that dominates the media's attention but it's the smaller 'discreet' handgun shooting that make up the lion's share
 
Joined
Jun 2, 2004
Messages
4,366
Reaction score
4,496
Location
Ocean Springs, Ms
Offline
There's a lot of assumptions being made here. I don't think we all share a perspective of common human emotion because we're all different and shaped by our own experiences.
Again, I have to disagree somewhat. Yes, we all have different experiences, but the experiences are what triggers the emotions. The emotions themselves are base feelings that every human has.

And again, I don't think it's fair for white person to assume to know if a black person's accusation of racism stems from an inability to distinguish between a feeling of mistreatment because of racial prejudice or simply a misunderstanding.
Maybe I wasn't clear when I tried to explain that there are times when everyone has a disagreement with someone that they feel like it is personal, even when there is no overt display. As I was saying, having worked in a service repair shop, I often saw this happening, both from customers & employees and tuned myself to try to empathize with a person and it often worked wonders in customer interactions. Sometimes people were just aholes and you just had to take it. So, I felt like it was a fair question to ask that when a black person has that same feeling that I do of a disagreement being personal, if racism always comes to mind.
And in regard to this, "Your answer is yes, you think that it's fair to assume that someone is being racist even if it's not being openly displayed." I said no such thing. I said it's naïve for us as bystanders to assume the person can't make the determination for themselves. I haven't said whether I feel their feeling is wrong or not, because I wouldn't know.
Sorry, I took this as a yes:
So why would it be unfair to assume racism if it isn't overt?
Now could you please answer my question. Do you think overt racism is still more prevalent than discreet forms of it?
Sorry, I missed the question before. No, I don't think that at all & I don't think that I implied that. But what I do think is that sometimes racism gets injected into discussions or arguments over assumptions. Do I think that's fair? I honestly don't know and being white, it's probably not my place to decide. All I know is that it can hinder resolution of an issue and that being on the receiving end of that accusation feels unfair.
 

St. Widge

Socially Distant
VIP Contributor
Joined
Mar 14, 2002
Messages
37,751
Reaction score
21,617
Age
49
Location
4th Ward Soldier
Offline
I was drinking 2 1/2 16oz cups of coffee each workday in the morning (so, 5 regular cups) and I just decided to try and quit cold turkey while working from home. I thought that would be a few weeks. Oops. :hihi:

I've decided to try and keep going until I return to the office regularly. It sounds like even when we go back to the office later this year that we'll have the ability to work from home part-time.

I have coffee in the house, so it's there if I want it, but I've been doing pretty well without it.
So, are you just injecting caffeine in your veins instead?

Seriously, I don't think I could do without a bunch of caffeine in the morning. I'm not a morning person and without the caffeine, I don't think I could function.
 

DaveXA

I love the Lord!
Staff member
Super Moderator
Joined
Sep 6, 2001
Messages
35,683
Reaction score
23,757
Age
50
Location
Vienna, VA via Lafayette
Offline
So, are you just injecting caffeine in your veins instead?

Seriously, I don't think I could do without a bunch of caffeine in the morning. I'm not a morning person and without the caffeine, I don't think I could function.
Yeah, for me, coffee is more a comfort thing than anything else. I probably could do without it, but I just enjoy the routine of making a pot and starting the day with a piping hot cup of coffee.
 

livefromDC

Subscribing Member
VIP Subscribing Member
Joined
May 12, 2006
Messages
10,052
Reaction score
17,176
Age
42
Location
Atlanta, GA
Offline
Sorry, I missed the question before. No, I don't think that at all & I don't think that I implied that. But what I do think is that sometimes racism gets injected into discussions or arguments over assumptions. Do I think that's fair? I honestly don't know and being white, it's probably not my place to decide.
That's all that I'm saying.

All I know is that it can hinder resolution of an issue and that being on the receiving end of that accusation feels unfair.
Very true on all parts! It's not a comfortable conversation. Your friends, being your friends and not intending to hurt your feelings, could have felt like this but it's no doubt a conversation that had to be had. "You're overeacting" or "you're taking this too seriously" or "everyone gets their turn" are all comments that, purposely or not, are meant to invalidate your concern.

I think these conversations, while uncomfortable, can be more easily had if we start from the standpoint that the person raising the concern did so because he/she thinks he/she has a real concern instead of meeting it with comments that seemingly invalidate the person's point of view. Then in turn, when the other side responds, the same "courtesy" (for lack of a better term) should be extended.
 

St. Widge

Socially Distant
VIP Contributor
Joined
Mar 14, 2002
Messages
37,751
Reaction score
21,617
Age
49
Location
4th Ward Soldier
Offline
I think this is a good example of the form biases can take when discussing racism too. I don't think all police set out to treat Black people differently or people who greet everyone in the office by saying "Good morning" know or even realize what they're doing when they greet the black people in the office by saying "what's up, Girl!" or "What up, bro!" (https://www.blackenterprise.com/27-things-white-people-never-ever-say-black-co-workers/)

Malicious intent doesn't have to be present as your story indicates. But if you never address it, how do discussions take place? I think the correct answer is to have the discussion of the person's feelings and not try to explain why it could not be what the person is feeling. In your situation, your feelings were still important even if your friends intentions weren't malicious.
These are all great points. And I think it's important to realize that most white people don't notice that they do these things or that these things go on. I think it helps greatly when white people can have a frank discussion about these things with black people so that they can understand. Unfortunately, many either don't have that opportunity or won't take that opportunity. And, frankly, it's a hard conversation to start and have for both black and white people. And, it probably works best if white people just listen to what black people have to say about it and keep our mouth shut until we do understand and notice these things.
 

Create an account or login to comment

You must be a member in order to leave a comment

Create account

Create an account on our community. It's easy!

Log in

Already have an account? Log in here.

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 1)

 

New Orleans Saints Twitter Feed

 

Headlines

Top Bottom